Hey if Kessler wins this tourney i'll praise him all day for being the best. But You aint the best until u beat the best and thats what the Super 6 is, The best
Aren't most ppl just saying that they have him as favourite for the super6? which is not that surprising since he's the highest ranked and most proven at SMW.
That's not saying he can't lose - just that he's more likely to win than any of the other guys individually.
If he's doing this to get sections of the crowd on his side, he's going to get a bit of a surprise. Union flags don't go down well round them parts.
He already aknowledged it would likely turn the crowd more against him. But says a little more or less wont change a thing.
BTW i think it's the English flag and not the british he's planing on wearing along with the danish. Even more sure to be hated by the welsh for that i guess.
Floyd Over Ricky by KO
Cotto Over Mosley by KO
Calzaghe Over Kessler by bloody KO(I have a strong gut feeling pushing for the distance though)
..Both Barrera and Taylor both lost so that leaves them out of the picture.. 100
That's not a gut feeling. Pure common sense SHOULD tell you, that even IF Calzaghe wins it'll most likely be on points.
Nothing in Calzaghe's present power or what we've seen of Kessler's chin (combined with his skills) to suggest Joe will be able to KO him.
Not saying it's impossible. But Calzaghe has sure gone the distance against FAR lesser opposition with LESS proven chins.
No, it is actually Union Jack he's gonna be wearing:
http://ekstrabladet.dk/sport/anden_sport/boksning/article337923.ece
OK, i give. Had been reported as the english flag earlier on - but seems youre right.
I say no...There is no one in the MW or SMW class that can or will beat Taylor. He will reign as the MW/SMW king for a long time...Much like Hopkin did..
Neither Taylor or Hopkins have ever fought at SMW yet. Way too premature to talk about either of them as being "kings" there.
As for Taylors chances - First of all there's a good chance he loses to Pavlik. Regardless he should not be considered a favourite against ANY top 5 SMW. Certainly not against Calzaghe or Kessler.
Taylors best chance at quick succes at SMW is a guy like Berrio. But if Bute get's there first, i don't rate Taylors chances at all.
Let's see some proof before crediting anyone with the ability to just walk in and take over the SMW division. Haven't been done like that in quite a while. I think there's more than just financial reasons Hopkins chose to totally pass it over. Too much risk at SMW compared to the possible reward. Whereas Tarver was as ripe as possibly imaginable.
EVERYONE from MW to LHW were trying to land a fight with Tarver for that reason.
Predictions
Calzaghe over Kessler on the cards in a suprisingly easy bout. Kessler's going to show the world that he cant fight going backwards and he cant counterpunch.
Hey - Azteca noticed your predictions here - damn i find that a bold one. Allow me to say these are two areas where ppl will be very much surpriced the other way around.
Kessler is an EXCELLENT counterpuncher - who just rarely gets a chance to show it, because most of his opponents give up on bringing the fight to him all too soon. But he will revell in the opportunity against Joe.
And as for not being able to fight, moving backwards. Another area where we have little to go by - but where ppl tend to interpret it all wrong. First of all - Andrade fight clearly showed he's not devoid of ability to do so.
Second - Kessler's habbit of jumping back in a styraight line in many fights is interpreted as showing poor ability to fight going backwards - What it really shows is his excellent ability to controll distance and with great footwork put him in a possition where HE choses the manor of fighting, where he got the distance he likes, where he's ready and waiting for the opponent to walk into his counters that you underrate so much.
Kessler's defence is BASED on controlling the distance like that.
It may be that Calzaghe proves to be good enough to throw him off balance and take that advantage away from him (i doubt it). But as an analasys of what Kessler is good at and what not, i think you got it all wrong.
All the more credit to you if you hit it nail on the head.
If kessler were 2 beat calzaghe on november 3rd, and then moved up to fight chad dawson who would win?
I'd have to say kessler as he's fast, huge for his current weight, and hits hard. plus dawsons chin is shit so he proberly couldnt take mikkels shots all night. :boxing:
I would definitely think Dawson, although not thoroughly tested, is a bigger danger to Kessler (or Calzaghe) than the other LHW beltholders (yes - including old man Hopkins).
I give Kessler a good chance. But it's probably fair to have Dawson a favourite at LHW.
A brilliant Kessler performance against Calzaghe would be enough for me, to tip the scales in Kessler's favour, for the time being.
Nah u been watching something else mate, lets not make lacy out to be Totally shit cos he lost to JC,
Lacy stopped robin reid who is miles better than anyone Kessler has fought, and reid in his prime would beat Kessler,
Lacy in his prime would handle kessler as well.
Hindsight is a beautiful thing.
No, Lacy is/was not "totally shit". He WAS being overrated going into the Calzaghe fight and some Calzaghe fans tend to make a bit much out of that win.
BUT - it's fair to consider Lacy better than any single name Kessler has fought in his career. I think Mundine MIGHT well be better and would love to see a Lacy and Mundine fight each other (would also like to see how/if Lacy would actually handle Andrade). But fair is fair. Lets say Lacy is better.
Lacy COULD still rightfully be the no. 3 in the division. The poor performance against Tsypko was after all (presumeably) much due to the shoulder injury Lacy sustained. With that in mind i think it's fair to say these days if anything Lacy is underrated (except by certain Calzaghe huggers).
HOWEVER, even if Lacy is the single best scalp between Calzaghe and Kessler, Kessler still have by far the better recent resume. None of Kesslers oponents have been absolute worldbeaters. But apart from Lacy they are still a clear step above Calzaghe's recent opposition.
...and as for that claim about prime Reid beating Kessler - What a load of bull... I know there is no absolute evidence since they havent faced each other - and certainly never will prime vs prime. But there's absolutely NOTHING to justify having Reid the fave in that. Such claims just signal complete (and probably intentional) ignorance about Kessler's potential.
But hey - if someone prefers to aproach the nov 3rd fight with blinkers on, that's entirely their own choice. Now that the fight has been made i don't really give a shit how much some ppl wanna underrate Kessler.
Hope to see 'em eating crow nov 4th.
(for the record i have Kessler about a 60-40 fave over Calzaghe)
Denis Inkin and Froch fought in the amateurs - Inkin was the reigning Russian army champion whilst Froch was a boy
WTF????
Froch is OLDER than Inkin. So if Froch was a boy - What was Inkin?
I thought the winner of Yusaf Mack vs. Librado Andrade (on the MAB-Pac undercard) got the Calzaghe-Kessler winner.
What would their claim be? WBC mandatory?
Can't see either Kessler or Calzaghe having much interest in taking that fight. Think they're both more likely to drop the belt than waste time on that fight.
If it has to be a mandatory, Mundine is more interesting, provided he recovers from his eye-trouble.
In either case it won't satisfy the fans OR HBO. They'll be looking for something bigger - never mind the belts.
No, Green is definitely a top guy in his division. I think he fucked up majorly against Miranda when he put him down, he should've jumped all over him and not let him breathe but he got away and Allan paid for it. Simple mistake that any fighter could make, and I'm sure he's learned a valuable lesson from it.
Green should hardly be considered top 10 at SMW.
There's plenty better talent at SMW, who just wont get their chances as easily because theyre not american.
Realistically the worst thing that Kessler can do is to hurt Calzaghe with a knockdown and not knock him out. Either superior tactics or a one-punch knockout are Kessler's best way of winning. Otherwise Calzaghe will either flurry all night and pick up the points on the judges cards, even if he doesnt really hurt Kessler much. Alternatively, if Kessler knocks Joe down, but not out, Joe will likely get back up, throw caution to the wind and start banging. From what we've seen of that in the past, that usually involves taking some hard shots, going head on, absolutely brawling and generally giving a greater volume of harder shots than his opponent until his opponent drops, or until the fight is stopped.
Kessler, to me, hasnt shown himself capable of out-boxing Calzaghe. Though I may be wrong. He may be capable of knocking out Calzaghe, but nobody has come close to doing it yet, so I dont know. I've never even genuinely seen Calzaghe hurt so far in his career and he's fought heavier hitters than Kessler in my opinion.
This myth that if Calzaghe gets flored, but gets up, he turns into an unbeatable moster is pure wishfull thinking. All we can say is that so far it's worked for him. But he hasn't tried it against an opponent of Kessler's class. I think Kessler would revel in a situation where Calzaghe throws all caution overboard.
Due to Kessler almost always having to "make" his fights (Andrade fight the obvious exception), it's very much overlooked that Kessler prefers to be the counterfighter - and is damn good at it. Kessler's timing and accuracy would make this "all in" tactics of Calzaghe's extremely dangerous. Far more dangerous than against any previous opponent.
Yes - it has worked in the past. But by no means does it mean it will work now against Kessler.
i apologise dude
I was not trying to discredit Kessler just trying to balance the book's a bit as apose to the lack of respect Calzaghe gets and compared to Kessler
i am still inclined to suggest that Calzaghe has fought the better oposition and he has beaten every SMW put in front of him for the last 10 years and that alone in my eyes should at least generate enoguh respect to rival the respect Kessler is recieving
I don't dissagree that Calzaghe has overall fought better opposition, but only marginally so. (looking at more recent opposition, Kessler has the edge IMO)The same goes for what other ppl are saying. Most who are being hard on Calzaghe aren't quite saying he's done worse than Kessler. They're just saying that given his much longer tittle run, it's surprising he's not more ahead than that.
If it seems to you that Joe is getting less respect than Kessler - it is perhaps because ppl expect more of Calzaghe, given his 10 year run.
Im not really trying to discredit Kessler hear although you will proabably think i am but has he really fought any Top Top quality opostition and looked impressive how many ex World Champion's has he actually fought im not sure but id hazzard a guess not many apart from Beyer
Kessler has fought the following former (or present at time of fight) champs (one of 4 major belts): Beyer, Lucas, Siaca, Cesar Green and Thobela. Mundine only held a so called regular belt so guess he doesnt count.
That's 5 anyway, without Mundine.
How many Joe has on his resume? More, i'm sure - but is it so many more as to reflect his much longer stay at the top? I doubt it but havent bothered counting.
Just did count anyway. I make it 6 for Joe. Great case you make here :P
Well, that's just a whole load of fuck all.
Anyway, I'm warming to Kessler. Unlike his countrymen on here he seems a classy guy. I hope he recovers well after this fight to dominate the division.
Well SHB - When i look back at how you and a few other brits conducted yourselves from my first posts on this forum - you should never ever pass judgement about other ppls class or lack thereof. You clearly are completely without class yourself.
As for the mentioned names. Think of them what you want, but they were given as a simple answer to a simple question.
Taylor by TKO.
Taylor might win. But KO? Not likely, not unless Lacy decides to lay down voluntarily.
Taylor is likely never gonna be able to dominate Lacy like Calzaghe did. I'd give a fully recovered Lacy a decent chance at winning this one.
Im no Calzaghe fan, but hes going to whup Kessler.
Kessler in nothing special.
Oh yeah - forgot for a moment you're comparing to the great Carl Froch.
Obviously neither Kessler or Calzaghe can be viewed as anything special with him in mind.
So many great things come to mind when you think about Froch. Foremost on my mind is the great patience with which he has advanced his career ;-D
Pavlik is an incredibly tough MOFO and he definately has the biggest HEART in boxing, any other fighter would have quit or been KO'd/TKO'd in the 2nd round, Pavlik came back KO'd Taylor making him his punk ass bitch.Kelly Pavlik is gonna propel BOXING past the UFC and be the biggest STAR since Oscar De La Hoya, Pavlik is a WHITE MARKETABLE TOUGH MOFO that KO's everyone and does it IMPRESSIVELY, PAVLIK is now the FACE of boxing and nobody can deny it. Pavlik is the best white American fighter since Rocky Marciano and his HEART is just as great as Marciano's, PAVLIK IS THE MAN AND HE IS GONNA SAVE BOXING.
No.
Outcome was much as expected. Pavlik showed heart. But Taylor AS EXPECTED came nowhere near close to living up to the hype. Neither fighter showed the greatest of skills here.
It was a good fight between two of the top-players in a division that seems weaker than it's reputation suggests.
It was between two americans - so of course it'll gather alot of attention. But all these superlatives are completely out of order. Pavlik is NOT the face of boxing now (or at least he shouldn't be). He is in fact pretty ordinary when looking beyond the fact that he can bang. Let's see if he can even deal with the likes of AA before declaring him the second comming.
WTF?
Kessler's punch is suspect.
Tonight we saw that Pavlik's punch is the truth.
May well be true. But everything else Kessler does significantly better.
Kessler knows how to look after himself and for those few instances where he does get hit, his chin so far has shown absolutely no sign of weakness.
Therefore Kessler > Pavlik
:boxing: The stakes are rising and the contenders are calling; Lining up to test the credability of Calzaghe. Hopkins and Pavlik have recently expressed interest in Calzaghe. Fellow boxing fans have to agree with me on this one: Calzaghe is one of the most protected champions. It wasn't until Taylor-Pavlik match-up that Calzaghe was "pushed" into the fight with Kessler. Calzaghe must know that in order for a fighter to be recognized as a world champion he Must come to the states. He has only vetured out of his country once, and that was against a journeymen fighter from Germany. It's only obvious why Calzaghe recently hinted at the possibility of....retirement? (Kessler.....then Pavlik or Hopkins). We saw the destruction of Lacy, but was Lacy the best that the division had/has to offer? A fight with Pavlik will test your durability and a fight with Hopkins would only give some credance to your ....."Legacy?"
I think Calzaghe's reasons for fighting Kessler should not so much be found in what he's gaining from taking it, but rather from what he was losing by not taking it.
Calzaghe was getting a LOT of disrespect for NOT fighting Kessler. His entire rule over the SMW division was being questioned over his supposed lack of willingness to fight an obvious contender. Had he gone for ANY other fight he might have gained som US respect or he might not.. But no matter the critisism on him for "ducking" Kessler would NOT have died down - at least not unless Kessler was otherwise exposed.
I think the building up of dissrespect impacted on Calzaghe's pride more than it did on Warren. Certain statements from Warren make me believe this fight is STILL not Warren's prefered choice - but Calzaghe in the end was pushing for it to redeem his reputation. - Kudos to Joe for that. (something i was not willing to give hime BEFORE the Kessler fight was signed).
Ultimately i think taking the fight, has done more to redeem Calzaghe than some care to admit - and thereby makes him (should he win against Kessler) a more attractive opponent - simply due to the credit he carries.
When judging the worth of this fight from Calzaghe's perspective, you cant just simply look at Kessler. You need to look at how Calzaghe would have been perceived WITHOUT Kessler.
All that said - i still actually think Calzaghe made a mistake taking the fight. Simply because i think he'll likely lose. :-)
I'm happy to pay cash to see Kessler on his knees, pupils up in his forehead, as he uncontrollably soils himself in the middle of the ring. He's going to get LACY'D
And i'll be laughing my ass off when you end up paying money to see Calzaghe beaten into retirement :)
I think he'll most likely retire if he loses to Kessler. Sure there could still be good money in fighting an american name. A rematch with Kessler isn't unthinkable either. But i lean towards Calzaghe losing motivation and calling it a day.
Danish headline: Kessler tested positive for doping. :ugh: :ugh: :ugh:
Luckily, it was a German bike rider, named Mathias Kessler..
I almost died.. My god, the Danes would be toast on this forum.. LoL
For a moment cought me with the exact same feelings.
Follow cycling too though - so was also well aware of the bike-rider.
Wonder what boxing would look like, if there was suddently as much focus and control in regards to doping as is the case now with cycling.
Dont think it would look pretty. Scary thought.
kessler should get most if not all the money plus calzaghes house cause he's better
Kessler DEMANDING a 50/50 split is not the same as him realisticly expecting to get it. Think it's negotiating tactics, and they'll settle a bit short on that.
Not too far short though. Bringing two major belts AND accepting to fight in the UK entitles Kessler to a pretty decent share - at least in the minds of Kessler, his team and his fans.
Seems promoters have worked out their differences (who would have thought that would ever happen) and its now mostly a TV-rights thats causing trouble. That could still cause way too much trouble for the fight to be made. Even if it's all signed there's still a million things that can ruin it all.
If it actually happens i wanna go on record saying i believe in a Kessler victory. But i'll only have him a slight fave. in the UK. 55-45 or so.
I wouldn't be too surpriced seeing Kessler win by stoppage. Calzaghe getting frustrated at being unable to controll things like he normally can takes increasing amounts of chances trying to apply more pressure and sooner or later gets clipped by an accurate shot that he just won't recover from.
A Kessler win probably brings a rematch to Denmark...should be fun.
A Kessler win will almost certainly make Calzaghe retire. Cant see a close fight to the points going Kesslers way in Cardiff. So it would either be stoppage or very clear points win. I just don't see Calzaghe going back for more of that - obviously for the lesser part of the money this time around.
Plans to let Calzaghe fight Joe Spina (or another hand-picked american) may have run into trouble.
The IBF are insisting that Calzaghe first face their mandatory - Robert Stieglitz.
This could even endanger the planned october 14th event in Manchester. Or Calzaghe may have to drop the IBF-tittle if he can't work out a deal.
Poor old Calzaghe. In his 8 years as WBO champ he's never had to take the mandatory concept serious. He's been able to chose whatever opponent he wanted to maximise earnings. Must be damn annoying when someone starts messing with your buisiness like that.
i fear kessler is just to big for calzaghe. then again Lacy was massive for a super middle weight.
Lacy have/had a massive bulk maybe, but he was also one of the shortest guys at top-level SMW for a long time. - Way too much was being made of his size (perhaps of his skills too).
Too much has been made of Kessler's size as well - he's only about an average sized SMW. Yes he's taller than the likes of Lacy, Mundine (and Calzaghe for that matter) but there are plenty of fighters as tall as or taller than Kessler at SMW (Veit for one).
Kessler should be talked about for his skills - not his size.
As for Calzaghe-Kessler, the Veit argument makes sense. If it doesn't happen (and i don't think it will), it'll have more to do with money, skills and overall risk-assessment than with just size.
Bute may have a bright future ahead of him.
But Froch is a couple of years OLDER than Kessler.
Don't expect Froch to be dominant in any division any time.
But Carl has been calling out Calzaghe for YEARS, Frochy would of taken the fight YEARS ago.
So what?
Everybody who's anything has been calling out Calzaghe for years. Even though Calzaghe is objectively the biggest threat to anyone at SMW, he is also by far the most recognised name. Fighting him carries the opportunity of the far bigger reward.
So perhaps with the exception of Ottke and Beyer (who actually had something to lose), I wouldn't be surpriced if every significant player at SMW has at one time or another called out Calzaghe. And even Beyer recently showed he was willing to face Calzaghe. The right price and place had already been agreed on. But Calzaghe wouldn't agree on a date that would allow Beyer to heal from his latest cuts.
Anyway - Calling out Calzaghe means absolutely feck all. Only diff is that since Froch is british, the british press actually NOTICED this one.