Just how great is james toney?

[Nwahs !!]

I'm arguing with enough morons today, I'd rather not get into it with someone who has a muscled up gay man in his avatar.

But I'll endulge you this once, Toney was definitely not given a gift against Griffin, he was outboxed and outslicked by him. Robbed against Thadzi? Shut the hell up, how the hell was he robbed? It was semi close, but certainly no robbery, in fact, it was clear for Thadzi by my score. You're writing off all of his losses to bums as robberies.

There is no hate on my side, just someone who's sick of people overrating the hell out of this guy.

Im seriously starting to think that you havn't actually watched any of these fights we are debating about. James Toney was no out slicked by Griffin. The fatigued to the point of having difficulty standing Toney planted his jab firmly to Griffins body and head all night long while strafing him with solid uppercuts and hooks to the body. Griffin? Well he just retreated backwards and pawed at Toney with the jab, occasionally stopping to push Toney.

[SkillspayBills]

Toney is an ATG fighter with ATG skills but tended to lack that ATG work ethic. That being said he is a true throwback to fighters that would fight anyone anywhere. Great great fighter with skills that would leave you in awe. If he had that unbreakable work ethic than the sky would have been the limit for lights out.

[sterling]

What the f***? Johnson knocked out Griffin. Calling the FIGHTER OF THE YEAR 2004 a bum, the man who beat Jones, Tarver and Woods a bum? That's a bit too much.

out of respect for roy jones jr dnt u ever play that glen knocked out roy card u piece of crap roy was wieght drained and shot.
Tarver has always been a bum and woods rofl another bum form sheffield.

[Nwahs !!]

I didn't say Toney was schooled by Nunn, in fact I said it was closer than people said, you even quoted me on it.

I have seen the whole fight. I doubt a James Toney fan would show a highlight meant to make Toney look bad either, so there goes that point of yours.

So then why does the clip skip rounds, and only show parts where James is not doing anything?

Exactly. Watch the fight. It was close, either a Toney win, or a draw, but it was no Tiberi win.

[sterling]

Toney is an ATG fighter with ATG skills but tended to lack that ATG work ethic. That being said he is a true throwback to fighters that would fight anyone anywhere. Great great fighter with skills that would leave you in awe. If he had that unbreakable work ethic than the sky would have been the limit for lights out.

i agree with that my friend its all his wieght problems and stamina that held him back alot also cost him alot of fights.

[TheGreatA]

out of respect for roy jones jr dnt u ever play that glen knocked out roy card u piece of crap roy was wieght drained and shot.
Tarver has always been a bum and woods rofl another bum form sheffield.

Get a grip of reality, you calling world champions and hard workers like Tarver, Woods and Johnson bums? In that case EVERY fighter Roy Jones fought was a bum so Roy must be another bum too, just slightly above those other bums.

Sure Roy was weight drained, shot and all that, whatever makes you feel good, but he still got knocked out by both Tarver and Johnson when he was a highly regarded fighter so those wins DO count as achievements for both.

[GunStar]

i agree with that my friend its all his wieght problems and stamina that held him back alot also cost him alot of fights.

Yup just like Skills said, Toney tended to lack that ATG work ethic. He was sometimes a little too lazy in my opinion.

[Nwahs !!]

Toney is an ATG fighter with ATG skills but tended to lack that ATG work ethic. That being said he is a true throwback to fighters that would fight anyone anywhere. Great great fighter with skills that would leave you in awe. If he had that unbreakable work ethic than the sky would have been the limit for lights out.

That is exactly what I have been trying to say. For some reason people have a hard time understanding how spending 99% of your training camp trying to make weight effects your performance on fight night.

Its not just the physical strain of having to make weight although that is a huge part of it. It is all of the other preparations that you could not do because you were busy trying to lose weight. The running you had to do instead of sparing and mitt work. The starving yourself so you are grumpy, and cant focus when you do get to spar and do mitt work.

It really pisses me off when people who have never had to make weight in their life discount how truly difficult it is.

There is a saying. Fights are won and lost in the gym. All of James Toneys losses were lost in the gym. They were never because Toney was outskilled, with the exception of Roy Jones, who is 50/50 to beat Toney had Toney been in shape.

[GunStar]

Get a grip of reality, you calling world champions and hard workers like Tarver, Woods and Johnson bums? In that case EVERY fighter Roy Jones fought was a bum so Roy must be another bum too, just slightly above those other bums.

Sure Roy was weight drained, shot and all that, whatever makes you feel good, but he still got knocked out by both Tarver and Johnson when he was a highly regarded fighter so those wins DO count as achievements for both.

Glen Johnson is easily one of the most underrated fighters today, the only men who dominated Johnson was Hopkins, when Johnson was green. I agree Tarver, Woods and Johnson are not bums.

[GunStar]

That is exactly what I have been trying to say. For some reason people have a hard time understanding how spending 99% of your training camp trying to make weight effects your performance on fight night.

Its not just the physical strain of having to make weight although that is a huge part of it. It is all of the other preparations that you could not do because you were busy trying to lose weight. The running you had to do instead of sparing and mitt work. The starving yourself so you are grumpy, and cant focus when you do get to spar and do mitt work.

It really pisses me off when people who have never had to make weight in their life discount how truly difficult it is.

There is a saying. Fights are won and lost in the gym. All of James Toneys losses were lost in the gym. They were never because Toney was outskilled, with the exception of Roy Jones, who is 50/50 to beat Toney had Toney been in shape.

Well said, my friend!