Sugarj

I remember before this fight was made thinking, Lewis is going to Kill Iron Mike. To big (height & weight) & pretty skilled. Tyson had already been KO'd twice before, some can argue the Real Deal was on his way to KO'ing him again before the ear incident, he was coming off a NC win for popping for pot, & not to mention he was never really the same after he did time (as most fighters are not). So again what was all the buzz about? Was it just because it was Tyson & the persona he carries? Was it an England vs. U.S. thing? All & all, it was pretty predictable before hand except for that "what if" Tyson catches him clean but Tyson was KO'ing quality guys anymore at that point of his career... Many of the English press row were picking a Tyson victory. A lot of people were taking the view that if Rahman can KO Lewis with one punch......even a partially shot Tyson can do at least as good! Tyson always had the aura and the casual fan bought the story that if he got in shape and had a decent trainer that he'd be 'invincible' again. Tyson was going bonkers in interviews saying he wanted to eat Lewis's kids.....and Tyson took a chunk out of Lewis's leg at one of the press conferences. His savagery appeared to be back!! He had quite a good run up to Lewis too. He looked pretty useful against Norris, Savaresse, Francis and Nielsen.......and had finished Golota and Botha with savage blows. I thought Tyson had a punchers chance too......and for 'one' round, he did look pretty good. Ha ha

There was an 1980s video (circa 1989) with Tyson and Harry Carpenter. Harry showed some footage of Frank Bruno weight training and asked Mike if he did any of that. Mike said that he didn't....but he did mention calisthenics. I'm sure that post prison Tyson did do weight training though........

Muhammad Ali in the documentary 'Champions Forever' about a fight with Tyson: 'If we can't get it now, we'll get it soon. If we can't fight here, we'll fight on the moon'

How come it looks human like in some old footage but when there is ringside fight footage from fans it looks Roy Jones JR level speed? I've read before that old tapes can't show the true speed for some reason but forgot the explanation? Less frames per second makes things look faster. I'd say that Robinson's handspeed wasn't far off that of Roy Jones Jnr. His double and triple left hook combos were exceptionally quick.....

Before the Thrilla in Manilla, I can honestly say I've never seen an interview with Ali where any of the symptoms of Parkinson's syndrome were present. But from 1976 onwards you can hear the odd slur in his speech or see the 'vacant' expression that is a characteristic of Parkinsons. There are times in his own movie 'The Greatest' where he is much different from how is was in 'When We Were Kings' from three years previous. The strange thing is, his symptoms weren't consistent......even in the late 70s. I've seen interviews in 1978 where Ali seemed fantastic, and others where you could believe he might be showing some symptoms of the syndrome. By 1980, you can see in the Ali/Holmes documentary that there was a marked change in him from 1975 though......and an even greater change by 1981 in the post fight interview after the Berbick fight. Despite taking no further punches, he was much worse again in 1988 for 'Champions Forever'. So it is debatable if his Parkinsons was started by boxing, or made worse by boxing. His condition has definitely deteriorated over the years. If one fight could be blamed I'd say the Thrilla in Manilla. But his plight might have been the same whether he retired straight after or before this fight. We'll never know.......

His last great performance was against Ruiz or Tarver I. Check out his fight against Jeff Lacy. For one last time Jones looked magic!

This would be a true classic, no doubt every bit as good as Benn vs McClellan. Roy wouldn't be able to do the rope a dope thing he did against Brannon, thats for sure. McClellan certainly has a punchers chance but I cant see Jones taking chances. McClellan was not elusive and I think this would be his downfall. Jones by decision for me.

I loved Hamed, thought he was one of the most tallented lower weight division fighters ever. Only the Brits got to see his true peak 1993-95 when you couldn't hit him with a handful of rice. Shame he ditched his elusiveness and combination punching for one punch power. The Hamed that fought Barrera was not in the same league as the guy who fought Steve Robinson even allowing for the gap in class of opponent!!

Cant believe no one has said Winky Wright. I'd have him train me! I wouldn't be put off by his recent losses, hes a guy past his peak but appears to have his head screwed on! I'd also think Antonio Tarver would make a good trainer, articulate, skillful (at his best) and disciplined! I think Lennox Lewis would make a great trainer too!

Eubank was one of my all time favorites too! I think that Jones, Toney and McClellan would have beaten him. But none would have annihilated him IMHO, decisions all round. I think Eubank would have beaten Nunn.

These are four of my favorite fights, such a shame about what happened to Watson in the second fight. I personally scored the first Watson fight by one round to Eubank, Watson finished much stronger and had Chris toppling everywhere in the tenth, no suprise that many thought he won, but Chris did bag several rounds early (it seemed to take a while for Watson to get going, bit like Hagler vs Leonard) and Chris only needed to bag something like one round between rounds seven and twelve to clinch the decision. He was the champion I suppose. Watson 2 was a superb fight, Chris started well with some great combinations but Watson's conditioning and workrate were incredible. No two ways about it round eleven is one of the best rounds contested in boxing history. Watson would have won without the brain injury. Benn 1 was for me Eubank's best performance, he was superb. I think he was treated in hospital for a mashed tongue after taking a sickening uppercut from Benn. Benn 2: I scored this a draw, but felt Benn did the better work overall. The low blow deduction surely cost him this fight. That said Eubank finished the stronger. When Tibbs screamed at Benn before the last round to give the 'best round of your career' sadly he didn't. All three were great fighters!! Eubank was clearly Emile Griffith reborn, so similar......even down to the lisp!

Heres a few random additions, some where the favorite may have won but the manner was unexpected: Lloyd Honeyghan vs Don Curry Tarver vs Jones 2 ( Who honestly thought Jones would get KOd in 2? ) Hearns vs Duran ( Who'd have thought the Duran who went a close 15 rounds with Hager would get KOd in 2?) Holyfield vs Tyson 1 ( Some casinos had this 33:1!!!) Liston vs Ali 1 ( No one gave the young Clay a prayer ) Foreman vs Ali ( Few gave the old Ali a prayer!! ) Schmelling vs Louis 1 Corbett vs L' Sullivan Randall vs Chavez

Well to be honest the Lewis that fought Vitali looked very beatable, I can see where George was coming from there although I wouldn't have bet on the outcome, Lennox was still powerful! As for Roy's power as a heavy, he looked fairly heavy handed against Ruiz. Also, Roy's chin has been much criticised since the move back down to light heavy, some people have assumed he always had a glass jaw but it looked sturdy against Ruiz (and he did get hit hard in that fight). I'm convinced that Roy's chin up till Tarver 2 was excellent, he took some almighty blows in several fights without even flinching prior to this. A fighter's chin can deteriorate over time particularly with repeated weight loss and age. Another case is Ricky Hatton, who could walk through almost anything before facing Mayweather. He walked through some almighty blows from Magee, Phillips and Tszyu. But post Mayweather he seems wobbly from what look like innoccuous blows from Lascano. Roy vs Holyfield: I'd shade a peak Holyfield by decision. His hands in 1990/91 were super quick (not far off heavyweight Jone's speed) and his workrate and conditioning were second to none. I dont think the heavyweight Jones could match Holyfield's workrate, but Jones would look great in spurts.

Ali said Shavers hit him harder than anyone before in round two of their fight.....no knockdown. Barrera hit Hamed with some sickeners too, one that seemed to catch him mid flight.

The Jones that beat Ruiz would have an even chance against many heavies in history, up till the 60s most heavyweights were around the 190-200 lbs mark and Roy was fast, elusive and powerful that night! Its more a question of who wouldn't you think Roy would have a chance against? For me the following would certainly be big risks for Jones as a heavy: Sonny Liston Muhammad Ali George Foreman Larry Holmes Earnie Shavers Mike Tyson Evander Holyfield Riddick Bowe Lennox Lewis Ike Ibeabuchi Wlad and Vitali Klitschkco

Hagler's look uneven too!

No way! Shane should not even consider 140. He'll just be another guy who went out a shell of himself by losing too much weight. Think Ray Leonard, De La Hoya, Roy Jones, Muhammad Ali, Riddick Bowe. Dont do it Shane, chase Mayweather and Cotto and dont touch Pacqiou at anything under 145.

Unbelievable! If one fighter signs to face another.....it is their responsibility to make the weight and be in shape! Too much is made of Duran's weight gain post fight 1. Some fighters lose a ridiculous amount of weight when training for fights and still come in strong and fit, think peak Ricky Hatton, seemed to shed half his body weight! Its not incredibly healthy, but it works for some fighters. It was a clever decision by Leonard, but its not like the fight was signed with only four or five weeks to train! The fight was still a big gamble. Also remember, its not like the first fight was a runaway win for Duran...........it was bleeding close. Its not like Benitez and Laing didn't beat Duran shortly after Leonard did in fight two either, no weight excuses there. Duran simply didn't like slippery movers and Leonard was just that in fight two.

Most of his losses, barring Hopkins and Pacqiou were very close/split decision losses. Not much in it between him and Mosley twice, Trinidad and Mayweather. I actually shaded the Trinidad fight, the second Mosley fight and the Mayweather fight for Oscar. Definitely an ATG for me, one of the best of the last 15 years.

He can come across as arrogant and I can totally understand why so many will want to see him knocked out. I've watched him for quite a few years and have warmed to his blatant over confidence. He does make for exciting fights, he is always in condition. I've also heard that he is good for making time for his fans and is obliging and helpful to up and comers in the gym. I do favour him to win this tornament too, but he wont find it easy.

I watched the Calvo rematch. Nazeem wasn't shot or anything, maybe just a little undermotivated. His reflexes and accuracy were not bad at all, he wasn't throwing combinations though. In the after fight interview he seemed well up for a Barrera rematch. I dont think he became a drunk, I'd never heard that. I dont think Muslims are allowed to drink alcohol and he always seemed to have genuine beliefs. As for why he didn't take the Barrera rematch I can think of a few factors: 1) September 11th twin towers attack, he may well have been a victim of substantial racial abuse if the fight was in the states. Sad but possibly true. The Barrera loss came shortly before this. 2) He severely injured someone in a car crash and went to jail for a spell. 3) His weight ballooned whilst inside and got to a point where it would require such tough training and abstinance to get down to featherweight. I'll never forget the Barrera documentary where Naz is speaking to his father and says something like 'I'm more looking forward to the food after the fight than the fight itself'. 4) He had to know that his peak was 94-early 97, he hadn't had a truely great performance since beating Tom Johnson and Jose Badillo (Bungo doesn't count, too small!). 5) He had two trainers (at the same time!!) both who were unsuited to his style. Emmanuel Steward specialises in orthodox boxer punchers and Suarez in a more South American style. Hardly condusive to honing his unorthodox style which had deteriorated since leaving Brendan Ingle in 1998. 6) He was always a family man who hated leaving his wife and kids for training camp. 7) He was and probably is stinking rich. I enjoyed him boxing, shame we didn't see more of him. He said he wanted to be a 'legend'. He would have had to beat Barrera in a return to even consider this.

I dont think Hatton was overrated either, he was clearly beaten by two guys who will rightly go down as pound for pound Gods of all time. Only one other man managed to stop Tszyu and Malignaggi each, I think Castillo too. Hatton was rightly the best light welter in the world for several years and was in many people's pound for pound top tens for a few years also. I do agree with Airforce that Hatton should retire, the scenes were worrying after the fight. His gorgeous girlfriend clearly suffered alot when he got knocked out by Mayweather and Pacqiou. His popularity and personality will enable him to earn alot outside of boxing. The simple truth is that his ability to hold a punch is not what it was, I'd hate to see him be the next casulty of boxing.

David Haye Shane Mosley Floyd Mayweather Manny Pacqiou Ricky Hatton Roy Jones Amir Khan Carl Froch Bernard Hopkins JM Marquez Some of these guys are shot, chinny, post prime, flawed......but I wouldn't miss their fights for the world!!

Great vid, Tyson was ace!

I've long pondered this one. However I still lean towards Ali! If you type 'Ali Holmes round seven' into Youtube its very interesting. This is just about the only round where Ali actually has some success. He is clearly much slower than his prime but he shows cameos of how Larry would struggle with a much faster prime Ali (from 13 years before 1980!!!!!). Larry clearly did not like Ali dancing and jabbing, he'd have hated it in Ali's prime!!

'Proud' is an odd word to describe how a fan might feel about Mike Tyson. Pride is what a family member, close friend or guardian ( as Cus D'Amato was ) might feel. I'm sure Cus would be proud of many of Mike's accomplishments and less impressed by others. Mike has made many mistakes, but he cant be judged by a normal person's standards having the life he has had. I am pleased that he is finding work outside of boxing and is able to support his family. If he trained off some of his excess weight and regained his physique I'm sure he would find more tough guy movie roles. He wouldn't have to get 'fight fit'. But a regular weights regime, some cardio and amendments to his diet could be quite lucrative for him. It would be great to see him as a boxing trainer with some peak a boo hopeful also.

I cant believe Larry Holmes hasn't been mentioned or 1990-1992 Evander Holyfield. Both those guys had comparable handspeed to Tyson, albeit not necessarily faster.

Cheers bud, and your girls gorgeous!

I've never seen faster hands than peak Roy Jones. Bruce Lee looked fast in the movies but remember.......he didn't have big, thick 8/10 oz gloves on each hand with bandages underneath slowing him down!! I'm a huge fan of his but its very hard to tell without decent comparable evidence. Just imagine how fast Jones, Ali, Leonard, Robinson, Zab or Meldrick Taylor would look without gloves on shot with an early 70s low budget camera.

Heres a few. Although many may have not smoked in training camps: Mike Tyson Max Baer Julio Cesar Chavez Joe Louis Frank Bruno Chris Eubank Carlos Monzon Johnny Bredahl I also have a picture of Ali holding a cigarette. Who knows if he smoked? I guess he would deny it!! I didn't know Ricky Hatton liked a ciggie though!!