the myth that todays fat HW's are bigger and stronger

[joe strong]

today's HW's are protected. just because they are big doesn't mean they are better. they just don't fight anybody good. they are spoonfed journeymen & the odd past his best fighter & they get a title shot. in the 70,80 & 90's everyone fought each other & a couple losses didn't hurt you as a contender. today you beat monte barrett & you get a title shot. you use to have to beat a couple top 10 guys before you were considered. today the division is weak & protected. if the "0" goes you are now a failure or overrrated, etc...guys call frans botha a bum but he fought everybody no matter how big or tough they were. he never ducked anyone & he only lost to the best when he was in his prime. even today at 43 he will still go all out vs anyone.

[JAB5239]

Those are all single examples guys, no one is saying that every big guy is stronger than every smaller guy. But fact is, average 230 guy is stronger than average 200 pounds guy. Just like it is in weightlifting and powerflifting sports. There are some smaller mans able to lift bigger weight, but in general you will always see bigger results in the highest weight classes.

I agree with this,but what about when the 230lb man is fat and when the 200lb man (like Frazier) is trained down to optimum weight?

[Mintcar923]

It seems like its mainly a Russian thing with the Klits and several others who are huge. Its strange how this transpired because I hardly recall any Russian heavyweights years ago. I remember Yuri Vaulin who appeared to be a pretty good contender before his loss to Tommy Morrison. But, he wasn't as big as a lot of the guys now.

[JAB5239]

If those fat heavyweights we see today would get themselves into shape that Joe Frazier was getting himself into, it would help them in a lot of ways, but when it comes to physical strength, it would must likey weaken them, because a lot of conditioning work will always "burn" some of your muscle mass, or at least not let it develop. Then there comes conflict of slow and fast-twitch muscles also.

I'm not a doctor so I'll refrain from arguing what I don't know. What I. Do know though as a former fighter is that you have to find a happy medium between being strong and having stamina with the latter being more important in the big scheme of things.

[Cardinal Buck]

The funny thing is Arreola's stamina was always okay. Not perfect, but better than a lot of guys.

[them_apples]

You're a master of pulling out the obscure, against-the-grain example to prove your point.

I give you enough examples and thats all you say?

[them_apples]

Those are all single examples guys, no one is saying that every big guy is stronger than every smaller guy. But fact is, average 230 guy is stronger than average 200 pounds guy. Just like it is in weightlifting and powerflifting sports. There are some smaller mans able to lift bigger weight, but in general you will always see bigger results in the highest weight classes.

A man who is 230 lbs when trimmed down to his frame and lean is a HUGE man.

Vitali Maybe holds this, Foreman perhaps and Lewis. (in terms of skilled boxers). Even Rid**** Bowe wasn't shredded at 235 lbs.

A lot of the rest are either un skilled, or blown up to that weight.


Like my other example, Vitali was 235+ lbs when he started his career, his brother was 15 lbs lighter. Vitalis the naturally bigger man, has the harder chin.

Wlad was 220, 6'6, thats a slim dude, but very tall. He's big now because he packed on mass, his bones didn't grow.

ronnie coleman was over 300 lbs at one point, but he's still not a big heavyweight. He's just got a lot of weight packed on his frame. He would tire incredibly fast and probably would look like the weaker dude within 1 or 2 rounds. Even with extensive boxing training.

George Foreman certainly wasn't stronger and harder punching when he weighed damn near 270 in his comeback.

[them_apples]

And what's your point exactly ?

that Frazier has stopped/beat plenty of men over 220 lbs+

you are arguing that they are so much bigger now. They aren't, they are taller

[Cardinal Buck]

I give you enough examples and thats all you say?

let me put it this way...if I put together a list of the 10 physically strongest heavyweights, Sonny Liston would probably be the smallest guy on that list.

[JAB5239]

let me put it this way...if I put together a list of the 10 physically strongest heavyweights, Sonny Liston would probably be the smallest guy on that list.

A better question would be how would you go about proving that?