Incorrect. GSP doesn't have a wrestling background like Jones does. GSP learned wrestling on the spot - that equals superior athlete. Now go on a rant and look foolish as usual.
Gsp wrestled. Lol wtf. It's well known GSP went into wrestling and boxing after karate (unless Im wrong but i dont feel like googling) Please tell me you're kidding. Now, he didnt exclusively wrestle like Jones did but jones literally had ZERO training and went into MMA and within a VERY short time was in the UFC....With no prior formal striking or bjj training (like gSp since he was like 8 or some s hit. Google it ) jones is the epitime of a good athlete in mma. Troll harder man. I can already tell that's what you're doing.
Jon Jones isn't a better athlete, he can't even box on GSP's level and his wrestling, though good, isn't on GSP's level either. I know boxing fans are too blind to go against anything boxing no matter what the case, so there's no point in even discussing it. Floyd's not even the best athlete in boxing, it's his ring IQ and timing, if his success was based on athleticism he would've gotten knocked cold against Mosley.
Someone being more skilled than you doesn't = more "athletic" or a better "athlete". You know how long GSp has been in martial arts? Do you know how long jones has even been fighting? GSP is SUPPOSED to be more skilled. >_>... Some of us actually closely follow more than one sport without having a stick up our ass. Floyd not as athletic because of his skills but gSP is more athletic than jones because of his skills. What? Isn't that a terrible contradiction? What does Floyd "being KOd" (potentially) have ANYTHING to Do with being a good athlete!? Lol. You can't have skills and athleticism OR a chin at the same time? Wait...it just hit me. You don't know what athleticism is....
Just some Floyd hating it seems. Nothing to see here guys. Moving on
Ranking wise you may be right. Ranking doesnt mean he LOSES to some of the guys above him but he probably shouldnt be a top ranked WW. It's a weird situation because he probably isnt hugely favored to beat some of these guys either and some might be "toss ups". Anyway I don't have a huge issue with it.
I can't believe Straightleft thinks clottey beats Ortiz or Guerrero. :/... Then again I see that name as "Manny's favorite punch" so no surprise there. Lol no offense
Chavez Sr defense was actually very solid especially for his style of fighting. He had good head movement. He could slip punches and roll with them. Chavez doesn't get a lot of credit for his defense. He's underrated in that respect.
I like this video. It shows a little bit of what he could do defensively.
Yup. Chavez Sr was possibly as good as you can get defensively with his style. Easy to underrate him though as he was such a punishing fighter. Ggg is obviously sr lite right now in that hes very similar. Sure, his defense is nowhere near Chavez's right now but maybe someone will make him show that side of himself. I think Chavez seemed a bit more "natural" in his approach and Ggg seems a bit more machine like (not necessarily a bad thing as hes very sharp and methodical which is what I mean). I'm not sure GGG will develop as well defensively in that style but he has other tools we'll likely see him have to use or develop over time..
Chavez Sr's sense of distance was really impressive...
You must be retarded then. GSP is an insane level athlete.
He's a great athlete but Floyd is on another level. I think your judging criteria is based off GSPs explosiveness in the takedown... He leaves a ton to be desired on the feet in terms of true athleticism. Jon jones is a better athlete.
GSp is a good athlete dont get me wrong but Floyd is a rare breed. You'd have to scour a few different sports to find dudes as athletic as Floyd.
S hit man even I have a strong dislike for Floyd but athletically he's a supreme level athlete.. next thing you'll be saying GSp has faster feet than someone like Camacho and faster hands than Roy. Take it easy bro.. There's more to life than wrestling and tackling a dude fairly quickly
GSP did not have a damn wrestling background like Jones did. How much more clear can I be with this statement? You're just too shook or some ****. Sorry homie.
Okay. Gsp had wrestling experience. Did he legitimately compete? I don't know. You act like I'm saying he competed in college. But a few facts escape you. For one, you actually believe GSP is a better wrestler than Jones? One thing is being effective in mma, another thing is being actually a good wrestler on the world level IN wrestling. From what I know Jones was pretty good in the world of wrestling. Again, GSP seems more skilled which is due to him having much more experience. Gsp HIMSELF has said it's not really "wrestling" that makes him effective as it is him applying his karate experience that he gained before he started wrestling. Taking a dude down doesnt mean wrestling and last I checked GSp has never proved to be a beter greco wrestler than Jones. gsp has good timing on his shot but it's not just that. Once he gets ahold of a leg or whatever he does what he needs to get them down. Part wrestling, part BJJ, part karate (according to him its karate he uses but whatever). Gsp IS a good mma wrestler. Very effective but you think he'd outwrestle Jones in a wrestling competition? I would think you're a little smarter than that. Jones has shown to be more dynamic on his feet due to his superior athleticism but thats a diferent story.
There's obviously no intelligent debate coming back or any form of reason.
Also, the guys who have been excetional in one area and built from that have been the most successful in MMA... Matt Hughes all he really had was a wrestling base. Tito Ortiz back in the day as well. Royce with bjj. Chuck with kick boxing (disproving that guy that trains dudes in a sport he doesnt like? Lol.. Best grapplers dont beat the best strikers its the other way around. You only have to see Demian Maia vs Anderson). Anderson with his boxing/thai boxing, Cain with his wrestling, arlovski his boxing, cro cop as well, wanderlei his thai boxing, noguera bros bjj, BJ Penn (good athlete) with his BJJ, fedor eith Sambo etc etc. The best mma fighters are exceptional at one thing and thats likely what makes them better at others. There's really no middle ground EXCEPT for GSP. But his "boxing" benefits greatly from his takedowns. Dudes are too scared to throw a lot. He's been trained in diff martial arts since a kid and is a good example of an ideal mma fighter.
Why don't people respect a dominant one weight champ? You want it, come get it otherwise keep the name out your mouth. It's that simple. Ward is beating some fine fighters, no issues with him. If he moves up, great...if he doesn't...whatever.
Canelo got shutout by Floyd but he did show moments of surprisingly good boxing. He was for the most part "keeping up" with floyd towards the beginning of the fight. Losing, but not looking like he DIDNT belong. Sure, Floyd started taking him to school but it's Floyd. Canelo also outboxed Trout. I think... Call me crazy but I think Canelo might be alittle bit more skilled than Charlo right now, not to mention being the better fighter. Charlo is improving though but Canelo seems a bit more complete in comparison. I think the experience of fighting Floyd is also something to build on. He went 12 rounds with the best fighter on the planet thats some good schooling.
You see it all the time, fighters having fought a good fighter (sometimes even losing) saying things like they didnt panic, been hit harder... Or so and so didnt seem as fast as another fighter etc etc. When you've seen better that's a confidence booster.
Very impressed with the Charlo bros though they seem to be learning a lot lately and they are starting to look like theyve been at it longer than they have. If he keeps improving nmand Canelo stays around the class and winning this will be a good fight few years down the line, maybe even sooner depending on how much noise is made. Hard not to like em all.
I'm not sure I'd even favor Jermell over Trout right now. Not sure he's therre quite yet. I think he could be another year or so away. He might be though but I need to see before I can fully believe. I think hes got the goods
Now you turned this into Floyd hating. I can see your mindset is very shallow.
Jones has a wrestling background - he's been wrestling far longer than GSP has, yet GSP is the better wrestler of the two. That is as simple an example I can give you.
Gsp also has a wrestling background... As well as boxing..and karate and Bjj iirc. Gsp started earlier than did Jones. Skill wise, again..he's supposed to be more skilled (though it's up to debate if GSP is even better than Jones on the feet in general..). Look, GSP is a fine athlete but you seem to have this image of skill being "athleticism". As a pure athlete, Jones is better and Floyd is too. I really don't understand what your fixation is but this is ridiculous. I honestly don't know how to get you to realize how wrong you are. You've clearly got a very closed mind and some form of grudge goin'. It's like trying to tell a "crazy" person they're crazy.. Or telling a person who smells bad that they stink. Somewhere along the way it's just not registering for you. I don't get it. You're having these "debates" when clearly you're wrong. I'm sorry, bro. Bless your heart..or somethin there's nothing I can do
Mikey isnt even huge at 130 lol wtf is it with these names coming up for Pac. Something isn't adding up. Gamboa and Mikey? The backlash we'd be getting if someone even mentioned Floyd vs Mikey would be brutal.
Respect for the game really. Bradley isn't a Pac fan and thus doesnt have an agenda. He knows to be the man you gotta beat the man. Just how Abel Sanchez says martinez is still the man at 160 until proven otherwise. Nothing wrong with it. Shows humility and respect and knows he'd be the challenger
Always been a big Collazo fan but I think Ortrees will be very motivated for this one. Might stop Collazo at this stage but you never know how the jaw feels. Collazo has always been very underrated and this could be an interesting fight. Ortiz is a very fast starter and keeps it up throughout I wonder if Collazo can deal with it. He's pretty cagey and game. If Ortiz is on his game he should have this. Tough come back fight thats for sure.
JMM is just trying to be a paper champ at this point. he's waiting on a weaker champ at 147 and lookin to pounce on that dude
Too bad Broner just lost lol
Is that a pac display pic hitting Floyd? I know where this is going.
Bradley is likely number two in the division (rank wise) and Ward number two p4p. Big drop from two to three. Use to be close between Floyd, Ward, Serg and even Nonito but nonito has since lost, Serg inactive and the gaps are huge now. He has to beat Maidana who beat Broner? Wtf? Bradley who just beat someone Floyd already beat? Pac who's 1-2 with a KO loss... Come on. You watch the sport you know damn well the politics of Beadley and Pac as it is and yea, Kahn is an awful fight. Maidana has a rematch, that's not even an option.
I dont want to justify kahn because its awful but there's not a whole lot out there available that people will pay to see right now. That fight has no bearing on his standing as the reigning p4p fighter especially with the year he just had. I really dislike Floyd but I gotta give him his in ring props.
Roy Jones Jr.
Tyson
Floyd
Those are my favorites.
Shane Mosley gets a mention. He would crank it and land it vicious. Speed/power wise hes up there with roy's it was deadly and could also land it from a standstill. Shane was sl explosive people forget .
It's just strange that he didnt take the punches well. He's got some size and though his chin isnt all that, it's like getting ktfo by paulie. Training, partying or not I wonder what happened. I guess Ishida summoned some japanese god's strength and tooled him with it. He hit Kirkland with his life force, hence him losing all these times after. It was important, this was a battle he could not lose...for his friends...for his family... For konoha.
For practical use, Floyd. Better positioning to hit back where Pernell would sometimes be completely out of punching position. Pernell was hard to touch, but when you did touch him you could at least land flush. Floyd (according to his opponents) is apparently hard to hit and when they do, its rarely flush. I think Floyd's counter punching and harder punches should be taken into consideration for his defense as well. Pernell didnt hit as hard as Floyd...
A sublime as Pernell was, he had to transition to offense mostly (and at times not always greay he just got away with a lot due to speed) Floyd's defense is his offense mostly which I think is kind of the difference in preference for me
This guy is amazing to say the least! So, they ask him about his relationship with his daughter in contrast to his relationship with his dad and basically bashes his dad? I mean I understand he might want to be a better example to his daughter but at least side step such a question instead of bashing your dad on national tv. That gets no respect from me...am I wrong?
Sr was apparently not always a good father and Jr has talked about it before. They dont have the greatest relationship..or didnt from my understanding.
Ggg and kovalev have better fighters they can fight than Crawford (GGG could have Sergio, Quillin, Canelo, Lara, Ward, Chavez Jr) though Kovalev only has Stevenson and potentially Ward... They're also very fan friendly Crawford could end up being underrated for much of his career...
Peterson is an even lighter puncher than what Beradley is considered... Dude went life and death with Kahn ON PEDs AND needed that point deduction to win. :/.. This has to be a troll topic. The best chance would have been Sergio a little whiles back, otherwise no one really does anything good enough. Floyd is tougher, faster, stronger, hits harder, goes to the body better and is infinitely better than him at ANY range especially inside. Wtf? I hate Floyd but Peterson? I dont hate him THAT much to ride that wave
I do think Lara is VERY interesting though with his size, good power, stance and real skills.
He wouldnt be. I think Canelo has more upside than Vargas did and might even be a better boxer..so..before anyone mentions that...yeah. He definitely doesnt beat Floyd
I don't think he beats Lara it's a bad matchup but he does beat someone like Trout who despite being skilled with great size he just doesnt hit hard enough to keep Vargas out of mid range. He'd get tagged over that jab with brutal left hooks imo.
Outside of that there's what? Kirkland? Not enough skills to beat Vargas though it would be entertaining as hell for like... A round or two until Vargas lands huge bombs on Kirkland coming in and likely kos him. Failing a KL he'd outfight and out box him. You cant just bring strength and desire vs Vargas dudes not going anywhere unless you got a nuke of a left hook (ala Shane, Tito and Oscar who were all skilled and great).
Angulo despite losing to Kirkland I feel fare "better" vs Vargas but still loses.
Oh before i forget -puts on the anti hate flak jacket- he'd beat Cotto imo....
So basically he'd be among the top of his class but thats it.
Bute has real skills but zero chin (or confidence/a soul anymore). GGG has what appears to be a good chin. Canelo has shown thus far a sturdy chin....
Kahn is the closest thing to bute except he has balls.
Basically... None of them could ever be Bute they at least try to fight the best (Canelo actuallydid).
Upon further review wouldnt Berto be the closest? S hit i dont even know anymore....
I'd say Wlad, Sergio, Pacquiao in any order followed by bhop. Pacquiao and Sergio are at a spot right now where losing to almost any top guy in their division would not be surprising though Martinez gets a nod over Pac for me personally due to the clear size disadvantages hes faced from top guys in his class... B Hop could lose to almost anyone at this stage imo... I still dont see anyone beating Wladimir...
I just think its human nature. They know the big name fighter is who the fans came to see and will often times give them that extra time.
I think also when a guy is a champion you let him have every opportunity to recover and get back in the fight.
My best friends uncle was an NBA ref for many years and he tells me all the time that they don't even think about it but the crowd reaction often times dictate a close call.
This. Case in point the Yuri foreman fight where the ref told Yuri he didnt want him going out like that and letting Yuri continue. He let Yuri be a champ until the end.
But Id say most are influenced and some maybe intimidated or maybe not intimidated always but there's also bias.
If Golota wasnt a total nutjob.
If Martinez started boxing as a kid.
If Wlad had Vitalis chin.
If Pac got busted for roids.
If Floyd got busted for roids.
If Chavez Jr was dedicated to the sport since he was a kid.
If Bute had a chin :}
If Maligaggi had Baileys power.
If Trinidad and Oscar weren't idiots and tried to move up one too many and lose their souls in the proccess...
This is all just recent I can go on forever if I go into the 90s or 80s..etc.