Vitali Klitschko, the last great heavyweight

[Dr. Z]

Vitali Klitschko, Champion
Chris Byrd
John Ruiz
Hasim Rahman
James Toney
Monte Barrett
Andrew Golota
Fres Oquendo
Jameel McCline
Corrie Sanders
Lamon Brewste

This was copied for the year end ratings. Where's Williams?

Year end ratings are not WHEN fought. I'm am taking about ratings at the time of the match! This goes double for Tony McVey ( Ivich ). Do you understand?

Using annual ratings which came out in ( The Ring magazine in the Volume III 2005 ) for the year 2004 will not help you on this. Typically a loss sustained during the year moves a fighter down or out of the ratings.

First you must admit you understand this. I do not think you do. Can you admit this and other mistakes? I do not have a lot of time for you today. Admit you're wrong. Then you lost the bet. I will decided whether or not you stay. You are also wrong on Kevin Johnson's rating at the time he fought Vitali. He was rated as a top ten contender by ring magazine at the time.

[Ivich]

Vitali Klitschko, Champion
Chris Byrd
John Ruiz
Hasim Rahman
James Toney
Monte Barrett
Andrew Golota
Fres Oquendo
Jameel McCline
Corrie Sanders
Lamon Brewste

This was copied for the year end ratings. Where's Williams?

I told you what he would do.

[JAB5239]

Year end ratings are not WHEN fought. I'm am taking about ratings at the time of the match! This goes double for Tony McVey ( Ivich ). Do you understand?

Using annual ratings which came out in ( The Ring magazine in the Volume III 2005 ) for the year 2004 will not help you on this. Typically a loss sustained during the year moves a fighter down or out of the ratings.

First you must admit you understand this. I do not think you do. Can you admit this and other mistakes? I do not have a lot of time for you today. Admit you're wrong. Then you lost the bet. I will decided whether or not you stay. You are also wrong on Kevin Johnson's rating at the time he fought Vitali. He was rated as a top ten contender by ring magazine at the time.

You're the only one who has lost the bet son. And you thinking you can decide if I stay or go.....comical!! You kept pushing back the goalposts and still got proven wrong!

Williams may have snuck in with the Tyson victory, but how in the world did Kevin Johnson get in? Explain that.

At the end of the day it has been proven there are a lot more fighters with better resumes than Vits, and plenty more with more ring ranked wins. This has been unequivocally proven.

I didn't know Ivich was McVey at ESB. He was a fountain of knowledge over there. Id drop in there just to read his, McGrain, Burt and Klomptons posts. All great posters!!

[JAB5239]

I told you what he would do.

I know. It doesn't bother me in the least. I offered the bet so he would make himself look ******. Mission accomplished!! Petty immaturity on my part, but I do like to entertain myself on here!! Thanks for the solid contributions! I enjoy the knowledge you share.

[Bundana]

I believe Dr. Z's original challenge was for someone to find 10 men, who beat more Top-10 (The Ring) ranked (at the time they fought) HWs, than Vitali did. Not an "opinion" question, but a factual one... so how hard can it be?

And yet, we don't even seem to be able to agree on the number for Vitali! We have established, that he beat Arreola, Adamek, Gomez, Peter, Sanders, when they were world ranked. That's 5 for sure... but I'm not 100% certain about guys like Danny Williams, Kevin Johnson and Kirk Johnson. If someone has access to Ring's monthly ratings, can we have a ruling on this, please.

[Willow The Wisp]

I believe Dr. Z's original challenge was for someone to find 10 men, who beat more Top-10 (The Ring) ranked (at the time they fought) HWs, than Vitali did. Not an "opinion" question, but a factual one... so how hard can it be?

And yet, we don't even seem to be able to agree on the number for Vitali! We have established, that he beat Arreola, Adamek, Gomez, Peter, Sanders, when they were world ranked. That's 5 for sure... but I'm not 100% certain about guys like Danny Williams, Kevin Johnson and Kirk Johnson. If someone has access to Ring's monthly ratings, can we have a ruling on this, please.

Bullseye. I have more literature neatly preserved than I do free time, and every single issue. If this question doesn't get sorted, I might take up the cause. Maybe.

[Ivich]

I believe Dr. Z's original challenge was for someone to find 10 men, who beat more Top-10 (The Ring) ranked (at the time they fought) HWs, than Vitali did. Not an "opinion" question, but a factual one... so how hard can it be?

And yet, we don't even seem to be able to agree on the number for Vitali! We have established, that he beat Arreola, Adamek, Gomez, Peter, Sanders, when they were world ranked. That's 5 for sure... but I'm not 100% certain about guys like Danny Williams, Kevin Johnson and Kirk Johnson. If someone has access to Ring's monthly ratings, can we have a ruling on this, please.

On this thread he claimed 8 wins and 2 losses for Vitali in fights with Ring ranked top tenners,the he posted what purports to be Vitali's ring ranked opponents
which comprises 7 wins and 2 losses.I've posted 14 fighters who have more wins.He lost his bet,but as he always does moved the goalposts twice.
He is shameless.

[Willie Pep 229]

What is this forum about, the history of prize fighting or proving who knows more information?

No opinion can be proven right or wrong and nothing will be effected or changed because of what is said here.

Sure once in a while we have to call eachother out, but nothing should go beyond two or three replies each. When the same argument hits 19 pages and then moves to two more threads, we're doing it wrong.

[Bundana]

What is this forum about, the history of prize fighting or proving who knows more information?

No opinion can be proven right or wrong and nothing will be effected or changed because of what is said here.

Sure once in a while we have to call eachother out, but nothing should go beyond two or three replies each. When the same argument hits 19 pages and then moves to two more threads, we're doing it wrong.

As already said, this is not about opinion. It's factual... but apparently no one can come up with a definitive answer, to how many world ranked boxers Vitali beat (when they were in the Top-10) during his career.

Does it really matter? No, not in the grand scheme of things, but when someone makes a factual statement, I want to know, if it's completely made up - or there could be something to it. And in this case we must first determine, if the number for Vitali is 6, 7 or maybe even 8. Which, strangely, in itself seems to be a very difficult task!

Now the men with a question mark are Danny Williams and the two Johnsons, Kevin and Kirk. Surely someone must be able to tell us, if any (or all) of these 3 were Top-10 ranked fighters, at the time Vitali beat them?

And, come to think about it... how about Lamon Brewster? At the end of 2006 he was ranked #7 by The Ring - before he, in his very next fight, lost to Vitali in July 2007. Had he been dropped from the world rankings in the meantime? Worth checking out, I think!

[mrbig1]

Holmes fought 19 Ring ranked opponents.Including 5 men who were world's heavyweight champion.

That may be true, but the fact is if we take away an aging Norton a green Witherspoon and Cooney who hasn't fought a full round of boxing in 26 months. Then it gets might thin. Larry Holmes and the skills no doubt about that. He fought in a very weak era. Vitali can beat anyone Holmes fought.