Tunney & Louis

[Bronson66]

[QUOTE=Dr Z;n32402779]

Things in England appear to be okay and certainly safer than the US, we rarely have lunatics massacring school children etc. I don't need a cane I have 5 guns in my cabinet and some very large and capable Sons.
Take a look at the recent news in New Orleans and Vegas!


Bivins, a good hitter? No he was not! Just get a hold of your marbles. His KO % ratio is a lowly 32%. It would be even lower with modern gloves.

No way shape or form should anyone reference him as his hitter by lumping him in the same boat with Marciano, Tua, or Tyson yet you try to justify who he was by listing them.

Bvins was but 5'9" tall, and had average speed for his size. And no real hitting power.


I know Dontay was wildly inaccurate and did not land as 100+ punches in a round. Really, I just wanted to throw you a new year's bone so you could claim a win for a change.


Open your eyes and ears old man. The London Bridge attack was not that long ago. The USA had New Orleans. Two things in common with the people who did these things were.... Besides having your 5 guns which are hunting rifles which are illegal to carry around except when you are hunting... you can always use your cane to walk around anywhere to fend off the numerous hoodlums in the UK.

I don't have hunting rifles.
The guys that Bivins ko'd and floored are testimony to the fact that he could hit.

He gave Coley Wallace16 lbs and ko'd him,Young Harry Wills24 lbs and stopped him,29lbs toJohnny Haynes and floored him 6 times,26 lbs toTony Musto and floored him.
What you fail to realize is Bivins was essentially a light heavyweight ,and,in several of his losses to.
Peaks.Pastor,Franklin,Walcott,Murray Baker, Louis ,he was conceding weight for example23lbs to Louis,31 lbs to Baker, 28 lbs to Franklin .
You didn't answer my question.

Which Bivins fights have you seen to make these inaccurate statements?

You have just had two atrocities in the US in the same week!

There are not ,"numerous hoodlums ,"in my city,I don't carry a cane and I'm well enough known in my town to feel pretty safe from anyone unwise enough to try and take a liberty with me.

Going to admit you were talking Bulll **** about Deontay Wilder's punch stats,or will you continue to ignore my posted proof ,you didn't know what the **** you were talking about? ?
You ****ed up about Wilder,just have the balls to admit it.
You think ko percentage is the definitive method of judging a boxer's power?
You don't think the level of their competition is a major factor?

[cfang]

Tunney of all the heavy champs is very hard to gauge. His heavy resume is two wins over Dempsey and a stoppage of the very limited Heeney. He beat 3/4 other guys like a past it gibbons and Risko but his heavy resume is thin. He also drew the colour line which affects his quality of opp. He does look very impressive on film though.

Joe Louis however had 26 heavy title wins on the bounce and what would that have been without the war? 35? 40? I pick Louis by ko.

[Dr Z]

Bivins, a good hitter? No he was not! Just get a hold of your marbles. His KO % ratio is a lowly 32%. It would be even lower with modern gloves.

No way shape or form should anyone reference him as his hitter by lumping him in the same boat with Marciano, Tua, or Tyson yet you try to justify who he was by listing them.

Bvins was but 5'9" tall, and had average speed for his size. And no real hitting power.


I know Dontay was wildly inaccurate and did not land as 100+ punches in a round. Really, I just wanted to throw you a new year's bone so you could claim a win for a change.


Open your eyes and ears old man. The London Bridge attack was not that long ago. The USA had New Orleans. Two things in common with the people who did these things were.... Besides having your 5 guns which are hunting rifles which are illegal to carry around except when you are hunting... you can always use your cane to walk around anywhere to fend off the numerous hoodlums in the UK.

[QUOTE=Bronson66;n32402838]

I don't have hunting rifles.
The guys that Bivins ko'd and floored are testimony to the fact that he could hit.

He gave Coley Wallace16 lbs and ko'd him,Young Harry Wills24 lbs and stopped him,29lbs toJohnny Haynes and floored him 6 times,26 lbs toTony Musto and floored him.
What you fail to realize is Bivins was essentially a light heavyweight ,and,in several of his losses to.
Peaks.Pastor,Franklin,Walcott,Murray Baker, Louis ,he was conceding weight for example23lbs to Louis,31 lbs to Baker, 28 lbs to Franklin .
You didn't answer my question.

Which Bivins fights have you seen to make these inaccurate statements?

You have just had two atrocities in the US in the same week!

There are not ,"numerous hoodlums ,"in my city,I don't carry a cane and I'm well enough known in my town to feel pretty safe from anyone unwise enough to try and take a liberty with me.

Going to admit you were talking Bulll **** about Deontay Wilder's punch stats,or will you continue to ignore my posted proof ,you didn't know what the **** you were talking about? ?
You ****ed up about Wilder,just have the balls to admit it.
You think ko percentage is the definitive method of judging a boxer's power?
You don't think the level of their competition is a major factor?

What type of guns do you have, then? You said you have a few. They are all but illegal in the UK. I pointed out that Bivins was a light hitter both statistically and on film. What film did you see that impresses you that Bivins can hit? Any fighter who gets knocked down says the opponent can hit. Yes I think the fighter KO% means something, but less when they are older or shot. I have seen Jimmy many times in films.

I am aware that Bivins fought at lightweight and heavy. DUH. This doesn't change the fact that I could not punch hard.

They are bad things happening in the UK. And rotten politicians in the labor party. It is a bloody show so to speak. The island is being overrun, the politicians may be mixing with young girls, while at the same time letting in troves of hoodlums. The police sometimes don't act in ******s neigoods run by Sharia law. And 90% of the citizens have no legal protection nor do the cops carry. Now the USA has its problems too, but we have an incoming regime that will clean up the mess.

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...



>>> Bronson, you ducked all of my ponits as usual.

[Bronson66]

[QUOTE=Dr Z;n32402999]


Bivins, a good hitter? No he was not! Just get a hold of your marbles. His KO % ratio is a lowly 32%. It would be even lower with modern gloves.

No way shape or form should anyone reference him as his hitter by lumping him in the same boat with Marciano, Tua, or Tyson yet you try to justify who he was by listing them.

Bvins was but 5'9" tall, and had average speed for his size. And no real hitting power.


I know Dontay was wildly inaccurate and did not land as 100+ punches in a round. Really, I just wanted to throw you a new year's bone so you could claim a win for a change.


Open your eyes and ears old man. The London Bridge attack was not that long ago. The USA had New Orleans. Two things in common with the people who did these things were.... Besides having your 5 guns which are hunting rifles which are illegal to carry around except when you are hunting... you can always use your cane to walk around anywhere to fend off the numerous hoodlums in the UK.

What type of guns do you have, then? You said you have a few. They are all but illegal in the UK. I pointed out that Bivins was a light hitter both statistically and on film. What film did you see that impresses you that Bivins can hit? Any fighter who gets knocked down says the opponent can hit. Yes I think the fighter KO% means something, but less when they are older or shot. I have seen Jimmy many times of fims.

I am aware that Bivins fought at lightweight and heavy. DUH, This doesn't change the fact that I could not punch hard.

They are bad things happening in the UK. And rotten politicians in the labor party. It is a bloody show so to speak. The island is being overrun, the politicians are may be mixing with young girls, while at the same time letting in troves of hoodlums. The police sometimes don't act in ******s neigoods run by Sharia law. And 90% of the citizens have no legal protection now do the cops carry. Now the USA has its problems too, but we have an incoming regime that will clean up the mess.


https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...

With the spelling mistakes ,it's hard to follow your posts. I didn't mention your countries crime problem until you started on about mine.The London Bridge car attack was 2017,7 years ago! The Rotherham grooming scandal first went to court in2010 and then2013.
You have had two ********* outrages in the last week!
No comparison!
Below is total nonsense.

the politicians are may be mixing with young girls, while at the same time letting in troves of hoodlums. The police sometimes don't act in ******s neigoods run by Sharia law. And 90% of the citizens have no legal protection now do the cops carry.


You haven't got any smarter over the years!

"Mendoza can do what he likes on Boxing Scene. Let's not let the horrendous mistake I made in bringing him back spoil any more threads."

Matt McGrain ESB Jan 25th 2023

[QueensburyRules]

My gut reaction . . .

Tunney had the skills to beat (U15) Louis once. The next fight won't be as easy, and in multiple fights Louis would come out on top.

Tunney had (the 1926 version of) Dempsey's number and would have beaten him six out of seven times.

But Louis would be different.

Dempsey is a better boxer than he is remembered, because of all the brawls he doesn't get much boxing creds.

But still overall, Louis was a better boxer than Dempsey and would likely be able in a trilogy to adjust to Tunney, and maybe even eventually hunt him down.

The first time out, I can see Tunney winning a decision from Louis. If Tunney could (and I think he could have) have boxed his way to the 13th round, he would never have thrown it away like Conn did.

P.S. I like to point out that Conn entering the 13th with Louis still had to win one more round to win the title.

Conn still had to fight, he couldn't coast the last three rounds. He doesn't win the title if he does.

- - Typically most miscreants on this forum want to match the best of their heroes against the worst of whatever victims they chose.

Tunney was only beat once by a middleweight in an otherwise somewhat limited career at heavyweight. Catching the Hollywood softened Dempsey after a fight with his manager who conspired to ruin Dempsey using the US legal system is not emblematic of what a legit fight would be.

Louis knocked out Conn twice, so Louis may not KO Gene who goes on a run, but there is zero evidence Tunney can ever beat Joe other than on Joe's worst day in the ring vs first Schmeling fight.

[JAB5239]

- - Typically most miscreants on this forum want to match the best of their heroes against the worst of whatever victims they chose.

Tunney was only beat once by a middleweight in an otherwise somewhat limited career at heavyweight. Catching the Hollywood softened Dempsey after a fight with his manager who conspired to ruin Dempsey using the US legal system is not emblematic of what a legit fight would be.

Louis knocked out Conn twice, so Louis may not KO Gene who goes on a run, but there is zero evidence Tunney can ever beat Joe other than on Joe's worst day in the ring vs first Schmeling fight.

While I pretty much agree with this, there is zero evidence any fighter could beat another in a fantasy fight. To many intangibles.

[Mr Mitts]

There is zero 'I saw him do it' evidence. It is all circumstantial. Mythical matches are good exercise because they prompt you to look deeper and there are generally strong disagreements.

[Bronson66]

- - Typically most miscreants on this forum want to match the best of their heroes against the worst of whatever victims they chose.

Tunney was only beat once by a middleweight in an otherwise somewhat limited career at heavyweight. Catching the Hollywood softened Dempsey after a fight with his manager who conspired to ruin Dempsey using the US legal system is not emblematic of what a legit fight would be.

Louis knocked out Conn twice, so Louis may not KO Gene who goes on a run, but there is zero evidence Tunney can ever beat Joe other than on Joe's worst day in the ring vs first Schmeling fight.

Max beat Louis by countering over his low left returning jab,
Whilst Tunney's power is usually underrated,nobody to date has equated his right hand with Schmeling's.

[them_apples]

As I stated, Louis would have little to no trouble with Tunney. Tunney is smaller, certainly runs well, but if he got knocked down by a an old slow Dempsey then a Prime Louis would walk him down and knock him out.

Like Joe said: he can run, but he can't hide.

He actually dominated Dempsey though, it's important to actually watch the fight. In that fight he shows plenty of looks that might give Louis fits.

Your comment about "not facing any black men" is ****** because it gives the impression he was ducking blacks. In his day it could have destroyed his image. he may not have even been a racist himself - the general public was.

[them_apples]

Gonna have to agree with the two posters above. Tunney would get it done and I would boldly say that Tunney could even choose to win this comfortably. He has the ability to avoid risks and would certainly choose to in this kind of fight. His own gastank and endurance would offset Louis' patience and unbreakable spirit.

The thing is it's one thing to be a good boxer as a HW, but to be blessed with having feet to be fleetfooted on top of that is even more rare. Tunney was a rare talent, just look at all the decades before and after him to spot how many HW's were like him.

One time the great Muhammad Ali did a tv show where he would look at all the past HW champions before him and offer his critique. He badmouthed almost all of them including Louis. But he had the most respect as a boxer for Gene Tunney. You could really tell how quickly Ali dropped his act and paid a lot of attention offering details of Tunney's skills. That was pretty telling.

Tunney, Ezzard Charles and Marciano are 3 boxers I have only ever heard Ali compliment in regards to their ability