What evidence do we have that heavyweights were too small in the past to compete today? and what determines a fighters size?

[Marchegiano]

Very few men had reaches of 80" or more and were over 6'2" tall back then.

Sure boxing had their share of circus employees back then 1915-1980, but they could not fight. They were only what is today a normal sized heavyweight in a world of tiny heavyweights.

Unless you think Willard, B Bear, Carnera and Simon were skilled men at boxing. Well, do you?

Yeah, big guys these days are made of magic muscles the older generations lacked. It's not that they're protected by the cutting of smaller men who make them look like lunks from the division. It's they've evolved new muscles and became better boxers.


Here's a crazy idea, maybe Carnera looks pretty good fighting the guys Wlad beat?

Maybe Willard looks pretty good without any Dempsey in the division to deal with?

No, the magic muscles over time theory, that's the ticket.

[Dr. Z]

When I flipped this, you let it go, but in both cases the answer was already posted: Roy Jones Jr. only 3 pounds over the CW limit at 193 happened in the 2000s bud.

YES, the PED filled Roid Jones was 193 pounds! But heavyweight starts at 200. Cruiser weight is below 200 lbs.


NEXT, Bud.

[Marchegiano]

YES, the PED filled Roid Jones was 193 pounds! But heavyweight starts at 200. Cruiser weight is below 200 lbs.


NEXT, Bud.

Jesus dude, you're old enough to remember this. Look at what the minimum was then.

[Dr. Z]

You brought him up!

The thread title is: What evidence do we have that heavyweights were too small in the past to compete today? and what determines a fighters size?


The PED filled Roid Jones was too small today.

[Slugfester]

Wilder would be punching down and hes top heavy. I am willing to bet he would struggle to hit crouching Marciano and may not even land at all.

Wilder has a terrible stance, terrible body for boxing (heâÂÂs top heavy and chicken legged, chicken winged doesn't know how to move with punches and doesnâÂÂt know how to jab. He bench presses for training, IâÂÂve never seen the guy run although I would hope he does at least a bit. Wilder has nothing but power, and not enough anyways to knock Marciano out.

Marciano can hurt Wilder. The thing with this fight, is due to Wilders terrible mobility this would probably end up being one sided in Marcianos favor. IâÂÂd figure Vitali to be a much rougher fight for Rock than Wilder.

How about chicken-brained if you think Wilder couldn't hit Marciano? If he couldn't hit Marciano then just who could he hit?

[Ivich]

When I flipped this, you let it go, but in both cases the answer was already posted: Roy Jones Jr. only 3 pounds over the CW limit at 193 happened in the 2000s bud.

That is not 200lbs plus and Jones had a 74 reach, along with great reflexes, and tremendously fast hands.

Why didn't Jones pursue a fight with Lewis ?

Why did he immediately drop down a division?
The big money was in the heavyweight division ,why did he not stay there?

[them_apples]

How about chicken-brained if you think Wilder couldn't hit Marciano? If he couldn't hit Marciano then just who could he hit?

Because he uses the crouch and would be 5 ft 5. He also moves his head and wilder telegraphs everything. Hes also impossible to knockout.

picture if for a second, a top heavy unschooled whirlwind puncher trying to punch down at a man crouching to 5 fr 5 whos stronger than him. it would actually be a slaughter. I wouldn’t give Wilder even the slightest chance, I don’t even think he has the punchers chance.

[them_apples]

Yeah, big guys these days are made of magic muscles the older generations lacked. It's not that they're protected by the cutting of smaller men who make them look like lunks from the division. It's they've evolved new muscles and became better boxers.


Here's a crazy idea, maybe Carnera looks pretty good fighting the guys Wlad beat?

Maybe Willard looks pretty good without any Dempsey in the division to deal with?

No, the magic muscles over time theory, that's the ticket.

Literally. Its such a dumb misinformed theory that because they lift weights and do less cardio they are better fighters. Nah boxing has slid because society has gotten softer due to the standard of living going up.

they can’t even find an inkling of proof to support their theory, they just can’t imagine it.

[them_apples]

Very few men had reaches of 80" or more and were over 6'2" tall back then.

Sure boxing had their share of circus employees back then 1915-1980, but they could not fight. They were only what is today a normal sized heavyweight in a world of tiny heavyweights.

Unless you think Willard, B Bear, Carnera and Simon were skilled men at boxing. Well, do you?

There were plenty. As many as today.
A lot of big guys can’t fight though.

carnera, buddy baer, jess willard, abs simon

the next era you got terrell, bugner, wepner (6’5)

the 90s you got Cooney, bowe and lewis.

00s you got vitali, wlad etc

every era had tall big guys. And this isnt including the dozens of second raters.

like michael Moore. A former light heavy beating up and almost stopping a 6’10 275 mike White. Explain that one.

[Slugfester]

Because he uses the crouch and would be 5 ft 5. He also moves his head and wilder telegraphs everything. Hes also impossible to knockout.

picture if for a second, a top heavy unschooled whirlwind puncher trying to punch down at a man crouching to 5 fr 5 whos stronger than him. it would actually be a slaughter. I wouldnât give Wilder even the slightest chance, I donât even think he has the punchers chance.

This is good for a hearty laugh. So far you have claimed Wilder might not even be able to hit Marciano--Marciano must have been a profound defender in that case.

You also said Marciano was impossible to KO. More laughs. Two old men knocked him down. Neither was known as a super hard puncher. He never fought a super hard puncher, and certainly no great fighter even close to their prime. Man, you are the one with no evidence.

Every defense you bring up is off the wall. Uh, a lot of small guys can't fight either. Y'all musta forgot. Your original argument was caused by a computer fight, for cryin' out loud, a pretend fight. What kind of evidence is that supposed to be?

And by the way, no one said weight was the primary factor. You change the argument into something trivial so you can proceed with your hero worship. Overall dimensions--not strictly weight. Let's see if you can admit that first. You can't. There will be only the same responses.

I like you and always read your posts, but that poor head of yours needs a grease job quick--she is grinding and creaking awfully loud.

I understand your love for Marciano--I have it too. But I think realistically, and you think with your heart. I would be rooting for Marciano but I don't think I would have long to root. Very quickly I will be rooting for him to get to his feet.

Some fighters will be able to deal with the dimensions--but Rock only in certain cases. I still believe the ideal heavyweight is about Usyk's size. But that ain't 5'10" either. I got Rock beating Vlad, and 50-50 with his big brother, but Wilder is another bowl of stew. Surely he KOs Vald in a hurry and probably big brother too.

Personally I don't think even Chuvalo could stand up long to Wilder's punch, and his chin was far more proven than Marciano's. Marciano showed he could withstand old men and fat slobs like Cockell. Wilder likely would have KOd the likes of Cockell in about 45 seconds.

If Marciano can last beyond 7 rounds, he would have a chance, that's about it. I wouldn't bet any serious money on that and I would be willing to bet you wouldn't bet more than a small sum for bragging rights yourself, just in case Rocky miraculously came through.