So Beterbiev tested for high levels of HGH and testosterone

[dan_cov]

So it wasn't illegal levels, he's just more man that the other guy.
Or, on the other hand he should fight Canelo, no PEd's barred in the summer and they should call it the US Dopin'.

I could be wrong but to get to ''illegal' levels would require you to be juiced to the gills. I believe the limit is actually something as absurd as 4 times the normal level.
And baring in mind he is nearly 40 and we should typically expect his levels to have tapered down considerably.

[hhh1200]

I could be wrong but to get to ''illegal' levels would require you to be juiced to the gills. I believe the limit is actually something as absurd as 4 times the normal level.
And baring in mind he is nearly 40 and we should typically expect his levels to have tapered down considerably.

Have they posted the lab results? 480 would be abnormal for a man his age. ng/dL, BMI, etc are based on the common man. As stated, not the difference between a man of his athletic level and a couch potato his age.

409-558 ng/dL (20-24 years old)
352-478 ng/dL (35-39 years old)

[jaded]

I could be wrong but to get to ''illegal' levels would require you to be juiced to the gills. I believe the limit is actually something as absurd as 4 times the normal level.
And baring in mind he is nearly 40 and we should typically expect his levels to have tapered down considerably.

Illegal levels were never alleged by Vada. You can read the letter here...

https://www.*********.com/file/kw5u2...ative.png/file

All that it said was one or more specimens is being analyzed for performance enhancing drugs. After analyzing it 3 times, all were normal, and he was cleared.

[dan_cov]

Illegal levels were never alleged by Vada. You can read the letter here...

https://www.*********.com/file/kw5u2...ative.png/file

All that it said was one or more specimens is being analyzed for performance enhancing drugs. After analyzing it 3 times, all were normal, and he was cleared.

Okay thank you but this is the results for 21 December, a full 15 days after.
It was on the 6 December that the results was 'questionable' for?

[jaded]

Okay thank you but this is the results for 21 December, a full 15 days after.
It was on the 6 December that the results was 'questionable' for?

It looks like they collected again on 2 occasions as a result of the Dec 6th test once again in December and again in January. The 6th was not a failed test, it did however warrant further tests, which all subsequently cleared.

[M312]

Illegal levels were never alleged by Vada. You can read the letter here...

https://www.*********.com/file/kw5u2...ative.png/file

All that it said was one or more specimens is being analyzed for performance enhancing drugs. After analyzing it 3 times, all were normal, and he was cleared.

https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/b...-2-weeks-later

A link to the article jaded got this from.

Not sure why you closed the thread, uploaded the image and didn't just link the article.

You're using the images now! Was obviously useful.

The whole thing stinks of something dodgy. No need to defend it. I like Artur too, but it's not right.

[tokon]

What was reported was "raised levels" but nothing surpassing that threshold required to violate any rules or laws. Raised levels means anything between average and high but within a normal value range.

I've had to do blood work before and had one test come back saying I had high levels of hemoglobin (but within acceptable levels), and then when I did the test again, it was slightly lower than average. These tests will fluctuate for all kinds of reasons. Sometimes the time of day can affect the outcome of a test. Usually lab work taking in the mornings will result in higher levels of testosterone than if lab work is done in the afternoon or toward evening.

There are all kinds of factors that could explain the outcome, so it's pointless to speculate when, ultimately, Beterbeiv's test were normal. [/FONT][/SIZE]

This sort of touches on what I was wondering about the VADA testing protocols.

Testosterone levels are usually assessed within a "normal range". This can vary slightly depending on the lab used etc.

However the pint of testing athletes is to determine if they are using any banned substances.

Testosterone levels can be within "normal ranges" even when the athlete is using PEDs.

I thought that VADAs use of carbon isotope was supposed to determine if exogenous testosterone had been utilised IRRESPECTIVE of "levels"?

Apologies for my ignorance if I'm misinformed on any of this.

Thanks.

[M312]

I'd be interested to see the data from the 6 December. There is a lot of time between that and the negative results on the 15th December and beyond and I'd fully expect if he stopped taking his levels would return back to or towards normal or that would be enough time to potentially get it out of his system and back into more normal ranges, should that be the case - Not saying it is.
I am also lead to believe that urine isn't as accurate as blood testing. The 15th was urine and he wasn't blood tested again until 21 December - per Iole.
Maybe its nothing and could be a false positive or just a spike (not sure how much levels can fluctuate in certain periods to be honest) or maybe even a side effect from medication as I presume he'll have been on some sort of medication following his injuries and procedure.

My source is the Eddie Hearn video I posted and Kevin Iole who I believe broke the news.

"There was an atypical finding in Artur Beterbiev’s VADA test in December,” Smith’s promoter, Eddie Hearn, said in response to the news. “Raised levels of HGH and testosterone, not an adverse finding, but an atypical finding, which is still raised levels.

Yup posted a thread on this, but jaded closed it for some reason:

https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/b...-2-weeks-later

The time frames are not right at all.

[dan_cov]

Its locked so I can not reply but in regards to ''testosterone stays in the system for 22 days after injection.'' - I am not expert but I believe this refers to Testosterone Enanthate (possibly another ester would have a similar half-life) and even this is only detectable in urine for up to 14 days. Other testosterone esters have shorter half-lives and are out of the system a lot faster. I believe there are certain gels which are out of the system within 24-48hrs and there are definitely ways around clearing it faster with use of diuretics and so forth or masquing it in other ways. - Again no expert, don't take this as gospel.

[Toffee]

Lol Whyte had actual PEDs in his system, Beterbiev had high levels of stuff our bodies make naturally. You're giving these guys too much time.

So elevated testosterone is fine...

Trace levels of PEDs aren't.

How elevated would the natural elements need to be, and how low would the trace elements need to be before you'd be more concerned by the former than the latter? It is the answer 'never'. I'm convinced that's not right.

And of course why trust the scientists when they say the elevated levels are above the threshold but are just 'atypical', compared to the same scientists saying that trace levels are insignificant and consistent with an isolated contamination event?

It feels selective based on whether you like the fighter or not.