Who actually beats Johnson at his absolute prime?

[Dr Z]

closer inspection of Johnsons style and temperament, he is one of the hardest fighters to bet against.

1: he's a master grappler, making him very very hard to hit flush

2: he's mean as hell, often holding opponents up, mocking them while beating on them, ensuring they walked away with a brutal beating and not letting them go down

3: he's quick as a cat and a master of hiding this until the last moment

4: his stamina combined with his energy efficient style made him a late round fighter

5: he's is completely fearless, probably due to his upbringing and temperament - to do what he was doing in his day means he lived only for the moment and had no fear of death

There is not too many ways to effectively beat him, you can't really get an offense going on a guy with the footwork, grappling and headmovement of Johnson (he rides and rolls shots like a master)

Sam Langford said he was so smooth and quick, and likely influenced his own style.

what do you all think, h2h, prime for prime vs anyone

All time? What is his best win and please consider the age and condition of the opponents.

[GhostofDempsey]

Moyle and I are Face book friends, he and I have never had a cross word, and I wrote a review for his Langford book, the only minor disagreement was over Langford's age,when we agreed his estimate of it was as close as could be ascertained..

Pollack never said ,or in anyway implied thatJohnson was lucky to get a draw with Battling Jim that was a lie of your own invention
I've had 2 user names since I first posted here about14 years ago Ivich and the one I have now ,
You are doing it again,insulting other posters via your replies to me.
You've done what I expected you to , turned tail and run,Well keep doing it you eunuch waste of space!

Wrong, you insisted Langford didn’t want a rematch with Johnson. Moyle corrected you as you stubbornly tried to save face. Facebook friends….lol, are you a middle aged housewife now?

Where did I say Pollack said he was lucky to get a draw? One judge had Battling Jim winning, so yes, Johnson was lucky to get a draw. You’re trying desperately to move the goal post after I just proved the quote I provided was from Pollack and in his book you claim to have read.

Have a good cry, I don’t owe you or your forum-wife any respect. You have both insulted me and various other posters here, stop playing the victim. No one is running from you, this is easy work.

[GhostofDempsey]

That is the exact truth!

Is it the truth? Are you telling me all newspapers articles written back then were credible? Newspapers often printed stories from whichever promoter was first to get to them or paid them off. Your forum wife mostly posts anonymous sources from obscure articles. I’ll do it now and see if you believe those reporters who were there in the 1900s.

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/a...unboat%20smith

IMG_3346.jpg

When I posted the statement about Wills from Frank Menke a highly regarded sportswriter of the 1920’s you fell silent. He was there. Still believe all newspapers articles written over 100 years ago or just the cherry-picked ones that fit your agenda?

[Bronson66]

Is it the truth? Are you telling me all newspapers articles written back then were credible? Newspapers often printed stories from whichever promoter was first to get to them or paid them off. Your forum wife mostly posts anonymous sources from obscure articles. I’ll do it now and see if you believe those reporters who were there in the 1900s.

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/a...unboat%20smith

IMG_3346.jpg

When I posted the statement about Wills from Frank Menke a highly regarded sportswriter of the 1920’s you fell silent. He was there. Still believe all newspapers articles written over 100 years ago or just the cherry-picked ones that fit your agenda?

Menke was never a boxing writer per se, he was known more in boxing as a ghost writer for champions.
His field of expertise was in Baseball and Horeracing.


You would rather believe an , "as told" article from Menke than a taped interview with Smith conducted in his own home?
I wonder why that is? lol
My articles came from Pollack,is there a more qualified author on Johnson anyone could quote?
If so name him?
You had your chance to engage in a sensible debate and bottled it ,"Varys".
Cheer up though, you have a new supporter for your hate agenda,just reappeared.

You should get on just fine! Well until Dempsey is mentioned! lol

[Bronson66]

Wrong, you insisted Langford didn’t want a rematch with Johnson. Moyle corrected you as you stubbornly tried to save face. Facebook friends….lol, are you a middle aged housewife now?

Where did I say Pollack said he was lucky to get a draw? One judge had Battling Jim winning, so yes, Johnson was lucky to get a draw. You’re trying desperately to move the goal post after I just proved the quote I provided was from Pollack and in his book you claim to have read.

Have a good cry, I don’t owe you or your forum-wife any respect. You have both insulted me and various other posters here, stop playing the victim. No one is running from you, this is easy work.

I never said Langford did not want a rematch with Johnson,when he wanted it is another matter.

You said this.

"Should have lost to Battling Jim but was given a gift draw." And it is a barefaced lie ,driven by hatred.

Now you have you tag team partner back from his ban zeroed in straight onto Johnson threads, like a moth to a flame.
You deserve each other.

[Dr Z]

You’re splitting hairs and trying to play gotcha. That tactic didn’t work with your forum-wife here and it won’t work now. Fact is, Smith dropped Johnson right through the ropes. Where did Johnson land, on the ceiling?

Authors are sources and they use primary sources for their books. You routinely quote the same authors as me as sources now you want to move to goal post to anonymous news articles from obscure publications, laughable. You have zero credibility.

Any man who has less than ten fights and goes twenty rounds 3x with the so-called best HW is competitive. He did better than all the never-was no-hopers you’re always touting here.

We don’t know if prime Jeannette, Langford or McVey beat Johnson because he never fought them in their prime. Quack quack. Lay off the cheap whiskey.

Why would I care if you declare me a Johnson hater? I couldn’t care less. Now tell your racist forum-wife she is a Dempsey hater. I dare you. You won’t because you accept likes and pats on the head from anyone. Kissing your ass supersedes your pursuit of the truth.

Bingo.

Gun Boat Smith who was arguably the 1st or 2nd best of the White hopes, ( Willard was the 3rd and knocked Johnson out ) knocked him down and had Johnson's manager halt the action to save his fighter who was on ***** street. Call it what you will. I say that is a TKO.

The paper trial of Johnson losing to historically lesser fighters, and drawing with lesser men is long. He did not meet seasoned pro's who in their primes either. He avoided several of them.

End of.

IMO, he is overrated.

[QueensburyRules]

Wrong, you insisted Langford didn’t want a rematch with Johnson. Moyle corrected you as you stubbornly tried to save face. Facebook friends….lol, are you a middle aged housewife now?

Where did I say Pollack said he was lucky to get a draw? One judge had Battling Jim winning, so yes, Johnson was lucky to get a draw. You’re trying desperately to move the goal post after I just proved the quote I provided was from Pollack and in his book you claim to have read.

Have a good cry, I don’t owe you or your forum-wife any respect. You have both insulted me and various other posters here, stop playing the victim. No one is running from you, this is easy work.

- - Well, maybe not a housewife yet, but flagging testosterone looks to be angling in that direction...

[Bronson66]

- - Well, maybe not a housewife yet, but flagging testosterone looks to be angling in that direction...

The Three Amigos Ghost,Queenie ,and Z.

What do they have in common?

An irrational hatred of Jack Johnson.

[Bronson66]

He beat your boy Jeffries ass (who admit he could have never beaten him in his prime) and fought fighters that Jeffries wanted no part of.

We all know that's why you hate him.



I mean do you guys ever take a step back and read your posts? You're both literally trying to make a big deal about a boxer potentially getting knocked down in sparring. Sparring....during a session when he was clowning and "tapping the other boxer on the nose." If you have to dig that far to try to besmirch the man's career, you're pretty desperate to find a speck of dirt.

Z has been spouting this nonsense for over a decade .He turned a spar into a tko exhibition.

When I pointed out to him that his Vanilla favourite Vitali was dropped in sparring by two unknown journeymen he had no answer,likewise when Toxie Hall left hooked Marciano to the floor and Goldman told Rocky to go take a shower,but it becomes a big deal when its Johnson ,it's desperately sad really.

At least they can find comfort in each others mutual hatred.

[JAB5239]

Z has been spouting this nonsense for over a decade .He turned a spar into a tko exhibition.

When I pointed out to him that his Vanilla favourite Vitali was dropped in sparring by two unknown journeymen he had no answer,likewise when Toxie Hall left hooked Marciano to the floor and Goldman told Rocky to go take a shower,but it becomes a big deal when its Johnson ,it's desperately sad really.

At least they can find comfort in each others mutual hatred.

Sparring is just that, sparring. Ali went tooth and nail with Roy Wiliams in sparring after a disputed about money. Many here I'd assume would lable Williams a journeyman (in actuality better than that), does that make Ali any less great for what he did in actual fights? The answer is no.