For those of you using UFC PPV salaries as a measuring stick...just stop.
The $400K UFC champ Aldo got for headlining a PPV vs McGregor was his MINIMUM guarantee. That's what he gets paid just for stepping in the ring as far as the Nevada State Athletic Commission is concerned. Aldo got a nice cut from the PPV. He most likely walked away with 4 or 5 million when all was said and done. Rousey makes a sh+t ton more $ than any featherweight boxer on the planet. Yeah, her salary vs Tate was around $550K...that's before her cut of the PPV. She walks away with millions off of her fights. McGregor's fight against Diaz was the first publicized $1 million UFC purse. That's what he was guaranteed to get just to set foot in the ring. He himself said when all is said and done he made around $10 million for that Diaz fight.
The problem with the boxing model is this:
Boxers make too much money too soon for fighting guys that are no threat.
In the UFC you only make good money once you fight and beat a guy that's a threat...and you keep doing it over and over again.
Boxing = mismatches on HBO and Showtime 9 out of 10 times. In the UFC it's #1 vs #2 in their weight class ALL THE TIME.
I like boxing better. But 95% of the time the only reason a boxing match is occuring is because the favourite knows they are going to win. Just look at Crawford. Lundy and Jean as opponents, give me a f+ckin' break. Garcia-Salka, a f+ckin' travesty.
That sh+t would never and will never fly in the UFC.
And that's the difference.
$500K apiece for Loma and Walters is more than fair. In the big scheme of things, few people give a f+ck about these two.
Stop using the UFC as a comparison. It's different. The best actually fight the best...all the time...and if you're headling PPV's that pull in over a million buys you are making big money, better money than guys headlining non PPV HBO and Showtime cards
He's reaching deep inside his ass. He doesn't even know how many PPVs UFC sells as the numbers they release are all lies.
You were saying? http://www.totalsportek.com/money/conor-mcgregor-vs-nate-diaz-purse/
Crawford and Postol plus Ward and Krusher are ppv worthy, how the hell are going to sell. Saunders vs Golovkin, lmao this will be the lowest selling ppv ever.
Crawford-Postol shouldn't really be on PPV
I completely understand the thinking that having all the fighters under one umbrella would make for more competitive fights, but Haymon stockpiled a lot of guys and you can count on one hand the amount of marquee fights he gave us...not many.
He tried, but is ultimately doomed to failure. The UFC model would be awesome for boxing, but all the UFC had to do was buy out Strikeforce and they essentially took out the only competition they had to get the top fighters under contract.
Boxing is different. In North America alone you have multiple major promotions with good fighters: Top Rank, Golden Boy, Main Events, Banner, Roc Nation etc, then you have all the promoters that serve as half assed promoters for Haymon fighters (DiBella etc). In Canada you have GYM and Interbox as well. Then go overseas, you have multiple promoters in the UK and Germany that control very good fighters that make good money. It's very difficult to corner a market when you have that many players in the business.
Haymon tried but I just don't see it happening. He's fighting multiple lawsuits in court regarding unfair competition practices, there's a possible investigation into the way investment firm Waddell and Reed handed over to Haymon $500 million (which is pretty much spent and gone). Why do you think they had very few buy in cards on netork tv in the first half of this year?...no more Waddell and Reed money, that's why. Why do you think all of a sudden almost all of the fights Haymon guys are involved in are ending up on Showtime? (because they are paying real money out of their pocket to Haymon, not the other way around like it iss with NBC, ESPN and Spike).
The gravy train is over. The days of being paid $750K to fights bums is over. The Waddell and Reed money is spent and gone. Now Haymon has a stable of fighters used to getting overpaid, now they are going to have to get used to getting paid what they are worth. He has more fighters than dates to put them on (unless he's willing to pay the networks for it). How much longer is that going to last? Now that the investment firm money is gone he's spending more than he's taking in. The live gates for Haymon fighters is atrocious, they give away tickets to practically every event.
At some point you have to ask...where is the money going to come from?
TMany people talk of the UFC's PPV buy rates and they are quite good. But the deal most people don;t really mention is the netowrk tv deal they got from FOX. It's worth $200 million. That's what Haymon was hoping for when he did his time buys on network tv. UFC did it with Spike, they bought their time there for a couple of years. It worked for them...I don;t see it working for Haymon. I don't see anyone willing to pony up $200 million to any boxing promotion, let alone Al Haymon.
Salido-Vargas is June 4th on regular HBO. There's your HBO bloodbath for that time of year right there. If you're going to go through all the trouble to type that long of a post, why not make it accurate.
Nobody seems to want to mention the most obvious problem when it comes to ANYTHING on tv these days. People are cutting off their cable at an alarming rate. They are going to the pirate internet/cable boxes so they can watch everything free.
This means that HBO has fewer subscribers every year. If they are making less money they will cut their budget accordingly. Simple math. But todays generation wants everything for free and then they wonder why HBO won't pay for more boxing or why is their budget being cut.
It's not just HBO, it's rating across the board for everything. PBC can't draw flies, Showtime ratings aren't any good either. People are complaining all their getting is mismatches. It's because the networks can't afford the good fights because there just aren't enough viewers to watch them and make sense for the networks to put them on. Hell, Haymon has gone into a deep money losing strategy to try and corner the market. He may end up pulling it off but even if he does there will be no money left to pay anyone and no network willing to pay to show the fights.
The only way I see the sport staying relevant is ticket sales. Gate driven profit is the only way to go, and maybe independant PPV's done on the cheap, $15 or $20. Top Rank has the ability to do their own PPV's, they've done it in the past.
But it all goes back to exposure. The fights have to be televised. If they fail to get that done they won't sell tickets either. TV is very important for boxing and the biggest surprise to me is that the promoters have abused the networks with mismatches and terrible fights. Now the chickens are coming home to roost, people cut off their cable and get everything free through the internet. I don't see boxing making legit inroads on tv anytime in the near future. Quite the opposite. It's going into the toilet and it lies squarely on the fault of the promoters and the networks for allowing it.
I believe it's too late. Mayweather-Pac was the swan song for boxing. It literally signified the end of the superfight in this sport. There is nothing BIG to look forward to. There always used to be something just around the corner.
There's always hope but I don't see much of that around these days.
When I first saw the ticket prices for this fight I knew they would have some trouble moving tickets. They are overpriced by about 35%.
Let's face it, Daniel Jacobs has never been able to even come close to filling an arena at any of his fights, none of them.
The guy has wins over Quillen who's been proven to have been nothing more than an over hyped regular joe and two wins over Sergio Mora. That's about all he's got on his resume which isn't saying much. The guy can't even sell tickets in his own home town vs Golovkin, what else do you need to know that he's not a draw, never has been one and never will be.
Again, the prices were too much because you only have one side of the equation that's selling tickets to this fight and that's Golovkin.
Loeffler should have let it go to a purse bid at which point Jacobs side would have either had to pony up %70 of the purse to Golovkin or drop his belt. Only thing I can think of is HBO upped their end of the tv deal money to keep this fight from potentially ending up on Showtime if Haymon/DiBella were to win the purse bid.
They won't approve this, but they'll approve Kirkland?
Canelo has a contract with HBO, Cotto does not.
Canelo has showed the willingness to fight anyone in the past, so putting him in with Kirkland is very little risk to HBO because he's under contract and wants the big challenges. Cotto lately seems unwilling to fight the best in his division.
HBO is smart to get some sort of guarantee that if Cotto fights Bundrage and they broadcast it that they get a quality fight out of Cotto in return. It's good business.
Cotto's best move is to go with HBO. They have two big fights they can get him: Canelo and GGG. Both are good revenue generating fights.
This thread and it's thread starter just go to show you how stupid Floyd's fan base truly is.
In typical moronic fashion, Floyd gets his fighter a watch instead of a healthy bonus. Anyone with half a brain knows that once that watch leaves the store it's only worth 30% off what it cost retail.
If I'm a fighter I'd just say give me the money that the watch would cost as a bonus.
Dumb Floyd fans think giving a guy a watch is a great way to take care of them...it's not. If the watch cost $10K the guy can probably only get $3K for it now if he wanted or needed to sell it.
The one poster here who mentioned the woman's book who used to work for Floyd is right. She complained that when it was time to get paid he'd give you a damn watch LOL. A watch doesn't pay the fuc+in' rent fools!
He has Pascal, Bute, or some guys @ 168lb if they chose to move up.
Pascal is in the drivers seat since he could face Kovalev or Stevenson (I think he is the mandatory for both of them)
Kovalev just fought Hopkins who was not only with Showtime, but owns 5% of Golden Boy.
There are no rules forbidding that type of thing. It's up to the individuals. Adonis is straight up scared.
Hopkins is with Golden Boy but NOT with Showtime, television wise Hopkins is a free agent and able to fight on any network. C'mon man you should know this **** by now.
He has Pascal, Bute, or some guys @ 168lb if they chose to move up.
Pascal is in the drivers seat since he could face Kovalev or Stevenson (I think he is the mandatory for both of them)
I'm pretty sure Muhammedi is Kovalev's mandatory. Duva already said they are looking to do another big fight with a name guy. The mandatory with Mohammedi is plan B if a fight with Pascal or someone of that stature falls through.
I truly believe Main Events has no interest in putting Kovalev-Stevenson together right now, it's just too difficult of a fight to make since he went over to Showtime (Kovalev is with HBO).
Pascal however is Stevenson's mandatory. But, Pascal can make more off of a Kovalev fight because Stevenson is hoping to get the fight to go to a purse bid because as champ he'd get 60-70% of the purse with a mandatory. This is why negotiations with Pascal went nowhere, going to a purse bid is in Stevenson's best interest money wise.
Kovalev however can be negotiated so that the split is more even, there is no mandatory in play there.
I agree, Stevenson is not sitting in a good place right now. Lets be realistic, a fight with Kovalev isn't happening anytime soon. Kovalev is with HBO, Stevenson is with Showtime, never the two shall meet unless it's called Tyson-Lewis LOL.
So, that leaves Stevenson with what? Pascal. But they tried negotiating already and Stevenson wanted a much bigger piece of the pie but guess what, Kovalev beat Hopkins and now has three belts. Pascal doesn't need Stevenson anymore for a big money fight, he'll look to Kovalev because he's got three belts to Stevenson's one.
All Stevenson really has is a fight with Bute (which doesn't hold much interest among the fans or networks) or a fight with Hopkins which also doesn't hold much interest anymore (since the events of the past weekend).
Haymon really ****ed up when he tried to screw around with Hopkins in negotiations, he got ****in' owned there. The guy everyone says does awesome for his fighters pretty much negotiated his way out of a big payday for his fighter with a very beatable 50 year old LOL.
Live and learn I guess
You could put up an outdoor stadium in a matter of weeks. All it is is collapsible bleachers, a ring and floor seats. They aren't pouring fuc*in' concrete and s*it. It's a temporary seating facility that can be put up and broken down in weeks.
Some of the biggest fights in the history of the sport have taken place in f*ckin' casino parking lots via temporary stadium. Fights like these have all been staged at various hotel properties like Caesars, Riviera, The Dunes and The Hilton. Holmes-Cooney took place outside at Caesars in Vegas, in the parking lot, it had 30,000 people in attendance so stop talking about how it hasn't ever been done, shouldn't be done or does't need to be done. The only people saying that are Fl*m*s coming up with excuses not to have a fight. Ali-Holmes took place in the parking lot there as well, they built a temporary stadium that held 25,000, here's the article from a Nevada paper on the fight and the temporary stadium:
http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1908&dat=19800818&id=eHkpAAAAIBAJ&sjid=ftQEAAAAIBAJ&pg=4280,4059634
You want a stadium that holds at least 30,000 so that you could get a ticket that doesn't cost an arm and a leg. If this ever went down at the MGM Grand Garden Arena tickets would never even go on sale to the public.
Stop trying to say there's no reason to build a temporary outdoor stadium. There is a reason, it's called money. It's been done plenty of times before, no reason they can't do it again.
Yes. But, Las Vegas doesn't have a huge arena. A lot of people, myself included want the fight to be in Vegas. I don't know for sure, but I don't think I've ever seen or heard of a venue in Las Vegas that seats more than 16,000.
Sam Boyd Stadium where the UNLV football team plays. It holds 36,800 with temporary seats added holds 40,000.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Boyd_Stadium
Only problem is it's a little far off the strip. The whole point of holding a fight in a casino parking lot is to keep the gamblers on the casino property so they can gamble before and after the fight. If you send the gamblers half an hour off the strip to see the fight they probably aren't coming back to spend money at your casino afterwards, who knows where they'll end up and that site fee you gave to the promoters won't be worth sh*t.
People tend to forget Top Rank didn't have 100% of Gamboa. Ahmet Oner out of Germany first signed Gamboa. Top Rank co-promoted with Oner by the time Gamboa got to the US.
So if you're Arum you're probably a little hesitant to put your second most popular Puerto Rican fighter after Cotto in there with Gamboa, a guy who was faster and more talented than Lopez.
I could see why it didn't happen. Arum had 100% of Lopez, he didn't have 100% of Gamboa and he probably thought Gamboa would win so he figured why take the risk.
I am going to be purchasing tix for the fight tomorrow. I need just 2, however, I am thinking of purchasing 4 and selling the other two on stubhub n order to recoup some money. I would be purchasing the $350 tix.
Does anyone have any experience with this? Pretty much I am looking to see what I can expect to sell the tix for and is it even worth the time and trouble.
You aren't going to be allowed to do this. Tickets for Mayweather fights are on a will-call basis only. That means you buy the tickets through ticketmaster but they don't get mailed to you. You have to pick them up at the MGM Grand box office but they don't allow you to do that until the day before the fight at the earliest.
So your little scalping plan would involve you having a window of 24 hours in which to sell your tickets to someone who will most likely try and low-ball you LOL. Good luck with that.
Stevenson-Alvarez is not a very good fight. Stevenson is head and shoulders above Alvarez.
Alvarez is 20-0 with 10 KO's. He's got no power to speak of.
He's gonna get stopped badly by Stevenson you can take that to the bank. The only reason this fight does any business is because of the local angle. They are both guys based out of Montreal.
IMO Stevenson should have fought Pascal while he was still somewhat relevant. Even coming off of 2 stoppage losses to Kovalev I still think it would make more money than an Alvarez fight.
Hell, you can still get Bute a real good payday by sacrificing him to Stevenson. Even though he'd get murdalized...it's still better than an Alvarez fight.
Alvarez brings very little to the table in every category you can imagine: no fans, no excitement (low KO %) and no personality.
Nobody really cares about this fight.
I don't see how Jacobs opponent could be Tureano Johnson. Just last week Johnson and GBP were involved in a purse bid for a fight with Sergiy Derevyanchenko:
http://www.espn.com/boxing/story/_/id/19552712/dibella-entertainment-wins-sergiy-derevyanchenko-tureano-johnson-middleweight-eliminator-purse-bid
GBP lost the purse bid, DiBella (in reality Al Haymon) won it.
So Johnson is supposed to fight Derevyanchenko. Not sure where Jacobs fits in this picture.
Also, if I'm GBP I keep Lemieux away from Jacobs. Jacobs is a mover and a big middleweight. Lemieux would have a hard time with a guy like that. No need to risk a potential Canelo payday for a Jacobs fight
Unless you consider me a floydspastic.
The 2.1 Million was Golovkins Flat Purse. Arums 2.1 million offer with PPV upside to Jr. without an extension was very fair. Take a look at Arums's situation here. How much money would you want to risk, if you had 0 insurance and nothing to bank on after the fight?
Each fighter a promoter has signed is an investment. If Bob does not have controlling interest in either fighter, he will work it so there is less risk for him, which is understandable, because he will not recoup any of that potential lost money in the future with that fighter.
This really doesn't make any sense to me.
First, Chavez has been with Top Rank for years. They have made plenty of money with him. They have received a return on their investment, otherwise they wouldn't be looking to keep him. Chavez has one fight left on his contract. After having a relationship for that long you'd think they would grant his request to be a free agent after he has fulfilled his contract.
They did it for Cotto. Not only did they grant him the free agency, they got him the fight he was pining for...the Margarito rematch as his last fight with Top Rank. He then became a free agent and fought Floyd in his very next fight.
This "investment" garbage is just a regurgitation of what Bob Arum is spewing to make an excuse for trying to f+k over a fighter that's just looking for the best deal he can get.
You don't hear about any other promoters pulling this extension blackmail **** with their fighters, just Top Rank.
I want the WBC belt to be kept in America. I want it to be on at the MGM Grand in the near future on a big PPV, not freeking Bern in Switzerland like Klitschko-Thompson 2. A town with a population of 125,000 in the middle of nowhere.
Keep that belt in America. Leave Deontay Wilder get his mandatory, then have the winner of Perez-Jennings fight the winner of Stiverne-Wilder.
This would make sense...if Stiverne was actually American and not Canadian LOL.
Ward is going to make this fight as ugly has he can. He'll move and run but I think he's going to hug and hold more than anything. Running expends a lot of energy, holding not so much.
Regardless, I think that action will be hard to find in this fight and it'll let a lot of people down as far as the entertainment factor is concerned
It has been said behind the scenes Arum hoped Pac would stay retired. He has a high guarantee, but his only fight since losing to Mayweather only did something like 250,000 PPV buys. Top Rank lost a ton of money on that third Bradley fight. Pac is insisting on finishing out his contract. How many fights he has left I don't know. They mutually agreed on his guarantee being reduced but still, you gotta figure he'll command at least $10 million a fight. If he ends up matched up against Vargas Top Rank will be taking another bath. Even a Crawford fight loses money.
I think they are hoping a second Mayweather fight comes to fruition, if it does they'll make up what they are lost on his last fight against Bradley and the upcoming Vargas fight.
But, but, but, but, Canelo is the main reason why people buys tickets to see Floyd's fights. He's the real draw, Floyd can't sell without him.
Here is the Ticketmaster link to the Mayweather-Guerrero fight.
http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/2E004A4BD0EE7672?artistid=11275&majorcatid=10004&minorcatid=33&tm_link=search_msg-0_2E004A4BD0EE7672
As you can see there are a lot of tickets left. Some on the good sections, some in the nosebleeds. Fact of the matter is there will be plenty of empty seats at this fight just like there are at all of Floyd's fights. Hell the Floyd-Cotto fight had empty seats. It's a combination of a few things: Floyd's style, the price and the opponent.
The nosebleeds are way overpriced never mind the good seats. You'll notice the good sections don't have tickets, that's misleading. The good sections never went on sale to the public. Floyd sells them on the secondary market through brokers. In essence he scalps tickets to his own fights. A lot of fighters do this to make extra coin on the event. Hatton did it as well. But brokers will have a hard time getting rid of them for this fight just like they did for the Ortiz fight.
Floyd is very much a PPV fighter. People will shell out the $60 for the PPV. $600 - $1000 to watch him fight Guerrero is another story all together.
So when they say the live gate will approach $18 million it's misleading because it's mostly due to the high price of tickets and not the demand, because there is no demand for tickets to this fight.
There's a reason Floyd never fights outside of Vegas, he can't draw outside of Vegas unless he has a high profile opponent that's why. A quarter of the tickets to a fight in Vegas are bought by casinos to comp their high rollers with. They give them away. That doesn't happen in NYC, LA or San Antonio. Vegas has a built in comp market of around 1,500-3,000 tickets per fight easy.
As you can clearly see by the ticketmaster link there are plenty of tickets left with a week to go before the fight.
like I said earlier, there is enough interest for people to shell out $60, not enough to shell out $600 - $1000 to see it live.
Funny thing is they gave Floyd more special treatment than anyone barring Oscar. Floyd is an ungrateful whore.
The difference being that Oscar gave the network the fights that mattered the most in regards to what the fans wanted to see and as far as ratings were concerned. Floyd did not. They were probably both given the leeway to fight who they wanted. Oscar chose to fight the fights that mattered the most and challenge himself in the ring to prove he was the best. Floyd's only desire was to get the most money possible for the least risk.
You know Top Rank is Chavez Jr's promoter right?
But Top Rank aren't GGG's promoter. In order to block a fight you pretty much need both fighters under contract. They can't keep a fighter away from Chavez that they don't have under contract (GGG).
Chavez has a mexican promo
Chavez can negotiate a GGG fight, they would only legally be obligated to let Top Rank promote it, nothing more and nothing less. Top Rank has zero to do with GGG, he has his own promoter (K2)
Someone help me understand something:
How can Top Rank prevent Chavez Jr from getting the GGG fight when GGG isn't even a Top Rank fighter?
As a matter of fact, Chavez can side step Top Rank if he wants and negotiate his own deal when it comes to a GGG fight, the only glitch would be is that he'd have to cut Top Rank in and have them promote it so they can get their share.
Arum can't prevent Chavez Jr from fighting GGG, he can only demand that Top Rank get their cut as they are Jr's promoter.
This sounds like Top Rank trying to prevent a fight that quite frankly they have no ability to block.
And Steve Kim's twitter post makes no sense atall. He says if the fight doesn't get signed this week GGG will go to HBO...he's already with HBO, what the **** is that moron blabbering about.
This is what happens when you give Floyd Mayweather a $32 million guarantee for every fight. The only fight they made any money on with this deal was the Canelo fight. They lost millions on the Guererro fight and will lose millions on the Maidana fight. When Floyd fights guys of Guererro's and Maidana's stature Showtime needs 1.2 million buys just to break even. They aren't going break even here, they wouldn't break even on a Khan fight either, or Garcia. They got nobody over at GBP that can get them to 1.2 million buys right now in a fight with Mayweather. If they do the Pac fight, yes they will. Martinez would get him there as well I believe but there isn't much else.
Me too.......
Do you know if MGM sell tickets directly?
I hate dealing with the hassel of booking from third parties and what not.
MGM does have their own box office but tickets always go on sale first through ticket master. A couple of weeks later you can buy them through the MGM Grand box office...in person only if I'm not mistaken.
MGM also does packages that include tickets to the fight and a room at the MGM. That's the only way to get a decent ticket to the big fights. The rest are sold to scalpers. But still, you're gonna get gouged.
Your best bet is to email them and ask what kind of packages they will be offering and when if you don't want to try your luck with ticketmaster or the scalpers.