Hagler vs RJJ

[Boxing Bob]

Nunn was the mandatory #1 contender. He was no more past his prime than the 34 y/o Hill (coming off a loss) was. You seem to have a blind spot when it comes to Roy Jones Jr.

remember Scott, you're trying to have a logical discussion with someone who doesn't think Whitaker was hosed vs Chavez

[joseph5620]

a. we are talking about mw and some smw,,, jones bumped up to light heavy as nunn became his #1 and collins, and liles were both champs and trying to get roy to unify 168,, plus the benn and eubanks fights that should have happened in 95,96

Out of all the guys you listed,, they are all pretty much pedestrian competition,,, Tarver was legit and he beat roy up,,,
Lucas, sosa, telesco, hall, were all pathetic choices when other bigger fights were available to roy.....
Harding has one good win over young tarver,,
griffin got lucky vs toney twice
Reggie johnson was a good fight but at the end of his career
Clinton woods was a very good victory but that was in 2002


All you have to do is ask how many ppv's did roy headline in his prime,,
2--- he had the toney fight, then ruiz,,,
Between that he fought good fighters, but nothing special,,, thats why none of his fights were on ppv,,,,
He just stayed on regular hbo and beat up b level fighter or worse,,,,

All the guys you named wouldnt have been as big as the fights that i said roy didnt take...

No, I wasn't. Most of those fighters I listed were light heavyweights. You claimed that Jones didn't face any top challengers between Toney and Ruiz which is honestly ridiculous. You have an excuse for every one of them but it doesn't change history or the way they were viewed at the time of the fight. They were rated highly in the division whether you want to accept it or not.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

No, I wasn't. Most of those fighters I listed were light heavyweights. You claimed that Jones didn't face any top challengers between Toney and Ruiz which is honestly ridiculous. You have an excuse for every one of them but it doesn't change history or the way they were viewed at the time of the fight. They were rated highly in the division whether you want to accept it or not.

Yes your correct,, im not complaining about jones' lhw resume,,, he clearly cleaned it out,,,,

Im just saying that at his peak in the mid 90's there was a ton of fights to be made,,, and jones didnt make any of them....


eubanks, liles, nunn, benn, G-man, collins fights are >>>>>>> than a hill, griffin, telesco, hall, johnson fights,,,,

How many ppv's did roy headline.....

for being the fighter of the decade in the 90's his resume lacks compared to oscar, manny, ali, SRL etc...

Thats all im saying

[Scott9945]

Yes your correct,, im not complaining about jones' lhw resume,,, he clearly cleaned it out,,,,

Im just saying that at his peak in the mid 90's there was a ton of fights to be made,,, and jones didnt make any of them....


eubanks, liles, nunn, benn, G-man, collins fights are >>>>>>> than a hill, griffin, telesco, hall, johnson fights,,,,

How many ppv's did roy headline.....

for being the fighter of the decade in the 90's his resume lacks compared to oscar, manny, ali, SRL etc...



Thats all im saying

Going on memory, the PPV's Roy headlined were against Toney, Pazienza, Griffin II, Ruiz, and all of the Tarver fights.

If we're being honest, none of the fighters that you preferred would have been legit PPV opponents in the US.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Going on memory, the PPV's Roy headlined were against Toney, Pazienza, Griffin II, Ruiz, and all of the Tarver fights.

If we're being honest, none of the fighters that you preferred would have been legit PPV opponents in the US.

eubanks, benn, g-man, liles, and collins would have all been better ppv's then say vinny paz,, and griffin only was ppv because he dubiously beat jones the first time,,,

but still you have 4 ppvs and only toney and ruiz and tarver were legit ones,,,

vinny paz was never a threat to roy,,, dude could hardly get past a 50 year old duran

[Scott9945]

eubanks, benn, g-man, liles, and collins would have all been better ppv's then say vinny paz,, and griffin only was ppv because he dubiously beat jones the first time,,,

but still you have 4 ppvs and only toney and ruiz and tarver were legit ones,,,

vinny paz was never a threat to roy,,, dude could hardly get past a 50 year old duran

Those guys couldn't sell PPV in the US. Three of those names were big in the UK, but that means nothing here. There was only a tiny window for a McClellan fight, and he wasn't nearly as popular as his legend would lead people to believe. Nobody ever cared about Liles.

I do agree that Pazienza as a challenger to RJ was a joke.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Those guys couldn't sell PPV in the US. Three of those names were big in the UK, but that means nothing here. There was only a tiny window for a McClellan fight, and he wasn't nearly as popular as his legend would lead people to believe. Nobody ever cared about Liles.

I do agree that Pazienza as a challenger to RJ was a joke.

Hatton did huge numbers with floyd,,,,
'
there was always talk of toney fighting benn or eubanks and those would have been big events,, especially after the benn-eubanks rematch draw,,, and after benn beat-up mcclellan, a roy fight would have been big,,,,

I understand what your saying about how those guys werent big US names, but with the HBO hype train,, and the star power of roy jones,, it would have been successful ppv's... not like a tito-oscar or tyson-holyfield,, but would have had respectable numbers,,,

even calzaghe and ancient roy was on ppv and did decent numbers in the 250k range,,,

And i think prime roy beats all those guys i have mentioned,, i just wish he would have been more pro-active when it came to matchmaking,,,

Roy could have been as big as SRL, or FLoyd had he not fought such a relaxed schedule during his prime years...

[Scott9945]

Hatton did huge numbers with floyd,,,,
'
there was always talk of toney fighting benn or eubanks and those would have been big events,, especially after the benn-eubanks rematch draw,,, and after benn beat-up mcclellan, a roy fight would have been big,,,,

I understand what your saying about how those guys werent big US names, but with the HBO hype train,, and the star power of roy jones,, it would have been successful ppv's... not like a tito-oscar or tyson-holyfield,, but would have had respectable numbers,,,

even calzaghe and ancient roy was on ppv and did decent numbers in the 250k range,,,

And i think prime roy beats all those guys i have mentioned,, i just wish he would have been more pro-active when it came to matchmaking,,,

Roy could have been as big as SRL, or FLoyd had he not fought such a relaxed schedule during his prime years...

First of all I agree with your last two paragraphs, so we're not too far apart on this issue.

Hatton was very popular worldwide and he brought a lot of UK fans to the US to see him fight. The timing for his fight with Floyd was right and you had two fighters with perfect records. Some UK fighters are more popular than others here. They were expecting Amir Khan to be popular here and the attendance for his fights has been dismal.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

First of all I agree with your last two paragraphs, so we're not too far apart on this issue.

Hatton was very popular worldwide and he brought a lot of UK fans to the US to see him fight. The timing for his fight with Floyd was right and you had two fighters with perfect records. Some UK fighters are more popular than others here. They were expecting Amir Khan to be popular here and the attendance for his fights has been dismal.

Khan did himself no favors by getting ko'd by prescott,,,

He was starting to make a global name for himself but peterson and garcia fights pretty much ruined his drawing power,,, Im a big khan fan just because of his style,, but he has shot himself in the foot one too many times, and the fact he couldnt secure the bradley fight,,,,
I think if khan could have secured and beaten bradley,, he would have gotten a floyd fight,,,
hell they are still talking about him as a possible opponent,,, FLoyd realizes that it is better to have 2 countries then just 1 in a ppv,, thats why he fights cotto, hatton, jmm, etc,,,,, all those guys bring a different demographic than just the casual american fan.....

Roy could have been a huge megastar on the level of oscar, floyd and manny but his fights never excited the masses except for the toney, ruiz and tarver fights,,, and ruiz and tarver came at the very end of his prime,,,

I just wish that roy had a couple more major fights between 1994-1997... I dont complain much about his lhw resume because he did beat everyone around except for michlewski, and both roy and michlewski are to blame for that in my opinion......

And im not saying he had to fight all the guys i listed,, but at least 2 of them.. i would be happy with eubanks or benn in 95,,, and then maybe liles or collins in late 96 or early 97........

[SCtrojansbaby]

Nunn had faster hands and had more power than Hill. Virgil was more accomplished, but not nearly as talented. Nobody thought Hill had a chance against Jones. And I guess Dariusz is a great fighter to Jones fans, except when someone claims Roy ducked him (too).

No one though Nunn had a chance. Hill was a MUCH better fighter at that point and a tougher challenge for Roy period.

Also who has ever said Dariusz wasn't great? The hypocrisy is irrational Roy Jones haters who say Dariusz was great but call Gonzalez a bum