How viable is the PBC model?

[Boxfan83]

Why would a network pay big money for the PBC? Their infrastructure is a joke and they have a bunch of overpaid fighters who don't fight often and balk about any tough match-ups.


If a network wants to get into boxing, stay independent and just buy good fights....

For once I actually agree with you.

[El-blanco]

Yes the counts were soft core. Are you the refs nephew? Did it bother you? You love PBC just like me. Responsible safty for fighters. If I want to watch more blood and gore and more traditional counting I can wacth HBO. What's the problem my son?

What a ****in ******. Just give up.

[BoliviaChiLEsp]

Buying network airtime then putting on crap like Fonfara vs Smith? Can't imagine there's long term success in that

PBC could be the perfect platform for 2nd tier fighters to get to the next level, but no one is interested in crap mismatches. A respectable loss in a 50/50 fight on a major network could do more for a fighter than beating Joe Smith Jr

Obviously PBC is a paltform for 2nd tier fighters; the only "premium" fight they showed was Santa Cruz vs. Mares.

They build their boxers' careers then the good fights are shown on Showtime Boxing (they are building stars for Showtime Boxing).

[The Big Dunn]

(If there's a post somewhere that has the information consolidated, a link to it would be appreciated)

Tuned in for Fonfara-Smith and, as has been the case for a while now, the vast majority of the in-between-the-rounds spots seem to be selling through, the event sponsorships beyond Corona (Vivid Seats and Mobile Strike tonight) are coming through, the venues have been better positioned to sell tickets, and the ratings aren't bad either.

How big the business could be is still in doubt, but folks who deny that there's a business there are deluding themselves.

I think there are 2 things that we need to separate and discuss:

1. Is the business model sound- I think yes and the sponsors buying in and the commercials suggest this as well. The ratings being low is a huge issue but one that can be fixed by using resources better.

2. Is the product sound- I think no. A number of posters have pointed out the deficiencies in production, fight quality, moving around shows and some other issues. These things are fixable though.

PBC is still developing its brand but they need to make some changes. They need to accept the fact that a lot of fans want to see stars and not boxing. They should establish like a Friday or Tuesday night card on bounce/spike/nbcsports for "boxing" and use Saturdays on sho/cbs/nbc/espn for big names/ big fights.

I like the fact boxing is on but I'm passed just having it on. I would like to see PBC take steps to grow the sports fanbase, not necessarily just the fanbases of particular boxers.

[killakali]

Colon and Blackwell shared the same issues from their corners, and unfortunately with boxing brain injuries swelling can numb senses when they are most important. Some boxers can verbally give up to the ref or they'd their corners to do something as they stare in that direction for instructions, usually after or during the count.

If a boxer is still running the juice the only thing a ref can do is ask if the boxer can continue or consult his corner for soon stoppage.

Now that is all completely irrelevant during a sequence of punch drunk madness of flash or hard knockdowns. I think Fonfara could've kept on. The first punch flush on the chin for the first knockdown blew the wind out of him. The second sequence is when he get caught by 2-3 hit on the upper part of his head. He got caught, and Smith Jr. Is heavy handed. Now, we've seen thousands of fights on these sequences.

Refs are aware of the culture of boxing and safety practices, and they're also aware of dramas and repercussions if something goes wrong, ESPECIALLY now that boxing is being aired on a mainstream and national cast. You're naive if the ref isn't aware of the circumstances or doesn't hear consulting from the network, promoter, or commission.

I still don't know what you're debating. As I said, PBC is doing a good job with safety for a more appropriate responsibility. This is boxing, and its continuing to evolve mainstream atm, so please don't be naive that any slight consulting for safety isn't possible.

wrong. we get quick stoppages and late stoppages on hbo and showtime just the same as any pbc on network or cable tv fight. it is inconsistent. Clevery's face was a bloody mess and he was allowed to continue vs Fonfara. Victor Ortiz could have been waived off after the first knockdown. He got up but anyone could tell he was done, hence him quitting when he went down again. We have had that on HBO and Showtime as well.

And the biggest example of terrible reffing, showing no interest in a fighter's safety happened on pbc on network tv when poor Prichard Colon suffered repeated rabbit punches and the ref NEVER deducted a point or did anything to discourage the punches behind the head. In fact you can argue the safety has been worse on PBC with Michael Zerafa being sent to the hospital in an ambulance on CBS when he had no business ever being in the ring with Peter Quillin in the first place. The gross mismatch was approved by the commission and by PBC with little regard to the health and safety of the Australian. These epic mismatches should be outlawed.

[Lester Tutor]

bumping this thread is what we do!

[Scipio2009]

I think there are 2 things that we need to separate and discuss:

1. Is the business model sound- I think yes and the sponsors buying in and the commercials suggest this as well. The ratings being low is a huge issue but one that can be fixed by using resources better.

2. Is the product sound- I think no. A number of posters have pointed out the deficiencies in production, fight quality, moving around shows and some other issues. These things are fixable though.

PBC is still developing its brand but they need to make some changes. They need to accept the fact that a lot of fans want to see stars and not boxing. They should establish like a Friday or Tuesday night card on bounce/spike/nbcsports for "boxing" and use Saturdays on sho/cbs/nbc/espn for big names/ big fights.

I like the fact boxing is on but I'm passed just having it on. I would like to see PBC take steps to grow the sports fanbase, not necessarily just the fanbases of particular boxers.

"Stars" aren't going to be fighting Saturday or every other Saturday, so negging the product over the lack of stars would simply mean that the product has no chance to succeed in your eyes.

A "star" will generally ask for an 8-10 week camp, will look to maximize the financial benefit of their own fight, and will generally look to space out their own event from the event of another "star".

A lot of things will be settled with the next deal (having near all of the fights under one umbrella, I'm still of the opinion that the eventual deal ends up being with Showtime/CBS, will resolve near all of the timing/build issues that have led the critique against PBC); I just go back to the period when, I believe it was for 6 months, that boxing was stacked big event after big event (all on PPV) and folks on the boards, here and elsewhere, were left largely *****ing.

The coming welterweight unified/undisputed title showdown (Garcia/Berto winner vs Thurman/Porter winner vs Kell Brook vs Amir Khan[smh]) is going to be PPV, Stevenson vs Kovalev/Ward winner is going to be PPV, Wilder vs Fury/Klitschko winner is going to be PPV, Wilder vs Joshua is going to be PPV. Alvarez-Golovkin is PPV, with a few other fights possibly joining that list and all those are likely set for late this year/2017.

Boxing has generally been built around the fighter and the fight town/region, and i don't see that changing anytime soon, tbh.

Maybe I'm wrong, but Haymon seems to have the aim to get boxing back to that; NYC/Montreal/LA/Chicago/TX/Las Vegas/etc are settling into markets that Haymon plans to regularly stage fights and Haymon has taken the leap of staging fighters in their hometown.

And, personally, I think that doing things that way actually does help grow the sport (by getting back that local tie-in to fighters, for the cost of owning a TV, audiences get that chance to see "heroes that they can touch" and follow their journeys; the fan who tuned in to see the local star try and make it, my then get introduced to other area stars, and possibly good fighters coming in from elsewhere, who they then can follow).

If the goal is to truly regularly air fights, you're going to see far more Fonfara-Cleverly and Fonfara-Smith Jr type shows (good fighters who may not be the most well-known but in good fights) than Thurman-Porter type event (star fighters in massive fights that had 2-3 months worth of build-to).

[Scipio2009]

for one Hearn does some business with Haymon, not a lot. Most of his business is done in the UK. Who is Hearn working with right now for the Kell Brook fight? Thought so.

I read about the Skoglund fight on Big Dan Rafael's chat friday. Yuniesky Gonzalez has been on lots of Star's NY shows. I read he's fighting a tune up in FL then coming back on an HBO card.

So HBO's 12 options at light heavyweight are Kovalev rematch, Shabranskky, Monaghan, Skoglund, Mehtomev, Gvodzyk (who ko'd Mohammedi faster than Kovey did), Joe Smith Jr, Gilberto Ramirez, Jesse Hart, Brahemer, Barrera rematch, Pascal. It isn't better on the PBC I keep telling you. It is close to the same.

-How many fights has Eddie Hearn ever done with Top Rank? Hearn has been formally staging shows for Matchroom Sport for almost 4 years now, and I've got the sense that this may be the first actual fight that he's staged with Top Rank (whose entire involvement in the event, in case you didn't know, was to send over Jessie Vargas and shop the US TV rights to the fight, hoping against hope that HBO actually cares to air Jessie Vargas)

-You keep saying that Yuniesky Gonzalez has been fighting on Star Boxing's cards, yet you still can't even point to a single fight that the man has had even in New York (in case you can't take the hint, Gonzalez's full record is available on BoxRec and he's had all of two fights in the Northeast, and Star Boxing's full fight ledger, at least the events where they're lead promoter for, is also available on BoxRec).

-The fact that you had to count two super middleweight, a rematch that no one wants to see, and four fighters that HBO has yet to show any interest in airing, to get to your 12 names, is laughable.

[Finito2K]

As far as the FNF argument. Mares /LSC trumps anything FNF has ever shown add to it the other ESpn cards and the Spike cards and boxing in a better place now then having 2 f.ucking no names that no one cares about fighting on a regular Friday. Here's a suggestion go outside on Friday nights and do something if there's no boxing if that's not a option watch some old fights that you haven't watched yet. It's better then the dog sh.it espn was putting on. FNF was mostly garbage quit romanticizing it.

Mares-Santa Cruz was a good scrap. But the following fights from FNF easily blow it out of the water

1. Antonio Escalante vs Miguel Roman
2. Julian Letterlough vs. Julio Gonzalez
3. Scott Pemberton vs. Omar Sheika
4. Micky Ward vs. Emmanuel Augustus

[El-blanco]

Mares-Santa Cruz was a good scrap. But the following fights from FNF easily blow it out of the water

1. Antonio Escalante vs Miguel Roman
2. Julian Letterlough vs. Julio Gonzalez
3. Scott Pemberton vs. Omar Sheika
4. Micky Ward vs. Emmanuel Augustus

Two absolute classics. Anything with letterlough was guaranteed excitement. Real shame what happened to him.