Vitali's mythical poor resume pt 2

[BattlingNelson]

Well fighters have had worse injuries and completed the fight. Don't be so stiff in your attitude.

Nevertheless he was stopped for a TKO loss. You might have seen fighters allowed to continue with worse injuries, but there have certainly been fighters stopped with less. I did not find the stoppage unjust at all, but I found it very, very unfortunate and a rematch should have happened for sure.

[Daddy T]

I don't understand who the vitali fans are trying to convince ... themselves maybe? It would be great if people could simply respect him for what he has done, he has proved to be the second most accomplished fighter of his era (behind his brother) and most agree that head to head he would give anybody in history a hard night. That's my stance and I believe also the stance of MOST of the so called 'haters' here.

personally I actually like and respect vits it's the obsessive 'flomo'/pactard' type fans that I have the problem with.

Bottom line is his resume is okay but unfortunately there are NO really great or defining wins on it even if you look at tyson whom people regularly shit on resume wise he had defining wins v spinks etc people can point to that and say fuck on that night I don't know who would beat him... I obv think vits would beat the likes of spinks etc but the thing is Tyson DID beat spinks ... Vitali DIDN'T. What's vitali's defining win? one fight that you can point to and say wow he was like a god that night? Vit fans never seem to answer that one question ... as everybody knows his defining fight is a brave but losing effort v lewis. Who could have beaten Vits on the defining night of Vit's career ... well an old out of shape Lewis for one .... they have to bring in the 'IF But Could have might have' shit to get around that.

maybe if there had been a rematch against lewis vits 'if but could have might won' ... thing is there WASN'T

Maybe if he hadn't been cut up VIA PUNCHES Vits 'if but could have might have won' v lewis ... thing is HE WAS.

IF He had fought Haye instead of Wlad Vits 'if but could have might have won' too ... thing is HE DIDN'T

If he fought Rachman he 'if but could have might have won'... thing is HE DIDN'T

Sure he 'if but could have might have' beaten the past prime Tyson ... thing is HE DIDN'T

Sure he 'if but could have might have' beaten Tua ... thing is HE DIDN'T

You can't call a guy a top atg based on what he 'if but could have might have' done in the same way you can't give floyd credit for beating pac simply because you think he 'if but could have might have' beaten him.

Tyson 'if but could have might have' been the greatest of all time IF Cus hadn't died etc ...

the nuthugger arguments are basically 'look at all the nobodies her dominated ... because he beat a load of them he obviously 'if but could have might have' beaten ali... therefore he's clearly the best ever and anybody who doesn't agree is a hater.'

[crold1]

Interesting twist there.. so Don King was involved & influential in some of Lewis's refusal to keep his belts intact.. even if folklore is correct .. where's the integrity in NOT keeping all the belts he had unified? Fact doesn't change that he avoided fighting each mandated titlists... the excuse for Byrd & Ruiz was no one wanted to see it & everyone bought it knowing full well he was the dominant champion.... everyone wanted to see the rematch with Klitschko & again he bailed... that's 3 top 10 ranked & eventual long reigning titlists he wound up NOT fighting when he was mandated to do so by those organizations.

Byrd was a bad look. Ruiz maybe you just didn't read. Look it up. It's not folklore. Lewis tried to keep the title intact and make that fight. He took Grant while the WBA was having a hard time coming up with a mando. Ruiz avoided Lewis.

[B-Bomber]

Interesting twist there.. so Don King was involved & influential in some of Lewis's refusal to keep his belts intact.. even if folklore is correct .. where's the integrity in NOT keeping all the belts he had unified? Fact doesn't change that he avoided fighting each mandated titlists... the excuse for Byrd & Ruiz was no one wanted to see it & everyone bought it knowing full well he was the dominant champion.... everyone wanted to see the rematch with Klitschko & again he bailed... that's 3 top 10 ranked & eventual long reigning titlists he wound up NOT fighting when he was mandated to do so by those organizations.

I don't usually believe that fighters are "avoided", especially in the case of a popular boxer like Lennox Lewis.
Unless a fighter is not ready and risks to be utterly embarassed, if not permanently damaged, I tend to think that most professional fighters want to fight the champion, get a shot at glory... and make good money in the process.

I do not bash on Lennox for not rematching Vitali Klitschko though, he was speaking about retirement since a while if I'm not mistaken, what's more he showed up overweight and slow.

My problem with Lennox's resume, is that he didn't win his HW title in the ring (not his fault, but still), then won the lineal title by beating Shannon Briggs, who had won it from a 48 years old Foreman.
In my opinion his resume lacks of a big defining win, of some depth, to be considered top 5 HW ATG material.

As for Vitali, it seems to me that after his shot at Lewis he was mostly concerned about tag teaming with his brother, fighting guys who had enough power or inside game to possibly cause problems to Wladimir.

He fought Sanders (31 ko wins including Wladimir) Danny Williams (44 wins, 33 by KO, including old Tyson ), Arreola (36 wins 31 by KO, undefeated before Vitali).

In any case, I don't believe Vitali can be considered a HW ATG by any stretch, in my opinion Wladimir hardly makes it into a top 10.

[Boxing Goat]

Vitali is like the 25 ft great white shark, you only see every 100 years. He's an ATG, a legend. One of the best of all time. A 6'7'' 250lb monster that could beat anything down.

Hell yea, like a megaladon!!!!!!!!

Good post, even if you are being sarcastic.

[Boxing Goat]

hmm.. I think he did improve his defense when he came back after retirement.
Watch his older fights against Hide, for example. He uses his terminator defense there as well, catches every punch with his chin lol
He didn't bend at waist at all back then, looked like a tree lol

Of course he improved his defense when he returned. He was a much better and smarter fighter. Ray Charles could see that. Haters cannot.

[JAB5239]

Of course he improved his defense when he returned. He was a much better and smarter fighter. Ray Charles could see that. Haters cannot.

Ok, what exactly was he doing differently? Was he slipping punches more? blocking them? More head movement? Was he catching punches with his gloves ala Jack Johnson? Was he circling out of harms way more? Was he parrying punches? How did he improve his defense and become a better fighter?

Truth is his competition just got worse.

And don't pretend you don't read my posts. You can't put me on ignore so we all know you see them. You just have no answers like the rest of the kliterati!

[JAB5239]

My bases is on them never having beaten more than ten top 10 fighters before or after Vits, combined! Its impossible to determine how good a fighter is unless he's fighting other good fighters Anybody can build a glossy record fighting second rate fighters. Take Deontay Wilder for instance He's got a pristine record. Even has a 1st round ko over a former heavyweight titlist. If he retires tomorrow do we call him one of the best from this era? Or do we more accurately say he never fought anyone good to truly evaluate how good he was? Lets not make exceptions because you want Vits comp to be better than they've proven. Were they horrible (LaMar Clark style), no? Do they make for a poor resume though? Hell yes!

NONE of the Kliterati want to get near this because there is no way to refute it!

[Boxing Goat]

vitali klitschko linear champ! haha! that's a good one. you probably think wlad is linear champ because he beat sultan ibragimov lmao! beating the #3 guy in the division who happens to be a complete bum with zero legit wins=linear champ in the klitschko era of "dominance"

It is what it is, he beat Sanders for the Ring belt, meaning the was the one and only champion. Period. IT'S PART OF THEIR RULES, NOT MINE. THE RESIDENT EXPERT SHOULD BE ABLE TO EXPLAIN THAT TO YOU. There's no discussion about it.

Then Vitali beat the 2nd ranked heavyweight for good measure when he beat Peter apon his return in 2008.

[JAB5239]

It is what it is, he beat Sanders for the Ring belt, meaning the was the one and only champion. Period. IT'S PART OF THEIR RULES, NOT MINE. THE RESIDENT EXPERT SHOULD BE ABLE TO EXPLAIN THAT TO YOU. There's no discussion about it.

Then Vitali beat the 2nd ranked heavyweight for good measure when he beat Peter apon his return in 2008.

He did explain it and why Vits was never the lineal champ. Live with it.
Still ignoring the tough questions, huh?