This Era has a solid No. 2 Heavyweight - And it Ain't Anthony Joshua!

[Willow The Wisp]

He was laughing at you buddy

I've been bossing ****** people around for almost 50 years, helping them make their living. Those who can be taught get to earn more, and those who refuse knowledge continue to struggle in filth. Thats life, buddy. It's not a whole lot different here.

Bring me a real argument.

[Willow The Wisp]

Uh ohhhh!!

Let thy fecal matter rain upon us.... Let the flood begin...

Apparently this was an old thread. And it did indeed rain!

There's just a different spirit of analysis in these here parts... I'll say this wisp, we're in a week era for one thing, with pretty consistent competition. I also feel like Chris arreola and of course Tito Ortiz are underrated fighters.

Thats not a counter- It's just ******.

[Willow The Wisp]

Most people are ****ing idiots. Is that seriously what you base an assessment of skill on? "Most people?" Most people thought Joshua was a favourite against Usyk when it was clear as day how inferior he was. Most people thought Wilder Fury 1 was a foregone conclusion when it was obvious how lacking Wilders skillset was.

It's true. Very few boxing fans know much about the sport.

[Willow The Wisp]

It's really impossible to say who is best of era with fighters in same division without fighting each other. Fury can want to say hes best of era by saying Josh lost, but fury not beat the guys Josh lost to so fury has weak case.
The best have got to fight, otherwise it's whose got best resume and that's notoriously hard to say. Some say Josh has a much better resume but with 2 losses. What happens if Josh beats wilder also?
Things become clearer once they've all fought each other

You are correct. I agree. Losses to Ruiz And Usyk are damming losses, something that neither Fury (Still undefeated) and Wilder (4 Knockdowns and a Draw against Fury) have never suffered.
Fury and Wilder have done the business, but A.J., unfortunately could not join them, as he keeps losing terribly to Big, Big Underdogs!

Not sure why people are struggling with this so much - Its VERY CLEAR.

[b Murphington]

Honestly, Wilder and Joshua have to box each other. It’s the only way. At least that’s the way I see it, but I doubt it happens. Then again, if Fury can came back from a long layoff, so can Wilder.

[War Room]

call BS on that. You hear that "Joshua has fought better opposition" all the time, but its never the truth. I like AJ just fine, an exceptional Heavyweight. 3rd best of his era if he gets past Oleksander Usyk in the rematch (Arguably the 4th best if he doesn't). But the idea that he's had a better career than Deontay Wilder is a MYTH.
Apply some objective science, it trumps opinions and impressions Every Day of the week:

Here is the Data:
Points awarded to the quality of an opponent at the time of their fight with the respective champions (Title Claimants).
On a scale of 1-10 (One is a terrible fighter/Ten Is Hall of fame-prime of career level Champion):

Joshua Resume:

Matt Skelton, 28-8-0, Long faded former fringe contender, K-1 contender........4 points

Kingpin Johnson, 29-6-1, Gate keeper, non-contender.......................5 points

Gary Cornish, 21-0-0, Domestic prospect, non-contender...................5 points

Dillian Whyte, 16-0-0, Prospect in development, would emerge later as a contender......8 points

Charles Martin, 23-0-1, Prospect in development, fortunate to be a beltholder............8 points

Dominic Breazeale, 17-0-0, Prospect in development, fringe contender.....................6 points

Eric Molina, 25-3-0, Gate keeper, non-contender............................5 points

Wladamir Klitschko, 64-4-0, Ex-champion defeated by Fury, Retired, 41 years old.......9 points

Carlos Takam, 35-3-1, Dangerious fringe contender........................................7 points

Joseph Parker, 24-0-0, Top 5 contender, beltholder, would later disappoint........9 points

Alexander Povetkin, 34-1-0, Longtime top contender. Slightly past prime at 39............8 points

Andy Ruiz Jr., 32-1-0, Solid fringe contender ranked just outside top 10. .......8 points LOSS

Andy Ruiz Jr. II, 33-1-0, Fat, lathargic in the rematch......................8 points

Kubrat Pulev, 28-1-0, Another Longtime top contender. Past prime at 39............8 points

Oleksandr Usyk, 18-0-0, Cruiserweight unifier, untested at heavyweight...............9 points LOSS


Sub total – Quality of Opposition.................90 Total Points


Career building opponents:

Average ranking of Joshua's other 11 opponents.......................3 points

Bonus Points awarded for the sheer number of those early/lesser opponents............3

Grand total – Quality of Opposition.................96 Total Points

Weighted value – Point deductions for losses (Opponent value x severity of loss/Informed subjective):

(-8 points for Ruiz Jr I)
(-8 points for Usyk)
Sub-Total: -16 Points

Final Score minus losses: 80 Career Points for Quality of opposition value.










Wilder Resume

Kelvin Price, 13-0-0, Fellow prospect, non-contender...............4 points

Audley Harrison, 31-6-0, Long faded former fringe contender, Olympian......4 points

Malik Scott, 36-1-1, Fellow prospect, non-contender...............5 points

Bermane Stivern I, 24-1-1, World ranked title holder in prime............7 points

Eric Molina, 23-2-0, Gate keeper, non-contender............................5 points

Johann Duhaupas, 32-2-0, Top 15 ranked fringe contender............6 points

Artur Szpilka, 20-1-0, Lower regarded fringe contender, later disappointed..........5 points

Chris Arreola, 36-4-1, Longtime contender, still near prime...........6 points

Gerald Washington, 18-0-1, Newly emerged contender.................6 points

Bermane Stivern II, 25-2-1, World ranked former title holder............6 points

Luis Ortiz I, 28-0-0, Top ranked world title contender....................9 points

Tyson Fury I, 27-0-0, Undefeated linial (actual) World Champion, unification......10 points

Dominic Breazeale, 20-1-0, Contemporary contender in 2nd title shot.............6 points

Luis Ortiz II, 31-1-0, Top ranked world title contender in rematch....................8 points

Tyson Fury II, 29-0-1, Undefeated linial (actual) World Champion, unification......10 points LOSS

Tyson Fury III, 30-0-1, Undefeated linial (actual) World Champion......10 points LOSS

Sub total – Quality of Opposition.................87 Total Points

Career building opponents:

Average ranking of Wilder's other 29 opponents.......................3 points

Bonus Points awarded for the sheer number of those early/lesser opponents...................5


Grand total – Quality of Opposition.................95 Total Points

Weighted value – Point deductions for losses (Opponent value x severity of loss/Informed subjective):

(-7 points for Fury II)
(-6 points for Fury III)
Sub-Total: -13 Points

Final Score minus losses: 82 Career Points for Quality of opposition value.



Conclusion:
Deontay Wilder's career opponents earn him 82 points, while Anthony Joshua's earn him only 80. This fan-friendly narrative that claims that “Wilder has fought bums” and Joshua has "fought better contenders" is inaccurate. The reality is Wilder has fought better opposition than Joshua has in the professional ranks; and has rendered better result against them; and any counter opinion is simply delusion.

To Joshua's fans; Remember..........................Facts don't care about your feelings.
What you're reading now, is nothing but the facts.
If anyone can convincingly argue ANY of the merit values assigned to any of the fighters listed, I'm all ears. If you can't do that, or choose not to; the question of Wilder vs. Joshua's total Quality of opposition has it's logically arrived at answer.

Fuck Reading All That. And points, where did you get points from lol?

Wilder fought 38 bums in a row, that's the truth.

[billeau2]

Thats not a counter- It's just ******.

I hear you, I was being diplomatic. Joshua is a sacred cow.

[REDEEMER]

See, now this is what I'm talking about kiddies. This guy is citing something specific, and he's brave enough to step up and learn something. So.....ya...Chris Arreola, 36-4-1, Longtime contender, still near prime. And FIVE YEARS AFTER his beating at the hands of Wilder, he does BETTER AGAINST ANDY RUIZ JR than Joshua was able to do in TWO TRIES!!!!!! See how good that feels??? You're smarter now. It's like the Matrix Pill !!!!!

You know he’s making fun of the thread right ? You really lost the plot here so much posters who usually argue with each other are in agreement that sums up this ridiculous point ranking you concocted to make Wilder look much better then his real record .

[billeau2]

*********** Reading All That. And points, where did you get points from lol?

Wilder fought 38 bums in a row, that's the truth.

The fact you feel this way? Gives bonus points... Ill sayv 1,000,000,000,000 to the credability for what Wisp was parlaying.

[REDEEMER]

Not a bit of that makes sense. Are you feeling the urge to blurt out that Joshua is not only better than Wilder, but better than Fury as well? Should I even keep talking to you? Look, I've broken down the respective opponents of both fighters and assigned a quality rating to each and every one. This thread is WAY, WAY past statements that make unsubstantiated statements about Joshua having the better resume. That's been disproven. Go back and read the top of the thread CAREFULLY. And Don't bring nonsense. Lol.

Fury isn’t the topic you are the one saying Wilders the second best heavyweight and no one on the forum that’s sane could give me a legit reason to put him there that’s why you haven’t yet yourself and it’s your thread . Quality rating ? The question is should anyone spend time telling you that your point system is ? Well I don’t know what it is because it’s nonsense like any normal boxing fan can see .

What exactly have you disproven ? You only brought attention on yourself and rehashed a very poor resume that belongs to Wilder ? He literally has one of the worst resumes for a multiple defending champion any boxing historian will catch on to that if they just look up his actual resume .

“It's true. Very few boxing fans know much about the sport”. Well yea your proving that unfortunately . Smh