Great thread.... you know what, this just shows you the ATG mind set that these fighters had to overcome early adversity and go and to be great. So then I find myself asking why do people pronounce death on a fighter/prospect who has lost? Fans immediately say that the fighter has been "exposed". I don't think we as fans should write fighters off so quickly just because of a loss especially if it's early on.
I respect recent fighters like Loma and Badou Jack who have also treated early losses as a learning curve and come back to do great things.
Now if the fans would just give fighter like Lublin amongst others (very young and inexperienced) a chance to learn from their losses, it would be great.
Another thing that has influenced this mind set of being undefeated is Floyd Mayweathers career, as people are trying to hold fighters to that criteria and even fighters themselves are trying to go throughout their careers undefeated.
Let's not get into a "bashing Haye" party now. The dude did accomplish a lot as a cruiserweight, even moved up to heaveyweight and captured a title, that does mean something no matter how much you try and discredit his wins.
Let's see how Stevenson looks in his next fight... I have a funny feeling that Badou Jack might derail all of these plans.
Bellew's confidence is quite high at he moment. He's had a good couple of victories and the two Haye KOs.. he will not be scared of Stevenson's power as he handled Haye's power quite well (albeit Haye was not the same fighter but arguably still had his power and definately hits harder than Stevenson). At Cruiserweight, Bellew will not be an easy fight for Stevenson, I actually think he wins that one.
Yeah the Prov fight really took a lot out of him. It's amazing how 1 fight can drastically change a fighter's physical and mental health. Respect to him.
Obviously it would have been nice to see him fight the thurmans and Spences of this world but happy he made his money and got out with his speech intact. Just wish Roy jones et al would follow suite.
I actually had thought Walters would be able to upset him and was kind of worried for Loma. But man Loma took his heart and will away, I don't even remember the axe man wanting or pushing for a rematch. Walters is happy if he never gets to see Loma again.
I remember when GGG use to say That anybody from 154-175 could get a fight, he almost fought Tommy Oostheizen (175). Then when ward came knocking GGG said 160.
what Canelo is doing is unprecedented, don’t let any of the haters tell you otherwise. They were making similar noises when Manny was beating ATGs and jumping weigh classes. Once Canelo retires, his body of work shine.
People keep on saying he needs to throw more punches, the PROBLEM is that he can’t cause he will gas out. If he could throw more punches he would, trust me.
Remember in the lower divisions he got away with it because he had power so when he threw his punches he made an impact and guys were more hesitant to trade with him..... at 140/147 he doesn’t carry the same power so his opponents are not afraid to press him, hence, his lack of activity is more visible.
I voted for whyte by decision. You guys are seriously overrating Joyce and underrating Whyte! Dubois was very unproven so I wouldn’t go by that fight to determine how Whyte vs Joe would go.
Joe does apply a lot of pressure but he is easy to hit and a bit slow. He has a steady semi okay jab but a real experienced fighter will be able to time the jab and counter. Also, Don’t count on Joe’s chin as we have seen very durable fighters get knocked out when hit correctly (e.g. Rios etc.)
Whyte will beat Joe.
A 20 lb bigger Cotto and a 25lb bigger Oscar are going to give him sht loads of problems you better believe that, so many gloss over the weight with these guys its just unreal, there is a reason Manny wanted nothing to do with Cotto at 154 even though he called him out but one caveat no CW no fight, I know why and so does Manny.
Nah Manny's style is all wrong for Cotto and Oscar irrespective of what weight it is, let's not kid ourselves here. The A side will always try and get the best advantage possible (also mind game thing), doesn't mean Manny could not beat them above 147. E.g. Floyd brought Canelo down to 152 and was overweight for Marquez but that does not mean that he would not have beat Canelo at 154 and Marquez at the initial agreed weight.
I think he definitely has a chance to go undefeated especially Prime Pac. Only ones who would give him probs IMO is Marquez (always will) and maybe Canelo (due to size). He would do a number on Zab Judah though.
Seems it had become a bit fashionable among certain people to call Loma arrogant. Just because you are confident you will win doesn't mean you're arrogant. The promoter of Loma and Lopez publicly stated he doesn't believe in rematch clauses.
Even if he was just confident (more like overconfident). His team should have ensured that a rematch clause was in place. For all the hate Hearn gets about rematches, it is a key for the A- side fighter. Imagine if Joshua did not have one with Ruiz cause he was “confident” he would beat him, I bet you he would still be chasing for his titles now lol. I also think Loma is pissed at Bob too and I wouldn’t be surprised if that relationship starts going south.
The biggest mistake Loma’s team did was not ensuring the fight contract had a rematch clause. For such a magnitude of a fight and fighter like Loma- this should have been standard. Even Floyd included rematch clauses in all of his fights. Loma just got a bit arrogant in this one and now he is going to pay cause the ball is in Lopez court and Lopez will not give Loma a rematch. This is and will continue to eat Loma up.
Why is Porter so eager to fight Bud and why is he so eager to be expecting Arum to pay him to do it?
Because he is the mandatory and Crawford needs a proper fight next. Arum needs Porter more than the other way around.
Yeah but PBC dont recognise that title. Is Porter sure he wants to be left off the lists of 147 champs on Fox sports or PBC content?
And maybe Porter and the PBC should make Crawford an offer if they want the fight so bad.
Also if it is a mando Arum and Crawford dont have to offer Porter Jack shyte. There is a standard percentage split for the challenger in a mandatory defence so Mr Porter would be receiving that. No lowball, standard price.
Dude- this would be all good and well if Arum had a couple of other welterweight marque fighters to offer Crawford but he has NONE. There is literally no one for Crawford to fight at Toprank at welterweight, they have run out of all possible opponents. So technically, ARUM/Crawford are desperate for a fight.
Question- do you think that it’s fair that they offered Amir 5mil (supposedly) and they trying to lowball Porter with 1 mil? I promise you porter is more famous in the US than Khan and is more relevant and respected even.
Joshua Wilder would have been bigger across the globe yes (especially in America). It would have been even bigger had Wilder properly defeated Fury and AJ defeated Ruiz ( it would have been at a fever pitch).
Agreed. They should actually let Rosado comment more during fights, he and Algeri articulate very well, simple and understandable. Most fighters know the game well but can’t convey/articulate well.
Are you being ironic?
You realise that Ali didn't always "rope-a-dope" right? (Otherwise it wouldn't have been much of a surprise).
I see my sarcasm flew over every bodies head lol..
I have been watching boxing long enough to know that Wilder would not stand a chance against any of the heavyweights mentioned (imagine what Foreman would do to the poor guy, and I'm taking about the forty year old one) I don't even think he gets through the current crop of today.... his fundamentalally too flawed and it's going to catch up with him, he is too in love with his power.
Would he be a top 5 HW? I think he has a chance against Norton, Frazier , and Freeman I'm not sure about Ali.
He takes Ali apart easily.... that rope a dope won't stand up against those signature bronze bomber windmills.......
Can't wait to see Conor's expression when he eats his first flush right hand. I think this won't go more than 2 or 3 at most. Floyd is going to make him pay for all that "I am boxing" talk. And it's not going to look pretty. Don't buy the hype people.
Will you watch this farse?...
I will. Only problem I have is that they are promoting it as if it has the potential to be competitive, that's why I say don't buy the hype. Who wouldn't want to watch Floyd shut Conor's mouth up. Conor is essentially disrespecting boxing by thinking that he can walk in and compete with one of the best. So Let's put him to the test and see what he says afterwards. Conor going past 5 would be a win for him and MMA honestly, if it is remotely competitive, boxing loses all credibility.
Nope. Three fights at LHW doesn't place him in the ATG category at that weight. Stevenson is not a great win anyway, and Kovalev got robbed in their first fight. Top 25 as a SMW, but that's it.
If Kov had beaten Ward twice and then go on to beat Stevenson as well, would you place him top 25 LHW ATG?
Still no. Three fights doesn't get him there, especially not against that level of opposition. Let him clean out the division against Gvozdyk, Beterbiev, Jack, maybe Bivol at the end of it, then we can start talking ATG status as a LHW.
Thing is Ward seems to be wanting to chase legacy and greatness, so he doesn't want to wait around at LHW for everyone to grow balls to eventually fight him. Remember he was the top guy at LMW (after cleaning it out) and still nobody wanted to fight him, Froch even ducked a rematch with him (he basically became a Rigo of that division).
I would think it would be better to beat the consensus top 2 guys at LHW and take out one or more of the cruiser weight champs to solidify his legacy. If he tried to clean out LHW, all the young boys will try and avoid him until he gets old. And if he does get to fight and beat them all, people will just say that the division was weak or that they were unoroven GUARANTEED. Honestly nobody seems to really want it with Ward at LHW except for Stevenson.