Not to sound like Roger Mayweather but 31 people don't know shiit about boxing.
So true! Perhaps it was Roger (everyone is on drugs, but no one comes across as drug addled as me) Mayweather who kept voting for Manny after a major session on the pipe.
No disrespect to Manny, he's amazing but SRR in a class all of his own.
Bigger is Better? Sorry in Heavyweight terms bigger equals slower, lumbering giants that no one wants to watch (outside of Germany, that great boxing nation!)
All of the best Heavyweights fought at around 210-230lbs, this division needs a weight limit so we can consign these boring giants to the super heavyweight boxing fringe.
Valuev?
Tyson vs. Holmes
Lets not forget that Holmes took the fight at short notice, even given that Tyson would have won if they were both at their peak age or condition.
Tyson at his peak would have beaten any heavyweight in history other than Ali who would have danced around him and jabbed him to death for 15 rounds.
And please don't mention those big russians, Tyson would have got under their long range jabs and knocked them out with upper cuts, easy, no problem, too quick, too fast, too strong, too skillful, too much class and no steroids either, Mike was all natural power.
Vitali's fights are very good if the opponent is interested in fighting, like Corrie Sanders was. In the case of a guy like Kevin Johnson laying in the ropes all night, there is not much he can do.
The Klitschkos more often than not deliver knockouts: Vitali's KO ratio of 89% is the best in the division's history.
If they were Americans, they'd be big here because America loves a winner. But they're not and the old guard boxing media wants to keep them from getting popular here. It's a combination of xenophobia and resentment, and like I said, Lennox Lewis got the very same thing here when he was fighting: "boring," "jab artist," etc.
Unfortunately for these people, there are loads more European heavyweights on the way up, and very few Americans with any promise.
The difference wih Lewis compared to Klitschko's was that Lennox still pulled in the PPV figures and Wlad/Vitali don't. Thats why the networks/critics/promoters etc aren't intersested.
Lennox Lewis was someone that the US audience could connect with whereas no one wants to know the Klitschko brothers because for a start they don't come off well in interviews, just come across as big robots with no personality.
As people and fighters they are dull, but I concede that the lack of decent US Heavyweight contenders is a major factor, do all they guys who would have become boxers in the past now just want to be rappers or have I got it wrong? seems to me like there has been a major cultural shift in the states over the last 20 years.
Joe was a damn good boxer but even in UK terms I'd rate Benn and Eubank higher at his weight. If he fought Hopkins or Roy Jones at their peak the results would have been very different. Undefeated record still needs to be respected though.
Steroids help build muscle quickly but anyone who's ever watched 'Worlds strongest man' on TV knows that the juiced up body builder types always come last next to the naturally big guys, only PEDS that a boxer should be concerned about are ones that increase stamina or dull pain and these are all short term effect drugs which would show up in post fight testing.
Again re Vitali and lack of recognition/respect, yes if you look at the Vitali/Wlad in a purely technical boxing viewpoint then they are hard to fault but the general public want exciting fights, they want a damn good tear up (Tyson, Hagler etc) or they want showmen (Ali, Sugar Ray Leanord etc) The Klitschko brothers fulfil neither of these types and are a turn off to the majority of boxing fans who don't give a monkeys about purely technical ability.
As long as they are fit and healthy don't think it matters, Vitali is 40 after all and just look at Bernard Hopkins. Do think that boxers should have to have tests though, no one wants to see people fighting on when they are obviously punchy, if you have ever seen interviews with Meldrick Taylor late in his career you'll know what I mean.
And why is it that no one knows or cares anymore when the Heavyweight championship fights were once the biggest events in world sport? I'll tell you why, too many belts, WBC, WBA, IBF, IBO, WBO etc (WBA super champ and regular champ bull****). PPV has also killed it, the general non boxing public will watch a good fight (one that means something other than a big payday for promoters) but won't pay extra for it.
Boxing needs a unified legitimate world ruling body with one champion at each weight. Then the fights/belts would mean more. Put it on free to air, the advertisers would queue up to pay to get their brands promoted on it as the audiences would be HUGE and boxing would once more rule the sporting world. I've been following boxing for 30 years and I hate the way it's gone (won't ever stop me watching though!)
Bigger doesn't mean superior. Could you imagine someone like Joe Frazier (who was a truly great fighter) getting in the ring with some of these giants of today. Boxing has weight classes for a damn good reason, why the hell shouldn't it apply to bigger guys too?
How can it be right that a guy who's natural fighting weight is 210lbs has to fight in the same division as someone weighing 250lbs? The is only 28lbs between welterweight and light heavyweight, would anyone put fighters in together form these weight classes? NO, and for a very good reason
Stick a weight limit of 235lbs on it and bye bye big slow eastern european boxers that no one wants to watch.
tyson has only lost once and that was against Buster Douglas. Tyson IMO is a top 15 ATG heavyweight. Physically he was one of the greatest heavyweights of all time, just look at him on the heavy bag.
Tyrell biggs fought Tyson, Lennox, Bowe, and gives Tyson the edge. In his prime his record speaks for itself. Although, i can see the tail end of his career can effect how people judge him at his peak.
Unfortunately I don't think we ever even saw how good Mike Tyson could have been given the way his life went off the rails at such a young age.
If Cus hadn't passed away and had been able to keep Mike in check and not let all the negative influences (Don King, and all those hangers on) into his life then I believe that a focused Mike Tyson would have dominated the division for as long as he chose to remain in the game.
As they say, the star that burns twice as bright burns half as long.
Of course, those losses dont count and cant be used to downgrade Tyson, let alone Tysons losses to Lennox and Evander. They dont count as well. Those guys wouldnt have beat Tyson in his prime, and Buster is the only one who fought a prime Tyson even though Tyson wasnt at his best on the night. Lennox and Evander might have beat Tyson in Tysons prime, but unfortunately they didnt beat a prime Tyson as well.
Those guys didnt beat THE TYSON, just like Norris never beat THE SRL and Holmes and spinks never beat a prime Ali. If ALi and SRL reputations for being great isnt tarnished, then Tysons cant be either. Although a way to downgrade Tyson is that he never beat any truly great fighters. But how he dealt with what he had to play with is how Tyson will be judged. And he dealt with people as good as a man can do.
Exactly, Tyson was already on a downward spiral before he lost to Douglas (who don't forget was down for longer than ten in the fight).
Given the right people around him Mike would have retired unbeaten and would be now regarded as the greatest Heavyweight of all time. Of this I have no doubt.
I agree with just about all your points, except for you're implying that just because Maidana has heavier hands than Floyd, Floyd can't KO him. Maidana is slow, and if those looping overhand shots and uppercuts can find Amir's chin, then someone like Floyd who throws a much faster uppercut and more precise overhands, can do it more often. Now Floyd won't be chasing after him swinging with both arms, but we've yet to see what a broken down, tired, frustrated Khan looks like. There's more than 1 type of power, and some people don't realize that Floyd can and does hit hurt. And when he hits you with successful combinations, you start breaking down. Amir doesn't belong in the ring with him YET. Give him 3-4 fights and I think he'll have as good a chance as anyone (maybe minus Pac depending on how he looks by then).
Very fair points, I agree with almost everything you say. At present Khan is a work in progress, Floyd is genuinely the finished article. Not saying Floyd couldn't KO Khan, but I feel that as Khan continues to learn he will be better equiped to avoid those heavy shots.
I would say that we have already seen a broken down/tired Khan in the later rounds of the Maidana fight (and what a good fight it was!) but he still came back and won the last round, after being badly shaken.
I can't wait to see it but hope for Khan's sake that he does wait a couple more fights before he signs up to it as I'd love to see him win!, hopefully here in England at Wembley stadium (in front of 100,000 people, would be an amazing spectacle)
It's held up because they think the longer this goes on the more interest it will generate and the revenue will go up, all about money. They will probably end up making $60m plus each. Idiots, they could have been on to the 2nd re-match by now and made over $120m each as a result! Boxing now sadly all about promoters, Television deals etc instead of the best fighting the best on a regular basis. Too many belts too much confusion, whole sport needs a major revision of rules/championships. Still love it though!
Floyd will do something that none of Khans past opponets have done yet - He will make Amir pay when he throws and misses. Khan's connect percentage is terrible at this juncture. He throws a lot, but he misses a lot. He seems more focused on speed rather than accuracy, and Floyd will make Amir pay for those missed shots.
Look up compubox statistics on Khan vs Maidana, Malliinagi, Judah etc, Amir Khan's connect percentages are excellent and compare very favourably with any other fighter in his division.
Yes he throws a lot of punches but he also lands a lot more than I think you give him credit for, the boy is accurate. He will (given time) frustrate Floyd by dancing around him all night, will take all of Floyd's best punches and throw back in bunches with speed and accuracy. As I've said before if they fought now Floyd would win but when Khan moves up and has at least 2 good WW fights first he stands a better chance than anyone of beating Floyd, and I think he will. Watch his recent fights again, he is lightning quick and learning fast.
Is it just me or do people like xcaret who post that kind of s**t have no place on here? This is a boxing forum, not a place to put forward your xenophobic (look it up) inarticulate, racist, uneducated, ignorant and small minded views.
He must take the test, take the test!
Ok, we'll take the test!
erm, oh ****, er, no you have to take the test in the USA, train here, live here etc, blah blah
Manny is a congressman in the Philippines and they expect the guy to emigrate as well, only people on drugs are the Mayweather camp, they must be high if they expect people to believe all their BS. Just get on with it Floyd, don't avoid.
Wouldn't go for either fight for Khan. Bradley needs to step up and fight Amir. If he doesn't there is no guarantee he'll get the WBC belt back but if he does fight and beat Amir he'll be recognised as a multi-belt world champion which would help him get either a Manny/Floyd fight. If Khan wins he'll hold the cards and will give him a better chance of facing Floyd, either way the fans win because we'll be seeing the best against the best.
Cause have you seen these guys track record as the stars of boxing???
Floyd is in and out of boxing as it is convenient towards himself, Pacquiao is fighting second tier opponents, and the Klits its hard to blame them but they have a terribly boring style.
We need fighters who actively search for the biggest fights and are consistent.
We need fighters who actively search for the biggest fights and are consistent.
He's already here, his name is Amir Khan. And when he gets hold of Floyd the Avoid you'll all be as surprised as when Honeyghan Battered Don Curry into submission.
Yeah, it was a hard fought victory, maybe not "easily" but definitely a Khan win, Just look at the compubox scores.
Khan would win by a wider margin in a rematch. As I said he's improving and Maidana has already peaked. Of course Maidana always has a punchers chance of a knock-out as he is phenomenally powerful.
Maidana should forget Khan for now and will have a good chance of cleaning up in the LWW division once Khan moves up to WW.
Not sure how Floyd would KO Amir when he stood up to everything the biggest puncher in his current division (Maidana) could throw at him, Floyd not a big knock out artist.
Amir not ready yet, two fights at welterweight and he will be, plus Floyd not getting any younger whilst Khan yet to peak. Not saying it would be easy, Floyd is a defensive genius but I feel that Khan's speed would be the key to a narrow points victory.
Not a blind fan boy, just a considered opinion my friend.
You should re watch the Maidana Khan fight, Maidana lands a lot of punches on Khan. Not just in the 10th round. You could give Maidana rounds 3,6,7,10,11 and 12. Rounds 3 and 11 are pretty close rounds but there's an argument Maidana won those rounds.
its a closer fight than you think it was.
Sorry man but Khan won that fight easily, too many people get distracted by the 10th round and forget about the 1st. If they do go again Khan to win on points by a country mile. He (as he always does) has learned his lesson.
Khan would dance around Maidana all night and slap him about, Maidana all about the big punch, no real (world class) boxing skills.
Khan just getting better, Maidana peaked against Ortiz and hasn't improved his skills since.
Wtf
Just watched the fight for the first time (was away when it was on live) I gave it Marquez 116 to 110, he won it by a country mile. The whole sport of boxing needs to hang it's head in shame. The only reason Manny (who I admire hugely) won this by the judges scorecards is to keep the Floyd fight alive, too much $ at stake.
I don't much care for Floyd, he is hugely talented but is the epitome of that whole awful bling culture I despise, he also is nothing more than a child grown old. But after watching this fight I really truly hope that Floyd kicks Mannys arse back to the Philipine congress building. Floyd is at least as a boxer (if not as a man) truly legitimate.
Sorry Manny, but you have lost any respect by even trying to claim that you won that fight, you got your arse kicked sunshine.
Khan needs at least 2 fights at welterweight before taking on Floyd by which time he'll have honed his skills to perfection (people seem to forget he's still relatively young and still learning his craft). I think it would make a fantastic fight, Khan to win by narrow points decision because by the time it happens Floyd will inevitably have slowed down a bit due to age. You can't defeat father time!
Prescott will win this easy, Khan still won't give him a rematch though, after all why the **** should he? Khan has much bigger fish to fry, his loss to Prescott was a fluke, Amir has matured as a boxer 100% since then whilst Prescott has done what exactly? Beating McCloskey who Amir took to school won't prove a damn thing, now if Prescott beat someone like Maidana then Khan would need to look seriously at him.
Lets get it straight, Khan beat Maidana fair and square, would beat him again more convincingly if they met again (roach will have ironed out more of Khan's flaws by now, don't forget he's still young and learning his craft). Khan took Maidana's best shots and survived, he also put Maidana on the canvas. If they fought again Khan would simply dance round Maidana for 12 rounds and slap him about all night, probably winning every round. Khan wants Bradley but the little chicken is hiding away waiting for a pac fight (which won't happen unless Bradley beats Khan and makes himself more of an attraction). another bloody boxing stalemate!
I hoped that when the toebreaker (sorry, hayemaker) made a fool of Audrey he would go away for good, Fury should ignore him but as everyone else seems to be ducking Fury it might be his only option. Personally I'd happily watch Audrey take another good beating, because after that he really would have nowhere to go.