No. Don't sue. Just renegotiate. Starting off high is status quo. 50/50 is too high. If it was 70/30 the 1st fight, and the 2nd fight was agreed on at 65/35, then make this fight at 60/40. And if they have a rematch clause, do it a 3rd time.
Now, if this happens, then GGG will certainly have to relinquish a belt or two. At this point I don't think it matters much. He doesn't seem too high on trying to unify with Saunders. I'd like to hear Loeffler and GGG to speak on that a bit more. They seemed to have COMPLETELY rule out Saunders and the undisputed goal. (which I don't blame. He's 36. $15-20m fights will win every time)
This needs to stop. In no shape or fashion, on any planet, should GGG be a 50/50.
Do I think he deserves it? Yes. But that's not how it works. Morality has nothing to do with PPV splits. Doesn't matter if Canelo does the most vile things. It's based off of drawing power.
Now, if GGG wins, and they rematch, and fight for the 3rd time, then a 50/50 is easily attainable.
1st fight was 70/30. 2nd fight was agreed at 65/35. This fight needs to be at 60/40 and call it a night. That's a $15-22m pay day for Gennady.
I understand that & that's exactly why I did it. There should be a historical account to show the extent & names that did avoid him rather than the continually spewed nonsense that his "resume is poor." The lack of names on his resume is not his fault. If you put half of the men that avoided him on it, he'd appear stacked.
Simply providing a quick reference for anyone that is interested in investigating the actual facts surrounding each failed negotiation. There are always reasons for negotiations to fall through, I understand that, but the sheer volume of champions on this list is staggering. If I wanted to delve even deeper & provide the names & purses of their chosen next opponents it would be even more laughable when the repeated phases has always been "who has he fought?" & "he brings nothing to the table."
Thank you both for the feedback you provided.
Honestly, I'd be interested in seeing that. List those very same people that turned avoided GGG and the person they fought right afterwards AND the purse they got AND where they were ranked and if it was ever a bigger fight than the Gennady fight they just turned down.
That'd be interesting to see actually.
To be honest, I think it would be wise for Canelo to stay away from Jacobs and Charlo. Tall, rangy, HUGE, smart, powerful, agile, long, athletic boxers will have Canelo looking bad.
So, really he would've been fine to take the flat 15 million to begin with lol loeffler and his clowns
In hindsight, maybe. But it's hard to know how big a fight will be. So, you don't want to automatically take ANY flat fee, and end up on the short end of the stick because the fight ends up being MUCH bigger than projected.
And I thought the flat fee was $10million. Maybe I'm wrong though.
You must have missed the part where I said they work out a deal with the guy they're fighting.
No. You can't just work out a deal with JUST the opponent though. You have to workout a deal with the WBA as well. It's not as simple as just giving Sulecki step aside money. He's in no position to do so. Sulecki wants a title shot as well. He's worked his entire life in order to get a shot and prove he's the best.
You can't just go to your opponent and say "I wanna fight a big money fight again and get a chance to be champion, is it cool if you let me leap frog over you without having to fight you, and make you wait for another year or so to get this chance again?" And you certainly can't just go to the WBA and say "hey, I know I'm in this title eliminator, but is there a way I can skip this title eliminator and just fight for the title all while you keep my exact same ranking once I call the fight off. Oh, and also keep my same ranking even if I lose. I'd appreciate it fam" Boxing just doesn't work that way.
It works that way every day of the week. How many times have you seen a guy been the number 1 contender then he has to fight one or 2 fights that's are not the title fight. Whyte is the number one for Wilder I think and they're making him fight someone else again as a preliminary for the top stop.
That's not the same thing though. You're talking about apples and screwdrivers here. For example: Let's say Whyte is next in line (which in reality he is for the WBC) and the WBC are forcing him to fight in a title eliminator against Povetkin - Whyte can't just say "hey Povetkin, we have to fight each other in order to get to Wilder, and I know you want a shot at the title too, but how about you just let me leapfrog over you so I can fight Wilder and you just sit on the sidelines and have to start this process all over again". Not to mention he'd be forfeiting his WBC title eliminating position.
It just doesn't work that way.
No it's about going after a man because of the colour of his hair.
I don't get why gingers get so much hate, they are people too last time I checked, I think non-oranges are just jealous to tell the truth, they wish they could have orange hair because women go crazy for it, they literally think they taste like orange (the fruit)!
One day in the future I hope gingers around the world can be accepted for who and what they are.
.........Oh
1. He's contractually obligated to fight Sulecki
2. The fight is now a WBA title eliminator fight
3. If he cancels the fight to try to fight GGG (after already being contractually obligated), he will get sued, immediately dropped as an eliminating title fighter, making him no longer in the sights of Gennady.
It'd be a terribly stupid idea for him to even think about that. Hearn wouldn't allow that anyway. Nor would Haymon.
I think people underestimate the use of training camp and the effectiveness of it. You train 2 months for a specific fighter. You'd need almost an entirely new camp to train for a different type of fighter. There's a reason why replacement fighters aren't always of the high B or A class caliber fighters (like a Jacobs for instance). Boxers take matches seriously, and rightfully so.
He should sign up for 24/7 365 for the sake of gaining back ANY confidence and legitimacy that he has lost. Both amongst his peers, fans, and the overall boxing community. Though, there is a chance he may have lost that forever. That's the risk of cheating though.
And I don't want to see any of those "random" testings that happen 1 month apart either. Do not give him a chance to cycle or microdose.
In fact, I believe every fighter living in Mexico and/or trains in Mexico should be subject to some form of this testing. The cost to administer these tests will always be an issue, somehow. From the guys that no one knows about, all the way to those making million dollar purses.
He is contractually bound to fight Centano in a wbc interim bout. You can't just pull out of fights unless it gets cancelled, someone gets caught cheating, or any other extenuating circumstance. You know how many people would never fight who they were suppose to due to other fights freeing up? Yeah man. Boxing definitely doesn't work that way.
Besides, Jermall would immediately lose his WBC mandatory spot as soon as he pulled out of the fight - which would do more harm than good, since Gennady would no longer have to fight him. He'd actually move down the list and be forced to wait behind Jacobs and Andrade. I'm sure he'd just love to have to fight both Andrade and Jacobs to get to GGG (which I personally think is it how it should go. I have no clue why he was placed so high on the WBC list as soon as he declared himself a middleweight)
No-one suggested this for any other fighter, I think we all know why.
Gingerphobia, plain and simple.
Highest profile boxer, in the highest profile fight to ever get busted. With the unique circumstances in Mexico with Clen, a unique set of testing would only make sense.
There are thousands of people that have to get refunds, lost money via travel expenses, hotels, etc. Lost the city of Las Vegas an opportunity for an influx of a minimum of $400 million for the city's economy.
This is about instilling confidence and gaining back legitimacy from those that are affected in such a high profile athlete.
Short answer: depends on how bad Canelo wants to put Gennady in an even worse disadvantage - split wise.
What I mean by that is: canelo CAN pay him more, obviously. But only if he can win. It essentially would be a "means to an end" situation.
If he wins the WBO, gennady will definitelyyyy have to bend over backwards IF he wants to go for 160 undisputed. But quiet as kept, he really doesnt APPEAR to be toooo interested in that the last 2 years. So who knows.
Not recently, but Oscar did say something to the effect of slashing their initial offer in half after seeing BJS’ horrid performance at his comeback fight after being injured for 1-2 years against that Akavov guy
Here’s the YT link:
https://youtu.be/tH15n4CDRHo
Oh. That was like 18mths ago. Id like to see how much his tune changed now.
Oscar has said previously he won't pay BJS more than a million, and they won't fight in England where the fight makes way more money. GGG will pay more and travel. No way BJ's fights Canelo.
Im not saying youre lying. But...has he said that recently? If he did, show me a link.
Only problem is, Tank gets hit alot. When he fights backwards, he's atrocious. The ONLY chance/advantage he has over Loma is a bigger one punch shot.
Tank has never fought someone that's more talented, more athletic, higher IQ, someone who is believed to have the best amateur career of anyone ever (which relates to tons more experience), someone who is just as fast, goes to body very well, best footwork in the game, has the best defense in the game, has the best plus/minus in the game (punch stats/defense is all according to compubox)
I say that to say this: anything Tank can bring to the fight, Loma has seen it - but what Loma brings to the table is absolutely foreign to Tank at this level.
People kill me with the #of amatuer fight ****! They fight 3 rounds on with head gear. Give me a break. When Loma takes 7-8 rounds of the same type of body shot Cuellar took then we will see.
The reason having an amateur background as extensive as Loma, and Rigo, and GGG, etc matters is because they've been in their with every type of fighter, all around the world, and proved they can adapt on the fly very well.
I mean, you can't have a an amateur background consisting of 150 fights with only 5 wins and still claim their amateur background is the greatest and/or gives someone an edge. LOL. That'd be ridiculous.
Wait...he referred to Gennady as a "big strong beast"?? Charlo walks around at 190, steps in the ring very close to 180, has 2 inches on Gennady, and a 3in reach advantage. Him and Jacobs are huge man. GGG is nowhere near their size.
I'm simply saying, calling GGG a a big strong beast when you're bigger than everyone in the division is a bit strange.
And if he's just referring to GGG's reputation as a strong guy who destroys people, that was a corny way of describing GGG.
Of course that's why he's saying that. GGG probably is stronger or at least a harder puncher anyways. That said, why would he belittle a future opponent? He wouldn't, if he's even remotely intelligent.
It was a corny way of describing GGG.
GGG is one of the smaller guys in the division. Stature and weight wise. People act like he's walking around at 200lb and is 6'2. He's fairly small for a middleweight.
Jacobs and Charlo are huuuuge for that weightclass.
But yeah, of course he shouldn't belittle him. GGG wouldn't belittle him either. He just has changed his eager attitude though. I've seen him hype and eager and excited about the chance to beat GGG. He was very confident. This interview, it changed up a bit. Not saying that he isn't confident though. Just saying he doesn't have that same energy behind is words as he's shown before last Saturday.
He's gonna have to wait a year no matter what, in order to get his Gennady shot. He might has well, in the meantime, raise his stock and fight somebody worth a damn so that once he reaches GGG, it will be that much of a bigger fight. Him and Jacobs would be fireworks.
http://www.espn.com/boxing/story/_/id/23338914/ibf-grants-gennady-golovkin-exception-fight-vanes-martirosyan-says-ggg-wins-fight-sergey-derevyanchenko-next-keep-title-belt
Golovkin will defend his WBC and WBA belts against Martirosyan in a bid for his division record-tying 20th consecutive defense, but the IBF title won't be at stake because the organization declined to sanction the fight.
https://www.boxingscene.com/golovkin-promoter-noncommittal-regarding-ibf-mandatory--127761
The IBF granted Golovkin an exception that will allow him to fight Vanes Martirosyan without being stripped of his IBF 160-pound championship. The New Jersey-based organization refused to sanction Golovkin-Martirosyan as a title fight, though, and has ordered negotiations between representatives for Golovkin and mandatory challenger Sergiy Derevyanchenko to commence immediately after the Golovkin-Martirosyan match, assuming the heavily favored Golovkin wins.
The IBF has given Golovkin just 90 days from Saturday night to make his mandatory defense against Ukraine’s Derevyanchenko (12-0, 10 KOs), the IBF’s No. 1-ranked contender at 160 pounds. Otherwise, Golovkin would be stripped of that title and Derevyanchenko would fight another highly ranked contender for it.
It looks like, atleast to me, Gennady said he'd defend his IBF title against his mandatory Sergiy next. But he will be working hard in the meantime to get that Canelo fight. He'd give up that IBF belt for the Canelo fight.
So does this mean GGG vs Derevyanchenko next? Is this why GGG was saying there is a 10% chance of Canelo II next???
According to the IBF, he HAS to face Sergiy next or get stripped.
Only way to avoid fighting him while keeping the belt is for Sergiy to accept step aside money in the event he's able to get Canelo or Saunders next.
Outside of that........STRIPPED!!
Fair play.
I'd have preferred we figure out the Derevyanchenko thing tonight or a few weeks from now, but whatever. There's too many guys in line to be f#cking around.
Now if we can just get Charlo, BJS, Andrade & Jacobs in play vs each other or some of the winners of these fights coming up.
That's what I want to happen. Good fighters fighting other good fighters. Instead, they rather wait around and fight stay busy fights in order to keep their spot secure as mandatory or next in line for GGG. No one is clamoring after Saunders for some really strange reason.
http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/356831
look Boxrec and see it for yourself.
http://www.espn.com/boxing/story/_/id/23338914/ibf-grants-gennady-golovkin-exception-fight-vanes-martirosyan-says-ggg-wins-fight-sergey-derevyanchenko-next-keep-title-belt
Golovkin will defend his WBC and WBA belts against Martirosyan in a bid for his division record-tying 20th consecutive defense, but the IBF title won't be at stake because the organization declined to sanction the fight.
https://www.boxingscene.com/golovkin-promoter-noncommittal-regarding-ibf-mandatory--127761
The IBF granted Golovkin an exception that will allow him to fight Vanes Martirosyan without being stripped of his IBF 160-pound championship. The New Jersey-based organization refused to sanction Golovkin-Martirosyan as a title fight, though, and has ordered negotiations between representatives for Golovkin and mandatory challenger Sergiy Derevyanchenko to commence immediately after the Golovkin-Martirosyan match, assuming the heavily favored Golovkin wins.
The IBF has given Golovkin just 90 days from Saturday night to make his mandatory defense against Ukraine’s Derevyanchenko (12-0, 10 KOs), the IBF’s No. 1-ranked contender at 160 pounds. Otherwise, Golovkin would be stripped of that title and Derevyanchenko would fight another highly ranked contender for it.
It looks like, atleast to me, Gennady said he'd defend his IBF title against his mandatory Sergiy next. But he will be working hard in the meantime to get that Canelo fight. He'd give up that IBF belt for the Canelo fight.
You do know that Saunders had already signed his part of the contract not long ago to face Golovkin and was happy with the money side of things? So, what's changed now? Saunders most certainly wasn't getting more than 7 Mill for the fight.
You're assuming Saunders is going to ask for big money before negotiations have even began. Assumption is the mother of all f*ck ups.
When did Saunders price himself out of a fight with Gennady? When has he given a price for the fight? He hasn't, so you're just talking nonsense at this point. It seems you're willing to see Golovkin swerve this fight and looking to place the blame elsewhere before Saunders has even given a price. So the only one not being objective here is you.
Huh? Good grief.
1. He most certainly wasn't getting $7m in that first contract - which is why Sanchez was even surprised he would ask that much for someone like even a Jacobs. By the way, they only agreed financially. And it was a contract offer FROM Warren. Not from Loeffler. So we don't know the ins and outs of what type of wacky things Warren included in that contract.
2. What's changed now? Maybe Saunders wants more money now. That IS a possibility
3. I'm not saying dont' talk to Saunders. It was an "if and then" statement I just made. You glossed over that. I said IF Saunders comes out the gate saying "I won't accept anything less than $7m" then it's his way of pricing himself out
People need to start reading and stop assuming that just because people are fans of GGG, it doesn't mean they will blindly agree with tactics that aren't fair. I'm all for fairness. And I side with boxing. Meaning, I'm a bigger fan of boxing than I am of Gennady. People let their disdain for Gennady get in the way of being reasonable.
For instance: I've seen numerous people still say that even if Saunders is asking for $7m that it should be done since it's Gennady's "dream" to be undisputed. People don't understand how big of a paycut GGG would have to take in order to make that happen. It's like they can't see that just because a boxer has a dream or a goal, they can only attain that goal if it's within THEIR best interest. We as fans don't get to decide what's in their best interest.
All the belts is Golovkins dream. Why fight someone else for 1 or 2 mil, even if he takes short money he'll make more than that and if he wins he'll complete his "dream".
Sometimes all dreams can't be attained in the fashion you'd like them to.
If his actions somehow contradict his dreams, then so be it. Sometimes things don't work out. It happens. I don't judge boxers for doing what's best for them. And I certainly don't sit around and wait for a boxer to contradict themselves and all of a sudden throw away their entire body of work and everything they contributed.
I think fans hold on to and nitpick at athlete's EVERY single word and hold it as gospel more than the athlete that actually said it.
Just another load of waffle and assumptions again. You really should stop doing that.
Does the thought of Golovkin fighting Saunders really cause you this much concern?
Of course they are assumptions. Hence the IF and THEN statement I clearly made.
Concerned? I don't have to be concerned. I'm not fighting. I'm a fan of boxing. The concern is for Golovkin and Saunders.
Same as if GGG said "I want $15m to fight Saunders" - I'd say the same thing. That type of coin just doesn't exist and GGG priced himself out of the fight. I'm all for fairness.
I even said they should talk. No reason not to talk. If Saunders comes out the gate with a crazy number, then talks can't go any further.
I don't get why you don't understand that. I'm not saying Saunders said that. Because as far as we know, they haven't even started talking yet. I'm saying IF he did (solely based on him asking $7m for a fighter like Jacobs).