the only reason is because the wbc has been around the longest which means it has brought boxing the most dishonesty and corruption. that might be why floyd considers it offical cause it represents him perfectly.
Just shows your ignorance. WBA was the original organization. The reason Floyd likes his green belt is because one time it was the most prestigious belt.
F**k no,
MAB got his @ss kicked by someone who ended up becoming a legend in his own right, while old @ss Shane was feasting on the likes of Fernando Vargas, Ricardo Mayorga and Antonia Margarita, not exactly 1st ballot HOFers, guys.
You might be a pactard, but there's no reason to disrespect Mosley. He also fought prime DLH, Winky and Forrest. And the most dominant 135 lbr since Whitaker. And that margarito was the #1 ranked WW at the time. Just don't post if you got nothing to contribute.
finally some real proof that mayweather is so much better than pacquiao.
So many moronic poster. Just to educate you:
WBC belt is NOT the belt.
There are several champions. One is a lineal, another is titlist. For a boxing historian, lineal champion is what matters.
Definition of terms;
lineal = the champion, the man of the division. Oh and just to clarify the ring champion is not the lineal champion, although it is usually the case.
titlist = person who gets a piece of the four sanctioning bodies belt.
Ideally, with one belt per division, the lineal is also the titlist. However with four title per divisions, it gets complicated. The WBA was the oldest organization, followed by the WBC, IBF then WBO.
How to become the lineal champion?
There are two generally accepted way. One is to beat the current lineal champion. Now the lineal champion might have a belt, or he might not have. Doesn't matter. The lineage stays with that person so long he's not defeated, vacated or dead.
There are times when there is no lineal champion because he moved up in weight, died or voluntarily vacates or retire. The second way to became the champion is to arrange a fight between the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd ranked fighters of that division. Again, it doest matter if these ranked fighters are titlist, so long as they are universally recognized the best fighters of that division. Nowadays it is also becoming acceptable that a fight between the 1st and 2nd ranked fighter determines the lineal champ.
Now lets fo back to Pacquiao's case. The reason he's a 7-div world champ is because:
1. 112 = lineal, WBC champ.
2. 122 = IBF champ
3. 126 = lineal, no sanctioning belt
4. 130 = lineal, WBC
5. 135 = WBC
6. 140 = lineal, no sanctioning belt
7. 147 = WBO
For a boxing purist, he is 4-division champ. That are the divisions where he is lineal. Coincidentally, two of these division he did not held any belt. The lineal champs he defeated, Barrera and Hatton, does not have belts.
1. Speed. Not just hand but also footspeed. Although shane has decent hanspeed, he just doesn't have the movement to create angles. Shane just tried feinting but without the lateral movement it's pretty useless as he's just moving forward.
2. Floyd backs up in straight lines. Though Floyd does slips punches, he also backs in straight lines. Against an agressive pressure fighter he could be within punching range.
3. Activity. Floyd usually sets the pace with accurate counter-punching. I don't think he will be comfortable in an high-octane pace. Also this allows opponents like Hatton to steal rounds (specially early rounds) before Floyd controls the pace of the fight and takes over.
4. Chin. Though a good chin, he can be hurt. Again i think he showed good recovery. Up to Pac if he could capitalize if he hurts Mayweather.
Again floyd should be favored over this fight.
Yeah I have really high morals, and adultery to me is a big thing. If it's a joke fine, but there are a lot of people who take stuff like this seriously. I know this from experience.
They'll believe manny is on steroids, that he demands same day catch weights, that his fights are rigged, and when his character is one of the biggest arguments toward him being clean, tainting it makes the steroid argument stronger.
I was only here to put in my two cents and leave, but I got a reply so I replied back.
Your too affected. You seem to see Pac as ur ideal man. He's not. Everybody except bandwagoners know he cheats his wife, has a huge ego and a hundred faults. Every native Pinoy knows this. But who gives ****? It's what he does in the ring that matters.
Besides you're not a real flip if you dont chase ***** on the side.
I don't really understand the point the OP is trying to make. 2 years ago, Pacquiao had a poor performance and struggled against JMM. Somehow that is supposed to make him more great and not less great?
Two years ago NOONE, unless your a delusional fool, will ever think Pacquiao will step in the ring against Cotto or Clottey, much less than he'll win 22 or 23 rounds against those two. Is it that hard to get?
This talk about Manny being the natural smaller man only came up when he fought DLH, because he was at least shorter and most were expecting him to weigh less than Oscar on fight night. This didn't happen, but still I see why people would think that because of the height. As far as Hatton I didn't see him as being bigger, I thought Manny was just better period anyone who picked Hatton is an idiot IMO. He was smaller against Cotto, but I still firmly believe Cotto training himself and still having the Marg issue in his head cost him that fight, or at least being more competitive the second half. Clottey was definitely the bigger man, but if you put a guy who weighed 20 pounds more than me and told me he was only going to swing once a round, I would throw 100+ punches a round too looking for the KO.
Manny's main issue IMO is the fact that he hasn't fought a boxer since Marquez. The "bigger guys" tend to be sluggers vs. boxers and this is possibly why Manny has been labeled the smaller guy, but at 126-140 he's always been in the biggest guy in the ring at least weight wise I believe. At WW, he has yet to really give up reach except for the DLH and Clottey fights, but in both of those the guys just took the beating... Manny isn't that small he's just somehow made people think he is.
HE IS THE SMALLER MAN. Can't make wieght at 147 while almost all WW has to cut to make 147. Length, reach is the average for a FW. And it was only in Morales-Pac 3 that he weigh in over 140. Yo seem to forget that Pac moved from 122 to 130 in span of just over a year. he was the smaller man at Barrera 1 and morales 1. Rhat's why i find it crazy people were grumbling about the 132 lbs fight Eric proposed. Pac was just a SFW for one year, and the contracted rematch was @ 130.
I don't know why anybody would dispute the fact that Pacquiao ducked Mosley and Mayweather stepped up to the plate and beat him.
I dont know if you know what stepped up the plate means....step-up the plate when it was expected of him 4 years ago?
annnd
now has the nerve to impose weight penalty fees into contracts... :thumbsdow
He honored the contract and sanctioning bodies didn't he? He got stripped of the title didn't he? He didn't bitch about being zombie in the fight. Not like you're gossiping bithch of a hero where his quaking ass got scared of 10M overweight-penalty clause and and came up with PED excuse bullshit that he copied from his daddy. Just so happen he came up with a fighter who meekly submit like JMM.
It also must be said of Pac the all time great .... after collecting his first lineal title and proving he was the best of the best at 112...... three fights later he got his ass knocked out by a body shot yeah I did have to look that up..... hell of a lineal champ.... will probably go down in history as one of the greatest reigns of any fighter in history!!!!
Actually if you're going to nit-pick do a better job. He lost the championship at the weigh scales.
TS is a stupid cunt.
Name me 1 Great Indian Boxer.....etc etc
Black have been dominating boxing for the best part of a century.
Not Asians. Not Europeans. Not Islanders.
BLACKS have been.
Pacs former manager even stated he purposely avoided black fighters.
Deal with it.
Pac has never fought a great black fighter.
You are stupid and pathetic like your Aussie will rape Germany thread. Who's manager is that? Murad? Well Pac under Murad fought Ledwaba and Sanchez. two of the best 122.
And i find it pathetic how could you argue with this logic. It's WHO you beat not what's your heritage *******. Ledwaba and Sanchez were the best 122 lbr. so Pac fought them. Just as JMM and MAB was at 126 and Morales/MAB/JMM at 130.
The only "black slick" fighter you could argue here is Joan Guzman. Noone else. And don't forget that it was only after post-JMM that Guzman became the clear contender to Pac's reign at SFW. I don't know how many years Guzman is a champion at SFW but i guess it ws pretty recent. All the other's don't hold any water.
Oh yeah
thanks for the info
and if he would have fought frietas we all know now that pack would have kiled him but at that time it was a better fight or joel
you have to admit he went for the easier fight
Please.....Freitas was beaten by Baby Bull. Diaz almost unified the LW division beofre losing to Campbell.
Pac-JMM 2 was Feb if my memory was right. The Pac-DD fight was a done deal. Campbell won the three belt from Baby Bull in March. I think the Pac-DD fight was in May. So at the time the Diaz-pacquiao was made Campbell wasn't even the champ. After the May fight Oscar came knocking at the door since the "slickest fighter of all" refused to rematch the Zoombie Oscar at 147 who hasnt fought at that weight for 7 years right?
Pacquiao said he had agreed initially to testing 30 days out, then he agreed to cut that to 24 days out in the final phases of the negotiations. Well, let’s look at what could be done with a 24-day window. What athletes are doing now is using low-dose testosterone. The gels and the creams will clear in a day. Oral testosterone will clear in about four days. With intense training and a two-week program of anabolic steroids or low-dose testosterone, you can get a significant advantage in terms of strength and power. But if you taper off, you’re much faster 10 days to two weeks out than you are while you’re still on the stuff.”… Conte (source:The Sweet Science)
And what about the random urine testing that Pac agreed to? The blood testing is the only issue here, he's agreed to unlimited urine testing w/o cut-off. Aren't the result of blood testing verified by the urine test? **** man must have ESP to keep masking his urine 2 days or 72 hours or watever ur saying the masking time could be befor the test is done.
That is what I am saying. A lot of people like to shit on the extremist Pac fans. But, the the extremist Floyd fans are just AS bad.
Nope they are worse, claiming to be the most knowledgable posters. Henry Armstrong pure boxer? shit.....I bet Greb and Robinson are too?
That is what I am saying. A lot of people like to shit on the extremist Pac fans. But, the the extremist Floyd fans are just AS bad.
Out of the top 3 ATG's only Robinson could be boxer-puncher. Armstrong and Greb are swarmers.
Both Pac and Floyd have haters
Both have defenders up to the last breath
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Manny Pacquiao is greater than Floyd Mayweather in terms of Ring accmplishment ( What they did ) Pacquiao being the Fighter of the Decade and is also a 7 Division champion ( 4 Lineal )
Floyd Mayweather is greater than Manny Pacquiao in terms of overall boxing skills.He has show great skills defensively and offensively. He is also unbeaten. If we speculate without any bias Floyd has a good chance of dominating Manny.
The FIGHT needs to happen :(
What does greatness means? Isnt it what you do in the right, your actual exploits...accomplishment, and not what you're perceived you can do? Greatness is earned.
so what weapons can Pac utilize to make this his fight? the straight left? the right hook? be specific.
Straight left is given. No one has been able to neutralize that, even JMM with his great timing. And the right uppercut. Things that Pac has in the arsenal.
But what you are overlooking is his foot movement. Those fools who has been saying that he didn't put DLH in his back are overlooking a significant factor....he wasn't sitting on his punches, just potshotting and moving. I expect that will be the strategy they would employ...pop a shot or too and move, rinse and repeat until Cotto got weak. He doesn't have a chin like DLH and doesn't have the greatest stamina, so late rounds is where Pac would take the risk and look for the KO.
What the **** is this moronic TS trying to say? That Manny gets the blame for the WW's CALLING HIM out? **** you bitch your motive is clear....it's not to demonstrate that the welterweight div needs Manny but to take pot shot at Manny himself.
Let it be clear that Manny hasn't called any WW's...they are the ones who wants to fight him. If I am one weight class below and somebody wants to challenge me, **** COME DOWN to my weight class. Pac has already done his share of moving up....more than any of the current greats that we have. In fact at least these challengers doesn't have to move all the way to 140. They could come at least 142-144.
Again if you're concerned abt the WW division then you should be slagging Mosley, Mayweather, Margie etc for not fighting each other and seeking the smaller man. But damn one of these might be your God so you cant criticize them so let the little man take the blame huh?
Yeah because JMM doesn't come in at 140's in SFW fights. Guzman even came at a whopping 148 lbs for a SFW fight. Most of contemporary 130's fights at 135-140 range. And yeah there was no plan to move to 135 even before the 2nd JMM fight right?
Of course he wasn't outweight by Diaz for a LW fight. And he was bigger than Hatton for 140 fight right? Shucks he came in at 129 last JMM fight, why isn't he "Cottoed" or zombied like DLH?
Of course Lightweights fights exactly at 135 today, so does LWW, **** Cotto, Mosley, Margo doesn't come in at 160 for a WW fight. Oh and Mayweather is a "small" WW who could come down for a 140 fight right? GTFO with your imbecile comment.
Flomo's mentality. They say anything can happen but gives scenario's where Mosely wins because of robbery or headbutt. Like Mosely can't win fairly. And if there's a robbery here, it will be Floyd "gifted" by the judges like in FMJ-Castillo 1.
Which was why i was against this fight in the 1st place. i'm old school boxing fan...the devisions are seperate for a reason. but seeing as how it's happening anyway, after awhile i accepted it, and am hyped for it. I see it 50/50, but giving a slight edge to Cotto cuz Manny is stepping up to a natural.
If you are then you should know that catch-weight is as old as boxing. Even Hank Armstrong had a catch-weight fight. Whenever two marketable fighters are close the each other's weight class but one or the other cannot make the weight properly, then they will always agree in the middle. And funny, it has been a tradition that the bigger guy will mostly have the advantage than the one moving up. Pac definitely started a new tradition. Moving up is so easy that a fighter of higher div is at disadvantage if he give one or two pound for the smaller guy.
And how much is the promotional cost? I heard somewhere that it was around $20M.
and then there's the cut of the promoters, trainers, managers etc on the guaranteed pot.
Another cut for the promoters, HBO for the 50M PPV.
No one thinks Chavez is great because of his undefeated record. Use your brain.
That's just the problem.......they don't know how to usde their brain. A lot of old-time fighters has padded record, but it's also littered with ATG's and HOF. 89-0 takes a lot of consistency. And for the one who says 39-0 of PBF is more impressive.....just 39 fights and Floyd is already complaining of his body breaking dow. What more if he has double that fights....even against bums.
Pac loves to beat people Floyd already punished.
See how easy that is. :)
Yeah but the difference is PAC goes on to fight people Floyd don't wanna fight.........
I have mixed feelings about catchweight for a title fiht, but i guess some of you need some lessons in history.
Hopkin-DLH for unified MW @ 158 lbs.
Leonard-Lalonde WBC LHW @ 168 lbs.
Leonard-Hearns 2 WBO SMW @ 163 lbs.
Norris-Taylor WBC LMW @ 150 lbs.
Whitaker-Chavez WBC WW @ 145 lbs.
Funny the last one will parrallel the Cotta-Pac fight. Cotto will come in at 145 while Pac at 142 just like Whitaker and Chavez did.
I have mixed feelings about catchweight for a title fiht, but i guess some of you need some lessons in history.
Hopkin-DLH for unified SMW @ 158 lbs.
Leonard-Lalonde WBC LHW @ 168 lbs.
Leonard-Hearns 2 WBO SMW @ 163 lbs.
Norris-Taylor WBC LMW @ 150 lbs.
Whitaker-Chavez WBC WW @ 145 lbs.
Funny the last one will parrallel the Cotta-Pac fight. Cotto will come in at 145 while Pac at 142 just like Whitaker and Chavez did.
You don't really know what the TS is talking about. Being fundamental means keeping your guard up, good lateral movement, jab to set up your punches, and throw combinations.
If you have some eyes its clear that Donaire was getting hit because hes dropping his hand, he allows himself to be pushed into the ropes, and just pop one punches at a time.
He was most effective when he was jabbing, forcing Conception to reset. The trainers were urging him to jab, to throw combinations. I'm a bit disappointed. He won the rounds, but he made it unnessarily difficult for him. He has the reach to jab, handspeed to throw combinations, and should have good fundamentals to keep some form of defense. Instead he was outjabbed, pushed to the ropes.