menoari

they were feasting on some catered food, drinking, having a good time and laughing at the fact that the promotion is going according to plan. LOL. I actually can picture that scene.

Just wanted to add - GOAT discussion has always been A) very subjective and B) needing to have perspective. BennyST lays out what he thinks Pac (but could be replaced by any GOAT discussion eligible fighter) should do to get to certain positions in the GOAT list but here is the thing, everyone has different ideas of where any particular figher is right now and what he needs to do to move up in the list. Each and every fighter has different circumstances one of the biggest of which is standard of competition. What is more GOAT worthy - a dominant fighter in an era of diluted competition or a marginally better fighter in an era of many good fighters?

The silence to TS challenge can be due to the lack of such threads or the lack of motivation for some to find such posts. Either way, very interesting for their implications. Pretty obvious if there are no such threads but in the other possibility, could it be because few people really get motivated by having to prove their "innocence" against accusations?

For the poll, I think Pac is clean. There are around 5 posters "accusing" Pac and around 5x that trying to defend him. To everyone accusing Pac, is this what it has come to? Usually the critics of Pac diminish his accomplishments by downplaying his opposition (ODLH shot, next guy weight drained, etc.) by now using this PED argument, then is that admitting that the accomplishments were actually too good that it just has to be PED? Wouldn't this diminish a win by Floyd over Pac also? To the people who are defending Pac, I remind you that there will always be critics anyway, you can't convince everyone. On the lighter side, the exchanges here are way amusing! Go NSB!

guys wait till we hear from the mayweather camp,I cant believe all these people who are taking what arum says as gospel,this is the same camp that made pac look guilty with ridiculas excuse's... By the way im more than happy with the proposal along as random urine test;s its more than enough to ensure no ped's are used..... read up before posting lads im a big floyd fan but a realist its more than sufficient.....I think there is more to it than this bcoz if this is the only reason the fight would bwe signed by now.ive no doubt about that..... As a Pac fan, I agree with this. A reasonable Floyd fan, props to you sir. IMO, we should wait for some of the smoke to clear, these negotiations have turned every which way already, it's just fair to hear what Team Floyd has to say about it.

CALDEROWNZ, The keyword in your point is "Priniciple"(and we're on the same page on this one). But, what is puzzling to me, and made me question about PAC is his responses to this type of drug-testing ie I had a nightmare as a child, it might hamper my performance(he knows his body more than anybody else), why doesn't he just flat-out say that this is not a matter of not wanting to take this type of drug test and just say that it's base out of principle ? IMO Pac was and still is ok with additional test, he may have been confused, misinformed or just plain assumed that the additional test/s would incorporate his condition of no blood being drawn "near" fight time (everyone seems to have different opinions on what "near" means). We might not agree with Pac's reasons for not wanting blood drawn around fight time but the fact remains that he is perfectly entitled to have that belief and act accordingly. When the condition mentioned above became the equivalent of an iceberg sinking this "titanic" fight, IMO he got pissed with the fact that despite his agreement to additional testing his one condition to the blood testing was being spun around as some sign of guilt for taking PEDs. The rest is history and continues to unfold... I presume that the issue going around is real and not some innovative PR strategy for the fight ...

Interesting article. Conte identifies EPO as the most "advantageous" PED for boxers (for training and for the later rounds of a boxing match) when most PEDs mentioned around here are steroids and HGH. Kinda shocked that any boxer will even go near Conte now ("recently" mentioned in the article) and that Marion Jones and Tim Montgomery beat USADA testing before. I root for Pac in this fight but I want the fight to happen first and foremost. It appears that Conte is commenting on the news that Arum wants a test at the presser and the after the fight, that is why he stresses the need for random unannounced testing. I recently saw the news conference of Pac himself stating that he does not want to give blood (but urine ok, I am not too sure now) on the day of the fight. If Pac is ok with random and unannounced testing up to the day of the fight and any test starting from the end of the fight, wouldn't that be good enough? I presume we all want to see the fight ... BTW, I kinda suspect that this whole issue may just be PR for a fight that will actually still take place

Onepunch, you were impressive with the first post, mentioning necessary elements of slander, but you messed up by posting this --- "For me, the irony here is that the undisputed KING of unreasonable demands (Pac), like making a defending champion come in 2 pounds under the weight limit, and limiting the amount of rehydration that DLH could do, is acting all offended that a potentially unreasonable request is being made of him. What goes around.........lol" I doubt the bolded part to be true and at the very least that kind of provision would never become legal in a boxing contract. Finally, it is also possible that the legal action to be pursued, if ever, may not even be slander or defamation, such as a tort case, where the burden of proof, required evidence, etc. would just be different.

Obviously I cannot name my source, but I can tell you that it is someone who would know that information without question. But since I will not name the source, people are free to dismiss it. It really isn't relevant to this debate though........ It's cool bro. Legal knowledge and an unnameable source of inside info? Can't argue with that. I just want to see the fight TBH, not really interested in the finer legal aspects of this issue.

When Pacuiao Loses OMFG, the whole county of the Philippians. will be on suicide watch !!! :dunno: totally uncalled for ... trashing a country you can't even spell correctly? Lame. While you have every right to carry an opinion about your fighter winning, any other person with an opposing opinion should also have the very same right to theirs. You invite people to your show to share their variety of opinions when you come across this biased? Good luck with that and god help you if Floyd loses.

dude why are u getting mad? relax, talking shit is apart of being a fan. I swear some of you pacquiao fans are sensitive as hell. it isn't about who I or you root for. The thread was pretty civil talking about the impact of the fight but you gotta come in with your rah rah antics. I mentioned your show cause that is what you portray it to be, open discussion about boxing and I am pointing out that you are not the most credible person to host that kind of show.

Good post Lefty. I have been saying since the whole testing issue came up that it just feels like a PR move to hype the fight. I thought it would still push through in March but you have been able to even justify a postponment to a later date, lol. All this could be true. What I do doubt is that the whole thing was planned this way from day 1, if what you posted does come true, certain parts of this was most probably planned belatedly or worse, just stumbled upon. The danger here is if any of the tune up fights, for either fighter, turns into a loss, a winning but sloppy performance or an injury. If that happens, then the rescheduled fight will not be as big a fight as we are currently expecting, at the very least.

Honestly that to me wont happen with FMK fighting Matt Hatton and Pacquiao going up against Pauile potentionally at 147 or the infamous 143 mark I cannot see Paulie hurting PAC. might turn into a Sturm vs oscar fight where Paulie gives Pac a boxing lesson though. But truth be told Paulie hjust doesn't have anough in his right hand to do so. I think the two pre fight fight opponents chose by both sides fit the bill perfectly. Matt Hatt a somewhat GBP fighter picked as a favor to Ricky. Both Ricky GBP and MP get a piece of that pie. Mat gets a big pay day. Also Paulie running his mouth promoted by DiBella who is in bed with MP and Al Haymon as DiBella also promotes Berto. Some casual fans do not know all this so to them they don't see any connection to MP on either side. It is all set up to lead to the big dance and also put money in the pockets of the partners and other promoters in the meantime. Remember the best thing a fighter can ever do for anotehr fighter is give them a fight or fight each other. In the end Paulie makes $$$ DiBella makes Money, GBP makes money, TOP RANK makes money and Mayweather prmotions makes money. Even the fight between Berto and Mosley has Mayweather's hands in it some way. GBp MP and Dibella all involed to some extent.....Lefty As a business deal, what you wrote makes too much sense (as in dollars and cents too!). If these guys, GBP, MP, TR etc. actually thought this out my props to them. Additionally, this also means that we as fight fans don't stand a chance against these people who will take our money, when, where and how much they want to by "managing" fights. Makes me want to stop watching boxing, lol.

I don't understand one thing. Arum says they want commision to handle this... But he is willing to have as many urine tests as needed. Isn't this something commsion should also decide? He want's commision to decide on blood tests, but not on frequency of urine tests? Something commsion should take care also, if he want's this thing run by commision. Good point about the different levels of acceptability between blood and urine test for Pac. By itself, it could still be argued that the difference lies in what blood and urine test can and cannot show or prove. As I remember the issue evolving, it has been pretty consistently stated by team Pac that urine tests would be available as much and as often as wanted by Team Floyd. The sticking point has always been the blood testing. Make it out as you wish ... IMO I kinda agree with Tua that this could still be a massive and unorthodox PR campaign for the Pac - Floyd fight. Infinetely better than Pac - Paulie.

they could still fight. However, Freddie Roach claimed that they would not go through with the fight if Mayweather came in over the limit. The point is asking for a penalty like that is as outrageous as Mayweather asking for random blood tests, but none of the Pac worshippers on this site had anything negative to say about that stipulation. Thanks for the answer, looking back, that was a major brain freeze on my part. They can still fight but it couldn't be for the ABC title at welterweight. So the overweight penalty only serves to ensure a welterweight fight between the boxers in this case (unless someone wants to pay the penalty for a weight advantage). Got it, carry on then ...

Let's see at 135 it was Diaz, not the highest rated champ; At 140 it was Hatton, arguably the best, never beaten at that weight, coming of a Malinaggi win At 147 it was Cotto, who did beat Shane, was a titleholder and came of a win from Clottey So as title fights go, I don't really think you can say Pac is avoiding one of the alphabet titles or the strongest fighter either. If you go on hindsight now, then it is easier to say that there may have been more challenging fighters for Pac then, but at the time Hatton and Cotto were generally considered legit.

More rigorous testing for PEDs will be good for the sport. Natas has mentioned some obstacles and issues to actually implementing one for boxing. The devil is in the details, who gets tested? when do they have to undergo testing? and the ultimate - who foots the bill?

His honor, pride and dignity didn't stop him from asking Cotto to come down to 145 pounds to fight for Cotto's championship. It also didn't stop him from demanding a $10 million penalty for every pound over the limit in the Mayweather fight. And it didn't stop him from cheating on his wife. The only time honor, pride and dignity has been an issue in the last few years is when Mayweather asked him to take random blood tests to make sure both are clean. Excuse me for being off topic, just had to ask this one thing. the bolded part is always mentioned, isn't the fight at welterweight? if anyone comes in over the limit, can they still fight? over the limit = one boxer not being a welterweight.

Good thread. I root for Pac and I think this fight will be hard for him too. Why does Pac have a chance? I see a better right hand and a better chin on Pac than he had against JMM. Floyd is a faster and probably more accurate counterpuncher than JMM. With the JMM fight, I saw JMM sitting on Pac's left hand then countering with flurries. I don't think Floyd can ignore the right in March and that will make it tougher to counter Pac. Additionally, Floyd usually counters with 1 or 2 punches lately, that may not stop Pac from continuing to attack especially since he showed a better chin against Cotto, who probably has more power than Floyd. Neither fighter has fought anyone very similar to the other and since Floyd, as a counterpuncher, would probably need some time to get an actual "feel" for the speed and angles of Pac's attack, this gives Pac an advantage at the start of the fight. We have already seen what Pac can do in a short period of time at the start of a fight, not to say that is what will necessarily happen here. I'm also kinda leaning to the stat of "most connected unseen punches" as the difference in this fight. Both fighters have the ability to deliver these.

Floyd didn't fight Marquez for a tune up or even because he called him out. It was a strategic move. he fought Marquez because besides FMJ JMM was the second biggest money fight out there for PAC. PAC could have used that as a bargaining chip and maybe went with a fight aganst JMM would have sold decent PPV numbers and sold out an arena too boot. FMJ took out JMM by fighting him and beating him handily all the cries of PAC vs JMM IIII are gone. Anyone even mention that? The only thing I have heard is FMJ, PAC and SSM being thrown around...Let me pose another question to all Stylistically who is the closest to PAc a previous opponent the FMJ has fought? Remember the closest no one out there is like PAC.... On the flipside Stylistically who is the closest to Floyd a previous opponent the pac has fought? Remember the closest no one out there is like fLOYD....lEFTY Props to your thread! A good deal of decent discussions. Interesting question, first of all I agree that there neither fighter has seen a previous opponent very similar to the one that they will be facing in March. For Pac, it probably is JMM that is "similar" to Floyd. (although some aspects of Morales come to mind too) I think part of the problem is I am not sure which version of Floyd comes in ( more active pre welterweight Floyd or more defensive post welterweight Floyd ) For Floyd, I can't really say who is "similar" to Pac, Judah and Corley (?) are mostly mentioned but I think that is due to being southpaw fighters like Pac and not much else. Pac's "awkwardness" really makes him different IMO.

Does anyone see Pacquiao fighting a different type of fight. In what scenario do you see pacquiao winning the fight fellas?....Lefty Just my own idea but I would like to see Pac come out aggressive, considering a defensive counterpuncher naturally begins without an actual "feel" of the speed and angles of an attacking fighter. Best chance of taking a lead, flash KD or KO. If Pac gets a lead he has a better chance of dictating tempo later in the fight if Floyd is behind on the cards (Floyd needing to make up a lead will prevent him from getting on his bike and defensive). If the opening rounds end with Floyd ahead and Floyd already able to properly time Pac, Floyd can make it a defensive fight, giving Pac less chances to successfully attack him. Both of them will be in great shape and save for the surprise punch for KD or KO will require a lot of accumulated damage to start gassing in late rounds.

I see a sim between JMM and FMJ as they are both great counter punchers. but to me JMM is much more hittable than Floyd. Floyds hand speed is light years beyond what JMM can do. But stylistically as a counter puncher yes as far and standing toe to toe JMM will fight back and open up much more. I agree with you as too which is bolded. I think Floyd with his shell and sholuder roll will be the one we see on fight night. if it is the other Floyd Manny is much more live in the fight and we as fans are going to see a more exciting match up. I would put Judah in there as a possible stylistic comparision to Manny in the fact that he is a south paw with extremely great speed and power. The only thing is Manny can bang in there for 12 rounds and Judah has issues going past 4. Thsi to me is a mental blockage in which Judah can't get past and doesn't believe in training hard enough for fights..Good post my man...Lefty I also suspect it is the more defensive Floyd coming for Pac. If that is the presumption, I have two things to say then. As a fan, I will expect a more technical (boring to some) fight, granted with Pac being the other guy there will be fireworks one way or the other but not as much if it were the other version of Floyd. The other is that Pac may be better off worrying about single or double counters instead of aggressive counter flurries from a defense oriented Floyd. I say this conceding that Floyd is faster and more accurate than JMM counterpunching. IMO it was the counter flurries of JMM that messed up Pac's rhythm in their fights along with the ability of JMM to sit on Pac's left hand. While Floyd may be a better counterpuncher, Pac now has a better right hand making him more difficult to counter punch and his ability to absorb heavy hits may allow him to accept some punishment in order to find openings for his own attacks. Finally, I keep thinking of the saying that the punches you don't see are the one that really hurt you. Clearly, both fighters have the capacity to inflict such punches so I will be waiting to see who connects with more of those kind of punches. This I think is the true question in this fight who can land the punches that the other does not see coming.

If Pac gets up by 4 clear rounds, wouldn't it be ironic if he got on his bike and have Floyd try to engage him? I bet a lot of people would get a kick out of that although I don't think Pac would ever do that. It might even be genetically impossible, but still, you can imagine right? If Floyd still has the capacity to go offensively like he did in his lighter and younger days then those exchanges with Pac would definetely be great.

If you see Pac winning the early rounds and Floyd adjusting in the mid to later rounds, how do you see Floyd boxing in those mid to later rounds? It appears that you imply Floyd will be aggressively looking to counter an equally aggressive Pac hence the importance of speed and counterpunching accuracy. That sounds like the JMM fights. While Floyd is probably a better and faster counterpuncher than JMM, Pac now also sports a better right hand IMO compared to his JMM fights. Wouldn't this make Pac harder to successfully counter even by a faster and better counterpuncher? Additionally, Pac recently showed he could take Cotto's punches. This may now mean that while Floyd can hit him, Pac can sacrifice the hit to gain an opening for his own punches. Floyd can win this fight no doubt (never saw a mega fight where one guy has absolutely no chance to win) but I think that the actual winner here will surprise us by doing things that he hasn't done or done too well in the past. It will take that kind of difference to win.

Congressional term begins on 30 June (3 year term). Pac, presuming he wins, will be one of 200+ congressmen. He could continue boxing even in office, similar things have been done before. If he fights while holding office, the lower house may just move sessions to the fight venue and legislate from there, considering so many of them make the trip anyway to watch his fights now, LOL. On a side note, it may be hard for someone to explain the dynamics of Philippine politics to someone who has not actually experienced it, just know that seeking district congressional office is usually a very long and complex undertaking, more so for a political neophyte like Pac who is challenging an experienced, entrenched and financially capable opponent.

Pac is a demi-god in the Philippines, true. The reason for his poor showing in elections are; 1. Some people differentiate his ability to box from his ability to be an effective politician (small minority IMO) and 2. Pac keeps running in after congressional seats in local districts where there are entrenched local "political warlords" who have experience and machinery to win even over a popular national icon like Pac. Ironically, Pac would be better off running for positions that have a national electoral base.

Floyd is great in the ring, I have no problem saying that. Pac is at least competitive in the same department IMO. But to see ODLH winning "some of the earlier rounds" can only be justified by your screen name! That ODLH Pac fight was pretty one-sided as it gets. With regards to how the fight ended, you are correct in saying that ODLH corner stopped the fight but if you watch the fight again you might see that Oscar was likely agreeing with that decision of his corner.

That is all. Umm, sarcasm is pretty effective when you use it to reply to other replies, doesn't quite work as a title of a thread or to start a thread. You were being sarcastic right? I mean God knows you couldn't have been serious...

odds aren't all that great. I think they have it like around floyd -150, and pac + 110 or something. Hopefully the line moves some more. the last I heard odds were worse, +120 pac and -180 floyd. Looks like we are heading for even money or even advantage floyd. If floyd goes +, I will look for some action, best possible scenario for me, root for pac and if he wins my wallet smiles too.

I wouldn't rule out Pac fighting Shane even if Pac wins in the elections. Pac has always maintained in interviews with local news outlets that he will continue to fight even if he becomes a congressman. Other athlete politicians have kept day jobs while in office, no reason Pac can't do the same.