This is a monumental moment in the history of boxing.
The old guard is reaping what they sowed. They took the helm of boxing with no vision for its long term future; only for maximizing their revenue in the short term.
They shrunk their market by limiting access to it with PPV and relied on subscription network deals until the networks were uninterested in working with them.
They neglected the long term growth of the sport by lack of investment in a pipeline.
And worst of all, they chipped away at the integrity of the sport by corruption and incompetence.
That is the opposite of how the major sports organizations business models. The NFL keeps its best product on the most accessible networks from NFL Sunday to the Super Bowl, invests and even subsidizes other leagues and youth sports with a constant pipeline of prospects, and aims for the highest integrity (the keyword is aims).
The old guard has a superstar driven business model, the new guard has a superstar business model. One relies on individuals like Tank Davis and the other relies on process. One can live through a downturn, the other cannot (I’ll let you take a guess at which one).
At this point, the old guard can band together for a last hurrah or go out alone with a whimper. The new guard is coming with a sustainable business model, great leadership, and full of resources that is building for the future. The old guard has been checkmated, they just don’t know it yet.
This is a monumental moment in the history of boxing.
The old guard is reaping what they sowed. They took the helm of boxing with no vision for its long term future; only for maximizing their revenue in the short term.
They shrunk their market by limiting access to it with PPV and relied on subscription network deals until the networks were uninterested in working with them.
They neglected the long term growth of the sport by lack of investment in a pipeline.
And worst of all, they chipped away at the integrity of the sport by the innumerable reasons
That is the opposite of how the major sports organizations business models. The NFL keeps its best product on the most accessible networks from NFL Sunday to the Super Bowl, invests and even subsidizes other leagues and youth sports with a constant pipeline of prospects, and aims for the highest integrity (the keyword is aims).
The old guard has a superstar driven business model, the new guard has a superstar business model. One relies on individuals like Tank Davis and the other relies on process. One can live through a downturn, the other cannot (I’ll let you take a guess at which one).
At this point, the old guard can band together for a last hurrah or go out alone with a whimper. The new guard is coming with a sustainable business model, great leadership, and full of resources that is building for the future. The old guard has been checkmated, they just don’t know it yet.
The majority thought this about Victor Ortiz against Berto...
Bute is a good boxer, but Pavlik winning isn't an impossiblity. Bute was stopped by Andrade (forget about the long count, Bute couldn't stand without the ropes) just through pressure (forcing him to fight at a faster pace than he wanted to and withstanding his shots) and the occasional body shot, so he's not indestructible.
Bute is a difficult style matchup and fighter for Pavlik, but if Pavlik can withstand Bute's power, get his offense going, and show some good defense, he can give Bute some problems.
It doesn't hurt that Bute gets Pavlik his biggest paycheck too.
This argument is equivalent to a woman deserving to be raped because she should have known better than to walk into that alley with revealing clothes.
The b!tch asked for it...
No way in hell would he go more then 5 or 6 rounds at that pace. Any guy with a decent chin beats him. His power is overrated too IMO.
Vera took his shots... Kirkland took a step back and boxed him, landing at a crazy % and not letting Vera land, dominated him for 8-9 rounds before stopping him. Brian Vera, the fighter who has a win over Sergio Mora and a KO over Andy Lee. He went 6-7 rounds (more than 5-6 btw) against Joel Julio wiping him out in pretty much every round before stopping him, it took Angulo 11 rounds in a competitive fight to get a KO, Quintana and Dzinzurik couldn't stop him or come close to it.
A bad scorecard is a bad scorecard is a bad scorecard.
Terrible scorecards from judges who show continued incompetence (or behind the scenes corruption) can be criticized as much as you want. Hardly constitutes grounds on which you can be sued for slander or defamation.
You might want to read the cliff notes on what are grounds for being sued, but I doubt this could be one of them. As long as you're not posting statements encouraging people to harass them, I can see it being pulled off without much incident.
Personally, I like the idea. Teddy Atlas exposed the fact that promoters take judges out to dinner before events, etc. and who knows what else happens... If people started harassing those cock suckers, we would at least give them some consequence to their corruption or complete incompetence (the Martinez-Williams judge and the Alexander's Kotelnik/Matthysse judge have to be corrupt). Multiple terrible scorecards should qualify them for being a corrupt POS, who should get harassed.
Reading through Timothy James' articles is very interesting, where he talks about the people surrounding Pac etc.. he hints there is one person trying to sabotage the fight... probably Koncz.
Koncsz has different ventures with Pacquiao, after Manny retires, he might still be on his team. Arum is the one that has the most to gain, but he needs Koncsz as another, a closer voice in Manny's camp and is probably using him as a tool.
Maybe. But the top fighters should kick his ass up and down the ring.
But that won't even happen because no one is going to fight him, the guy is a nobody, and he has ZERO ambitions outside of fighting Khan or PAC.
He lives in a dream world. Nobody cares if he beat an ancient lovemore.
He's a young Welterweight, who just fought his best opponent in Ndou, but he's supposed to step up to 154 to fight top 10 fighters?
:rofl:.. Whatever... Warren offered Khan a fight against Tim Bradley when his contract was about to expire too, all he had to do was sign an extension. A duck too by your criteria. Did the same to Calzaghe before the Hopkins fight. This was the exact same tactic, too little, too late.
Brook proved to me his chin is good and that was my main question of him, Ndou's a decent puncher and he took his shots without much of a problem.
People who don't have a good opinion of Kell are the ones impressed by sheer talent (blinding speed or concussive power); Brook possesses neither, but is solid all around and has the most important tangible to World Class fighters: timing. He knew when to attack on offense and when to take a step back on defense.
My critique would be to his inside fighting, he needs to shore up his inside defense and instead of just trying to block to counter punch. Other than that, Kell Brook is an all round good fighter and a problem for the Welterweights, including those Jr. Welterweights who figure to come up.
The Canelo fight was at 150, this at 147. Canelo did well against Ndou and had him in survival mode from the beginning, but Brook had him the worse for wear at the end. Brook finished the fight stronger than Canelo could.
Kell Brook is a good fighter, if his chin is decent, I expect him to be World Class.
Ndou is going to be very tough to stop, not just because he has an iron chin, solid stamina, and toughness, but because he will go into a cagey survival mode that makes him extremely tough to counterpunch, therefore hurt, therefore KO.
If he can get the KO or at least control Ndou for the entire fight and get him trouble, I'll be very impressed.
Why are people assuming he's referring to 15 rounds of sparring instead of 15 rounds of mitt work?
Anyway... last night was 1 week before the fight, so their winding down process could've begun on Sunday without infringing on a self imposed 1 week limit to commence it.
15 rounds on the mitts is not light work... especially combining it with the running and all the other workouts boxers do on a normal day.
One of the best matchups that can be made in boxing, hopefully it translates to a good fight.
Not the best scenario, but Hopkins last 2 fights have had good performances as far as ratings, if this fight can pull in close to or over 250K, it'll be a success. B-Hop brings in good ratings, but doesn't come cheap (last I heard $3-5M per fight).
HBO is put into a position where he drains their budget and has to go on PPV to save money for other dates.
Martinez would smash him regardless of where the fight was fought.
On another note: Barker was favored at 3 or 2 to 1 by Vegas against Macklin late last year... Will Barker be upgraded to a level above Eurobum by Martinez haters or does this not change a thing?
For those saying that Cerme~o quit...
You should really try taking a left hook to the liver in the middle of you throwing a right cross. You're getting the wind taken out of you, whether you see it coming or not.
You add to that formula: not seeing it coming, having to make the lowest weight you can get down to 24 hours prior (possibly having to dehydrate yourself in the process), and getting hit by a P4P power puncher... and you feel close to what Cerme~o felt.
Montiel's a beast, he can probably make it to the top of 122, only one standing in his way is Rigondeaux because he would destroy Arce or Vazquez Jr.
I remember him scoring the Kotelnik and Bradley fights for Alexander too. He's been following the kid since he was a young prospect and lets his bias dictate his scorecards.
Lou Dibella is his boy, so that might explain his Berto-Ortiz scorecard.
He should just stop publicly posting his scorecards if he's going to be on some dick riding sh!t.
that was pretty hardcore... i dont know why all u little fags like to hate on him. he's exciting to watch. too many experts on here critiquing defense as if any of you are experts.
People have a high opinion of their opinion and will not hesitate to try to pass it off as fact.
"Kirkland has no chin"... As if the ***** didn't run through Julio, who stopped one of the current titlists.
"Kirkland has no defense"... As if he hasn't held pretty much everyone except for Ishida under a 50% connect rate. His offense and sparse head movement is his defense.
Whatever happened in 27 wins < what happened in his 1 loss. To be expected...
Keep the fight on the inside and his great combinations flowing...
Because of Floyd's relaxed posture, defense, and sharpshooting on the inside, people tend to overlook the fact that his opponents do better on the inside and actually win rounds.
Jesus Chavez, Augustus, and JL Castillo employed this strategy and it worked for them, Ortiz is a southpaw (better offensive angles for the shoulder roll) with solid speed, power, and explosiveness in his combinations. Ortiz on the inside letting go 2s, 3s, 4s, and 5s is a problem, he's going to get through, especially if he's mixing in body shots in the combos.
Floyd went out of character to employ hitting and holding to prevent Hatton from fighting on the inside because he didn't want to go through the inside fighting hassle again (hasn't really taken part in it since Castillo I, unless it's against a Brusselles level opponent). But unlike Ricky, Victor is taller, bigger, and possibly stronger than Mayweather, so he might be able to work his way out of any clinches if Mayweather wants to go that route.
If the fight is fought mostly on the outside or at mid range, Ortiz gets picked apart, but if Ortiz is able to keep the fight on the inside, we'll be seeing one of the best high-profile fights we've ever seen live and a possible upset.
We can't forget that Floyd had a bum rotator cuff that fight with Castillo.
I have a question do you agree the best way to work inside any fighter is to jab your way in. Floyd has been susceptible to guys with a GOOD JAB. Because it breaks up rhythm and cut's distance to get object A closer to object B. If He can Jab he way in explode and get out unscathed then Ortiz has something that Floyd has to adjust too. This could lead to more openings or pressuring Floyd to do something out of character.
But i think banking on a fight that took place back in 2002 on a bad night is high hopes. Ortiz has to be consistent. I think his jab might be the ticket.
Thoughts?
Whether he had a bum rotator cuff or not, the most notable difference between the first fight and the second was how Floyd fought the fight. In the first fight, he chose to stay in the pocket and fight Castillo on the inside; in the second, he used his legs to stay on the outside.
A good jab is the best way to close distance, but it's not a requisite to get there, just a good tool... Ortiz doesn't really have a good jab, it hurt him against Lamont Peterson, but Ortiz can still find his way to the inside, he's just going to have to take his lumps to get there.
Regardless of when it happened, it's better to try to bank on possible openings that haven't been exploited since 2002 and might still be there, then to try to develop a good jab in just a few months after being 200+ fights, 1000+ rounds, and double digit years in.
Being a southpaw means very little in phone booth fighting. The shoulders are squared up, so the awkward angles of a southpaw are gone.
It's no coincidence that Floyd kept inviting Corley into the pocket in their fight.
Even if the southpaw squares his shoulders up, we're talking about right hooks and left crosses as primary offensive weapons, instead of left hooks and right crosses.
Against the shoulder roll, the right hook still comes from the blind side and lands on the non-protected side to the body and the left cross still works as an orthodox power jab, which is the opposite from orthodox offense on the inside.
Can the coincidence you're referring to be interpreted more as Floyd wanting to counter punch Corley before Corley gets to the inside instead of actually wanting to work on the inside?
After the 2nd round, the rounds in Mayweather-Mosley weren't really competitive.
Even if Ortiz loses, he's going to make 80-90% of the fight competitive, whether he wins rounds or not. Ortiz doesn't have Mosley's level of survival defense, if he ever goes into survival mode, he's going to be clipped continuously and possibly stopped so he doesn't really have the option.
Canelo will stop Mayorga... The kid's timing and counter punching is going to carry him a long way and Mayorga's the style of opponent that will suffer the most against him because of it.
Canelo destroys Jr. and it wouldn't even be close, 180 or not.
Hopefully Arum isn't lying because I believe GBP would call his bluffand this fight has to happen for the same reason he outlined. Against the level of opposition he's facing now, there's a good chance Chavez can lose (Yes... against Manfredo, Rubio, Gomez, and the like).
Arum talks as if he can see the writing on the wall with Chavez, he's wrong on Alvarez though, kid has potential to be an elite fighter in the next few years and Jr. would be another stepping stone on his way. A huge fight that would get boxing and the boxers involved a lot of attention, it should be made immediately.
Cintron - Top 10 at 154 went on to be ranked #1
Williams - #1 at 154
Pavlik - Ring Champion at 160
Williams - Top 5 at 154 and 160
Dzinzurik - WBO title - Top 10 at 154
Who else has a strength of schedule on par with Sergio's last 5?
These fights were in succession, but he can't get some slack cut?
He's ducking Pirog because of it?
:rofl:
Damn KLK don't tell me you have Froch over Abraham?.
If you got Froch, now I know Abraham will win.
You had Margarito over Pacquiao, and Dawson over Pascal by KO. Now Froch over Abraham? I remember when you couldn't get one prediction wrong. I thought you were some kind of wizard. Now in 2010 you've had a bad year. You'll bounce back next year.
I got the Martinez fight right (but by decision) :biggthump. You can't predict Dawson would put up such a flat performance on fight night.
Pacquiao turned out to be far tougher and resilient than I expected, I put that disclaimer up in the thread, it all comes down on how well Pacquiao is able to take Margarito's punches. Anyone else would've folded or at least been worn down by Margarito's body shots in the 6th and then him landing 30+ in the 7th and 8th, not Pacquiao (who he had 17 pounds on). That to me was unpredictable.
Abraham won't be able to land his wide ass punches (Yes, Froch's defense is underrated). Is Abraham faster than Pascal? Taylor? Dirrell? Kessler? Is he shorter than them with less reach? Does he throw straighter punches than them? Is he more predictable? Dirrell and Kessler found it tough to land on Froch, Abraham will too.
Sergio is already in his mid-late thirties, so no; besides, there's not enough Montell Griffin's, Reggie Johnson's, Glen Kelly's, at 160 for Martinez to duplicate RJ and HBO would never allow it to happen either.
When he comes in with his telegraphed right uppercut it's lights out.
Yes, because AA's wide ass left hook is the perfect combination of timing and accuracy.
Froch will overwhelm him with activity and take whatever Abraham has to offer.
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Time is running out for you Froch boys!
http://files.stv.tv/img/articles/133640-king-arthur-abraham-backs-valuev-410x230.jpg
http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/45276000/jpg/_45276354_froch_gown.jpg
Abraham won't be able to land his wide ass punches (Yes, Froch's defense is underrated). Is Abraham faster than Pascal? Taylor? Dirrell? Kessler? Is he shorter than them with less reach? Does he throw straighter punches than them? Is he more predictable? Dirrell and Kessler found it tough to land on Froch, Abraham will too.
:owned2::439: