Greb vs the great heavyweights

[Willie Pep 229]

Harry Greb's best run seems to be between defeating Gibbons in March '22 to losing to Tunney (II) in February '23. During that 11 month period he seems unbeatable, taking on LHWs and HWs.

[JAB5239]

- - Hence my language for your minder to translate:

Any all time fighter vs another all time fighter in his weight class usually struggles win/lose/draw...duh...mmy

Your gibberish is not translatable. Learn a proper language.

[Willow The Wisp]

Why do you think because Greb beat Tunney (once by decision) in 1922 he could measure up to a 1926 Tunney?

In March of 1925 Tunney gave Greb such a beating that Greb addressed the ringside audience and said "I can't beat this man, I won't fight him again."

Boxrec Newspaper report:

Tunney gave Greb as thorough a beating as he has ever received. So completely was Greb outclassed and outfought in six of the ten rounds that he resorted to a defensive fight after the third and thereafter was guilty of persistent holding and stalling varied only by rare flashes of offensive fighting, which Tunney quickly terminated by a devastating attack.

Trying to point to Greb's single victory over Tunney in 1922 and argue that that win moves Greb into HW competition doesn't hold water. Look at the 1925 Tunney, the one Greb couldn't come close to beating.

Besides lets look closely at Greb's greatest victory, Tunney I.

The Vault SI.com

In the first 10 seconds of the first round Greb broke Gene's nose in two places. Seconds later he opened a long, ugly gash over Gene's left eye, and from then on until the bell ended it in the 15th round Tunney's face was an inch-thick mask of blood. Doctors estimated he may have lost two quarts.

Take away the opening combination and all the advantages that gave Greb, and ask yourself how does Tunney fare in that fight?

Greb was never able to repeat the feat and Tunney kept getting bigger.

Tunney, in the end, didn't just beat Greb several times he dominated him. Greb got one decision over a LHW Tunney in 1922 and maybe doesn't even get that one if he doesn't cut Tunney early.

I am starting to think Greb is quite overrated on this forum.

I'm not saying he ain't great, but I am saying he's a "9" not an unbeatable "10."

Again, I can't find a single Greb KO over a top ranked fighter at any weight. I have come to feel he is feather fisted.

IMO He gets torn apart just like Ketchel did.

I don't think you question is legit. Are you asking about 1922 Tunney (174 lbs) or the 1926 Tunney (190 lbs)?

The latter, the 1925 190 lb Tunney, Greb announced, he no longer want any part of him.

Nice post. Geez wasn't Gene Tunney something? As to the Greb thing, I stand in solidarity with any feller who wants to lionize any worthy great fighter. I'm not about to name 5 modern giants in order to lean on anyone's idea. I just figure it's an agreeable supposition that mabe against some greats under 200 pounds, and on any given night, Ol' Harry Greb, the "Pittsburgh Windmill", could just flat take some out! Why not?

[them_apples]

By the time they got to their rematch fight Tunney had him figured out. One newspaper described the final eight rounds with Greb refusing to move forward. The windmill style disappeared and Greb went totally defensive.

Like any human being once Greb started getting beat up he started protecting himself.

Nobody ever talks about that fight.

P.S. Before I hear about it from you all, YES Boxrec claims it was a hotly disputed decision.

But read to the end. It goes on to say Greb abandoned his windmill style because he feared being DQ. So says Boxrec.

Others say it was because Tunney took him to school.

P.S.S. The biggest complainer about the decision was Muldoon. I leave you to decide how much validity that holds.

yes but Tunney essentially studied all the fights he was in and adapted his style to counter it. He got beat up bad the first time, was totally not prepared or capable of beating greb.

You put other fighters in the same circumstance and Greb would have beat them up before they even got a chance to figure him out. Tunney has probably one of the highest ring IQs of all time.

[Willow The Wisp]

Maybe Greb was special.???

[QueensburyRules]

Your gibberish is not translatable. Learn a proper language.

- - Don't speak your North Carolina hog slop...

[JAB5239]

- - Don't speak your North Carolina hog slop...

Man, you really are a scrub!! I'm not from North Carolina.

[Dr. Z]

Found this on Facebook in a boxing group I read. Found it absolutely fascinating.

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?sto...ibextid=Nif5oz

“Cassius Clay wouldn’t know where he was once Greb began to swarm and climb all over him. He would bewilder and confuse Clay.”—Ray Arcel, 1966 .
“I don’t put nobody over Greb. He could have licked Dempsey, Tunney and Louis, all in the same week.”—Whitey Bimstein
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“All Abe Simon had to do to make Joe (Louis) fumble like a novice was to feint him fast, and you can imagine what Billy Conn will do to a fellow who fumbles like that. And he had Joe very tired by the ninth round. If Joe tired under a pace like that imagine what a fast-moving Conn will do to him. He'll gore the champ to death. I shudder to think what Harry Greb would have done to Louis last night.

I was in Dempsey’s training camp when Jack Kearns ran in Greb as a sparring partner. It was murder. Greb was too fast and hit from too many angles. We had to chase him out. It’s going to take speed to beat Louis, and Greb had speed. He was on top of you before you knew what had happened, with both hands working….I think he would have given Louis a bad headache. You can’t afford to let Louis get set. It was always hard to get set against Greb.” —Tommy Walsh
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“In my opinion, Louis would have had as much trouble handling Harry Greb as anyone else.”—Grantland Rice
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Over the decades, several respected boxing persons who saw them fight in person have given the opinion that Greb could have beaten Jack Dempsey and Joe Louis. Now even the great Ali can be added to that list.

Many people who never saw Harry in action chuckle at the notion that he could beat these all-time greats of the heavyweight division. And perhaps justifiably so. But keep this in mind:

Nobody ever talked about Stanley Ketchel, Tiger Flowers, Mickey Walker, Sugar Ray Robinson, Carlos Monzon, Marvin Hagler or any other of the middleweight greats as having a chance vs Dempsey, Louis or Ali (nobody even mentions them as having a prayer against Gene Tunney on the night Harry beat him either).
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Only Harry Greb is ever mentioned as having a real chance. Not just to be competitive against these heavyweight greats, but to win. Whether we agree or not, it's still a notable trend.
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Tony Galento, who actually fought Joe Louis and many other top heavies, stated that Harry would have beaten him "and everybody else....he was the greatest fighter I ever saw. No one else was close to him."

Even Jack Blackburn, who fought Greb and trained Louis, admitted that Joe would have major problems dealing with Harry’s awkward, elusive attack.
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Out of all the all-time middleweight champions, it is only Harry Greb who is considered a match for the greatest heavyweights in history. And not by fanciful historians in their dreamy flights of fancy, but by expert eyewitnesses who saw both Greb and these heavyweights firsthand.
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As they say online these days, “let that sink in…”

History has shown that 170-175 pound man can beat a 200 - 210 pound man, especially if the 170 - 175 pound man has better speed and a tough chin. And is hard to hit. Greb was this. Over 12 rounds he has a good chance of pulling off the upset over Louis

Ali fans skip over the fact that sub 200 pound men floored ( Banks and Cooper ) him and nearly out boxed him ( Jones ) but that happened.

[QueensburyRules]

Man, you really are a scrub!! I'm not from North Carolina.

- - Are you saying you're a liar?

[JAB5239]

- - Are you saying you're a liar?

Not at all ya scrub. Because I live here doesn't mean I originate from here. Oh look there, another valuable lesson I've taught you!