Rocky vs Sonny Size Matchup

[them_apples]

Did Liston ever have any trouble fighting inside?
Did he ever have any trouble with a 5 feet ten inch 185lbs guy?
Did Marciano ever face a prime class 212lbs heavyweight with a huge reach who could hit like a truck?
If Liston could pick any type of opponent, he would opt for a slow, short ,come forward swarmer ,with a tiny reach and a tendency to cut.
Hopefully the referee for this matchup would show some mercy and rescue Rocky before he got too badly hammered and cut up.The third man in the Ingo v Machen fight ,or the Duran v Moore fight just might get Rocky killed.

rocky didn’t face someone like Liston, but styles make fights. Nobody knows the outcome of this fight but keep in mind they don’t always play out like you would think. I won’t even pick a winner, but since based on the scale everyone writes Rocky off ill defend Marciano more so because I don’t think the weight is as big of a factor as people think. Rocky isn’t the type of fighter to just get ran over without fighting back. Listons best situation would be similar to Foreman vs Frazier, where Marciano keeps getting up and dropped. That being said though even Joe was a heavy drinker and under estimated George, who was in a way cheating that night. If Rocky is able to get inside Liston is a pretty big target for some big bombs.

im almost positive Liston takes the early sounds though and probably beats Rocky up a bit, its more so as the fight goes on and timing is established.

[Ivich]

I was referring to his height. You don't believe the listed reach, do you? On the tale of the tape, the weight is even by the way for the second fight and has Liston a mere 2 pounds.

Here are the weights for their 2 fights.



Cant you just say yes Liston is the bigger man? Why do you continue to deny the obvious? Everyone and their Granny knows Liston was heavier than Ali for both fights,had bigger arms, bigger chest.bigger fists,bigger legs, longer arms,
THAT MAKES HIM BIGGER!

1965-05-25	215¼	206		Muhammad Ali	20 0 0		Central Maine Civic Center, Lewiston	L-KO	1/15		bout score wiki
2:12 ref: Jersey Joe Walcott Joe Colvin Russ Leonard Coley Wallace WBC World Heavy Attendance: 2, 434
	1964-02-25	218	210½		Muhammad Ali

[them_apples]

Not saying you're wrong. So much of the past is just lies agreed upon. This is from the NYTimes.

clay-liston 1.jpg

mutual agreement on bull**** indeed, and still to this day it carries on like this. Nobody thinks critically anymore or maybe they never have lol.

[Ivich]

you also gotta realize these tale of the tapes are basically BS they used them to sell fights and still do. They always tried to make it even in some way. or more even at least. My old coach said fighters always lied about weights after rehydrating.

Ever seen a tale of the tape which says Ali has longer arms ,a bigger chest,bigger biceps ,.forearms,thighs? If you have produce it it will be worth some money! lol

Bottom Line official weigh in figures.
1st Fight Liston was
215 1/4lbs to Ali's 206lbs = 9 1/4lbs heavier
2nd Fight Liston was218lbs to Ali's 210 1/2lbs =7 1/2lbs heavier
With no belly on him in either fight,guess what ?
Liston was bigger!

[QueensburyRules]

Um. Fury is closer to 6'8" Tall but as tall as his listed height. When Ali fought Liston he was the bigger man, think about that.

- - He wasn't, the reason he ran like a scalded cat the first fight.

[Ivich]

rocky didn’t face someone like Liston, but styles make fights. Nobody knows the outcome of this fight but keep in mind they don’t always play out like you would think. I won’t even pick a winner, but since based on the scale everyone writes Rocky off ill defend Marciano more so because I don’t think the weight is as big of a factor as people think. Rocky isn’t the type of fighter to just get ran over without fighting back. Listons best situation would be similar to Foreman vs Frazier, where Marciano keeps getting up and dropped. That being said though even Joe was a heavy drinker and under estimated George, who was in a way cheating that night. If Rocky is able to get inside Liston is a pretty big target for some big bombs.

im almost positive Liston takes the early sounds though and probably beats Rocky up a bit, its more so as the fight goes on and timing is established.

Styles make fights, yes they do and Rocky's style is made to measure for Liston
There would not be any later rounds . Prime Liston walked through DeJohn,Williams,Valdes.
Why wouldn't he take Marciano's shots?
Why would anyone think Rocky would boss this fight on the inside?
Why would anyone think he would be stronger than the 30lbs heavier Liston?
How many rounds would ****ell,Lastarza, go with a prime Sonny?They would last about as long as Roy Harris did imo.


Marciano was dropped by two old men one of whom was really a lhvy.I dont think either Walcott or Moore drop Sonny and I think Liston went into the tank for the 2nd Ali fight.
Marciano would not be able to win a war of attrition with Liston because he would be cut and bleeding early from taking punishment before he could even get into range.
Marciano was the puncher in all his fights.he would not be here! Liston breaks him up at range opening cuts to his eyes, clubs and uppercuts him inside for a brutal early ko.Marciano was too small, too slow and cut too easily to have a realistic chance with Liston or his successor Foreman.Courage and heart can take you a long way,it can also get you permanently damaged or killed.

[Dr. Z]

Styles make fights, yes they do and Rocky's style is made to measure for Liston
There would not be any later rounds . Prime Liston walked through DeJohn,Williams,Valdes.
Why wouldn't he take Marciano's shots?
Why would anyone think Rocky would boss this fight on the inside?
Why would anyone think he would be stronger than the 30lbs heavier Liston?
How many rounds would ****ell,Lastarza, go with a prime Sonny?They would last about as long as Roy Harris did imo.


Marciano was dropped by two old men one of whom was really a lhvy.I dont think either Walcott or Moore drop Sonny and I think Liston went into the tank for the 2nd Ali fight.
Marciano would not be able to win a war of attrition with Liston because he would be cut and bleeding early from taking punishment before he could even get into range.
Marciano was the puncher in all his fights.he would not be here! Liston breaks him up at range opening cuts to his eyes, clubs and uppercuts him inside for a brutal early ko.Marciano was too small, too slow and cut too easily to have a realistic chance with Liston or his successor Foreman.Courage and heart can take you a long way,it can also get you permanently damaged or killed.

Hold on, comparing Lastraza a good move and jab fighter to Liston's stationary victim in Roy Harris? No. Liston busted up easy and cut too. See the short Cleveland Williams fights, or his 6 round quit job vs Ali. Liston was nearly knocked dead by Leotis Martin who was a little over 6 feet tall is usually around 195 lbs or so. And the KO if you haven't seen it makes you wonder about the upper limits of Sonny's chin. He was out cold for nearly a minute. For sure Marciano hit harder than Martin, and for sure he wasn't the typical Liston opponent so just stop with the comparison lesser fighters that Marciano fought, while lumping them is with Liston. Marciano was about the same size as Martin and sightly bigger than Marty Marshall. Two fighters who beat Liston. There you realists chance. In a fantasy fight between the two I pick Liston, with a cache for Marciano to upset.

[Ivich]

Hold on, comparing Lastraza a good move and jab fighter to Liston's stationary victim in Roy Harris? No. Liston busted up easy and cut too. See the short Cleveland Williams fights, or his 6 round quit job vs Ali. Liston was nearly knocked dead by Leotis Martin who was a little over 6 feet tall is usually around 195 lbs or so. And the KO if you haven't seen it makes you wonder about the upper limits of Sonny's chin. He was out cold for nearly a minute. For sure Marciano hit harder than Martin, and for sure he wasn't the typical Liston opponent so just stop with the comparison lesser fighters that Marciano fought, while lumping them is with Liston. Marciano was about the same size as Martin and sightly bigger than Marty Marshall. Two fighters who beat Liston. There you realists chance. In a fantasy fight between the two I pick Liston, with a cache for Marciano to upset.

Harris was a mobile boxer. Liston did not bust up easy, that's total BS! He got a broken nose from one of the hardest punchers of all time and came on to ko him!Against Ali Liston was going in with just 3 rds of ring action in the previous 3 years and the fight was close until the end.
ref: Barney Felix 57-57 Gus Jacobson 56-59 Bunny Lovett 58-56


Liston was an old man when he fought Martin who was a very good puncher.by that time Sonny was drinking heavy yet he still had enough left to drop Martin and detach his retina with his jab, an injury that ended Martins career.
Seventh ranked Martin stopped Sonny with a terrific right hand ,you don't know what you're talking about!
"Liston was flattened with a vicious right."

Liston was probably 40 plus by then.Want to speculate how a 40plus Marciano would do weathering Martins shots? Martin was over six foot and 200lbs with a76 inch reach ,.does that seem that same size as 5 feet ten and a half and 185lbs and 68inch reach to you?
As you think Ali was bigger than Liston it probably does!
I've blown your arguments on Monzon and Liston completely away , yet you cannot acknowledge it so just jog on!

[Dr. Z]

Harris was a mobile boxer. Liston did not bust up easy, that's total BS! He got a broken nose from one of the hardest punchers of all time and came on to ko him!Against Ali Liston was going in with just 3 rds of ring action in the previous 3 years and the fight was close until the end.
ref: Barney Felix 57-57 Gus Jacobson 56-59 Bunny Lovett 58-56


Liston was an old man when he fought Martin who was a very good puncher.by that time Sonny was drinking heavy yet he still had enough left to drop Martin and detach his retina with his jab, an injury that ended Martins career.
Martin stopped Sonny with a terrific right hand ,you don't know what you're talking about!

Liston was probably 40 plus by then.Want to speculate how a 40plus Marciano would do weathering Martins shots? Martin was over six foot and 200lbs with a76 inch reach ,.does that seem that same size as 5 feet ten and a half and 185lbs and 68inch reach to you?
As you think Ali was bigger than Liston it probably does!
I've blown your arguments on Monzon and Liston completely away , yet you cannot acknowledge it so just jog on!

Harris was not in Lastaza class as a mover. No, no, no. Liston who wasn't hit with much went down and out with that one punch period. End of sentence close the book. I saw it, you don't know what your talking about on both counts. According to the tale to the tape, the weights were 2 points advantage for Liston, the other equal. Some on else take care of this clown

[Ivich]

Harris was not in Lastaza class as a mover. No, no, no. Liston who wasn't hit with much went down and out with that one punch period. End of sentence close the book. I saw it, you don't know what your talking about on both counts. According to the tale to the tape, the weights were 2 points advantage for Liston, the other equal. Some on else take care of this clown

Harris was a jab and move boxer not a stationary fighter. Here is his fight with Patterson.
Floyd Patterson vs Roy Harris (August 18, 1958) -XIII- - YouTube

Here is Liston v Harris show me where Harris is stationary?

Sonny Liston vs Roy Harris Full Fight In Good Quality and Full Color - YouTube
Harris is in constant movement , but cannot handle Liston's pressure you're an ignorant buffoon!
Challenging Marciano Lastarza had beaten only 3 men of note.Layne, Bucceroni , Brion.
Going in with Liston Harris had only one defeat to the reigning champ Patterson.
He had beaten,Baker,Pastrano,Powell,Bygraves ,Besmanoff,Lavorante.His resume ****s on Lastarza's.

Here is the Liston V Martin fight Liston dominates the early rounds flooring Martin and hurting him a couple of times but in the second half of the fight begins to tire and slow down, in the 9th rd Martin lands TWO right hands to ko Sonny,both excellent punches.
Sonny Liston vs Leotis Martin # Highlights (For vacant NABF heavyweight title) - YouTube
I saw Martin floor , beat up and stop Thad Spencer,he was a very good right hand puncher who killed Sonny Banks.
To make your crass argument you've chosen Liston's split decision defeat when boxing with a broken jaw,a 7 fight novice Liston against a 27 fight defensive cutie. In their 2nd fight Liston floored Marshall multiple times and stopped him
In their 3 rd fight Marshall ran all night content to just survive and didn't win a round . To bolster your spurious claims you then picked a Liston a good 6 years past his prime,an age when Marciano was safely the other side of the ropes in retirement before the young guys started to come to the fore.


The tale of the tape you imbecile, was not for a specific fight it was an approximate of their weights!
For the third time.posting !
1st fight Box Rec official weigh in figures!

Liston 215 1/4lbs Ali 206lbs . Weight advantage to Liston=9 1/4lbs

2nd fight Box rec official weigh in figures.
Liston 218lbs Ali 210 1/2lbs.Weight advantage to Liston= 7 1/2lbs

Do you finally understand that now, or do I have to post the two weigh ins?