BoloShot

not happening. wbc in gbp and canelo's pocket. corruption everywhere at the very tippy top. boxing less popular than gymnastics nowadays. no one outside of the boxing world even knows about current boxing. I know, it's sad. It could easily make a revival, just need to have the government intervene and start regulating boxing like literally every other big sport. It disgusts me that not a single public official wants to deal with this. They're basically handing it over to criminals to do what they want with it. They should be locked up instead. Might be worth all of bkxing'a fandom pushing the message to Trump who actually really likes boxing and cares for the sport. He seems like the kind of guy who could and would do it.

he wouldn't have been exposed for drug cheating under usada. no way. thank you vada for ur impartiality and integrity. I like VADA but I dislike how the WBC in particular with their clean boxing program and everything still don't enforce it stringently like they should.

wbc pure corrupt too. a lot of corruption in this sport. which is why its at the bottom of the barrel in the sports world. only talked about every blue moon. doomed to fall into obscurity once a big star and legend like pac finally retires. These sanctioning bodies need to be abolished or cleaned out and replenished with actual boxing men who know the sport and respect its integrity. Not corrupt Latino cartel affiliated crooks.

yup. thank goodness they are no longer in boxing. usada corrupt to the core. Feels good knowing another Floyd won't be allowed in boxing anymore... Oh wait there's Canelo now.

proof floyd had usada in his pocket: https://www.mmaweekly.com/paulo-costa-and-coach-suspended-by-usada-for-unauthorized-iv-use-at-two-events give me a break. why didn't floyd get in trouble???? joke testing agency. disgusting. The Jon Jones "pulsing" case exposed what they're really all about to the world.

Spoken like a true fan girl I really dislike Floyd but Bruce Lee was an actor who never sparred or fought. You're the fangirl if you don't realise this.

Bruce Lee was too fast, strong and tough for Floyd. Floyd would have ducked Bruce Lee until Haymon could have rigged the fight or rigged the judges. There is no evidence Bruce Lee was any of the things you described, he's a martial arts fraud on the level of Seagal.

Bruce Lee can't fight.

Dude , I couldn’t give two fughs about Bruce Floyd or that whore I banged last night but how can you say that Go check out who trained him and get back to me Ip Man trained him. A master of a fake martial art. Meaning he was clearly a fraud too. Nice looking moves don't necessarily work in fights.

He's not overrated with a résumé of prime opponents like his. Ali I think is incredibly overrated due to many of his great wins coming under either dubious circumstances or being against less than prime opponents. Both Norton wins were robberies for me, he struggled very greatly with a very one note Frazier and never corrected his mistakes. Liston, Patterson and Moore were all way past their primes. The rest were all B level fighters max. Foreman even was beaten by an illegal strategy that relied on another illegal act in slackening of ropes. His best win came against Cleveland Williams after he was shot in the gut and had three feet of intestine removed FFS, hardly a fully able man to be fighting. The legend also goes that he totally lost his prime between the ages of 25 and 28, which is ridiculous and only his fault, best my ass. No wonder he looked so good against the likes of William, Patterson and Liston, a man he shouldn't have been fighting then as he cheated to get past his eliminator against Cooper. He's a good example of someone hyped by casuals and the media. Sugar Ray beat 10 Hall Of Famers in their primes mostly and with little controversy most of the time. If that's hype, then I don't know who's any good. That'd mean Greb is a nobody too and I doubt that anyone could say that and be sane.

Yeah this just isn't true at all.

It is very, very, very, very, very likely (maybe, 90-95%) that Pacquiao has cheated in his career. His avoidance of drug testing was a joke and only his rabid fans ate it up. The dude literally said he couldn't do RANDOM DRUG TESTING (the hallmark of OLYMPIC testing) because he was: - afraid of needles - giving blood weakened him - needed a cutoff date without giving blood And the Pacman ran with those excuses FOR YEARS...and the public LET HIM GET AWAY with it because they hate black people (Floyd). Meanwhile Floyd kept doing OSDT versus all his opponents including Mosley, Ortiz, JMM (peepee man LOL), Canelo, etc. Silver lining? Pacman got KTFO6 by a probable drug cheat AND...when Pac was finally ready to fight Floyd? Pac submitted to OSDT LMFAO..... Canelo tested positive for clenbuterol. It is very suspicious and it is probable he was using PEDs. He has since joined the WBC365 and done OSDT without 1 positive test...and he's been as dominant or more dominant than he's ever been. It must also be mentioned that when Canelo tested positive it marked the ONLY TIMES he's been tested in Mexico and there is an actual beef problem in Mexico as the agricultural industry uses clenbuterol in their cattle...make of that what you may. Similarly, I believe the rules have since changed and higher values are needed (beyond what is "normal" for ingestion of meat) to fail a drug screen for clenbuterol Pac fans let Pac get away with cheating because they hate black people? Are you really that stupid? Making excuses for Canelo too lol, clen isn't used for livestock as much as Mexican athletes would have you believe, it is only done on shady farms with no legal qualms. Also testing doesn't pick up on most of the cheating done in the modern day as so many substances are undetectable past a few hours.

Teixeira beat a very underwhelming plodder in Adames by the skin of his teeth, a literal 114-113 job on the cards. He gets stopped by any of the top 10.

Don't forget the Klitschkos too, their family was an upper middle class one.

Lots of boxers actually. Just not that noted as poverty tends to help with a hard man image. Guys like Nathan Cleverly who's actually got a degree in mathematics are not as rare as initially thought in boxing.

His era was filled with primarily past prime guys was my point. The next era came quick as things played out, but I think if he'd have stuck around a couple more years we'd have better knowledge about how good Rocky was based on how fights with Floyd & Sonny went. Eh, the same arguments used against Rocky here would've been used in his favour if he had lost to those guys. He retired at the perfect point in his career, totally on top and after beating an undisputed legend to solidify himself as one.

The last thing I'd call Rocky is underrated. I think he's more overrated than underrated. I think it's hard to gauge guys who never lost & that being the case they tend to get boosted up by more fans than bumped down. That said I think if he's underrated by some it's cuz he retired younger than most heavyweight champs & we don't got any concrete takes on how he'd have faired against the likes of Patterson or Liston who dominated after him & woulda branched him out to the next gen era more than his actual career did. He kinda faced all the top guys of his era and retired without making the fatal mistake of coming back to only get destroyed by the new up and comers as an old fighter.

It's because he's eastern European, black American and Latinos don't like that they're now all turning pro and doing better than them. Black Americans in particular have a real bone to pick with him it seems. They always seemed to thrive on the idea that they're the superior of all boxers. At least Africans don't engage in that bs, there's something wrong with America tbh.

Don’t be stupid. Fury beats up on a boxer that was clearly troubled by his heavy costume. Then you have to factor in his ostrich legs. Fury battered him for 7 rounds at will and still couldn’t knock him out. Fury doesn’t smash anyone. He is a masterful boxer and will be rightly favourite for the match against AJ but if he’s not stoping Wallin he is not stopping AJ. Wilder made Fury look like Foreman the way he was getting hit and staggering and we both know Fury has Silicone breasts as pillows. I will say you have been consistent you supported Fury when it was not cool to support him but calm the fuk down with this ludicrousness about AJ quitting.Tyson doesn’t have the power to make any top 10 quit In case you didn't notice, Wallin was definitely hurt by a few shots but he's definitely a tough son of a gun. I bet his chin is better than AJs to some degree.

Why is he tough because he withstood Fury’s shots, please..He made it to the 12th round and so would have Wilder. Fury stops nobody in the top 10. U basically have to be a walking punch bag and you are still guaranteed 36 minutes with Fury. Let Wallin take the shots from Klitschko That he took from Fury and let’s see if his chin is as tough as you think. Joshua took Klitschko right hand several times the night they fought. His chin is not as bad as most of you make out. As for Fury’s Boxing and IQ he is on another planet to all of them but I fancy AJ to push him close. Fury will resort back to the elusive Fury that fight Wallin takes more shots in general because he isn't at that level and everyone knows Klitschko can bang so that doesn't say anything. AJ did not take many clean shots that well. Klitschko became way too passive when he had AJ at his mercy for multiple rounds where he wasn't recovering well from the knockdown. You can tell it shook AJ up since then. His chin is average at best and you're underrating Fury's power. He's the only man to knock out Cunningham who faced some beasts in his time and he destroyed Hammer who can certainly take a shot. He was also clearly going to spark Wilder in that fight, you can't deny such an obvious fact. Fury's power is entirely dependent on what style he decides to use and what weight he feels comfortable at.

Beat everyone = weak era It's ironic that there's more credit in avenging defeat than there is in avoiding defeat. But it's all very subjective. It's true, like how Ali's era was considered strong even though it really wasn't all that stronger than any regular era. It's easy to single out the limited abilities of Frazier and Foreman. Norton was the most complete guy of that era and then again I thought he beat Ali every time they fought. Got unlucky against Holmes too, he was just unlucky in general.

It's easy to have a fast single punch in comparison to throwing lightning fast combos.

If he had a different complexion he would be viewed differently by almost all of those who hold an opinion about him now. That's how everyone evaluates fighters, certainly most everyone. I think most people acknowledge he was the best in a fairly weak era. Depending on how much you identify with him, you will have some saying 'he was the best and made others in his era look weak'; others will say 'he was overrated in a bad era.' As always the truth is probably somewhere in between. Always hard to compare eras and he was the best of his. He was a bit small imho to really compare to many ATG HWs but with his style he would have given most of them a great fight and would have probably won his fair share. He seemed about as tough as any HW ever and that is saying something and means something. Gotta imagine he would get the Joe Frazier vs George Foreman treatment from a lot of true HWs though. But then again a lot of 'great' HWs likely would have gotten that treatment. HWs have gotten bigger and better over time. This is how I see it. If he were fighting today he'd be a cruiserweight or light heavyweight and he'd probably have been a killer in either.

He didn't inspire much faith that he regained his confidence in the Ruiz rematch. He beat an even more out of shape man in a tidy boxing performance that was still quite a scared one. He refused to engage and when he was caught on the inside he had a look of unbridled fear in his eyes as he backed away nervously.

I don't deny he retired at a good time. I just think with his resume filled with mostly older names it gives him question marks that will never be answered & always be speculated on by the atg dorks. Maybe he'd have KO'd Sonny in 3, maybe Sonny would have KO'd him in 3. Who's to say who's right. No one. Let the what ifs remain what they were I guess and appreciate the achievements of the man. He beat some very good fighters apart from the old guys. Hell all those old guys were still serviceable too, none of them were shot.

I keep rewatching it too. Best fight I'm likely ever going to see live.

I recall that thread here. It's an interesting fact, but idk that it truly means anything or even what you are suggesting. I've not seen a lot of stats on how many big punching greats retired fighters to begin with, although I recall compiling some myself in the thread discussed, to gauge much of a take on if it's impressive in some way or if Rocky was just an outlier cuz he fought more older guys, near retirement guys or etc type opponents. I just looked at the ages of the likes of ****ell, La Starza, Matthews, Bashore, Layne and such and they were all at good ages when they fought him. ****ell was the only one who he seemed to just full on retire not long after due to the brutality of that victory. He did seem to put them all on a downward slide though so it sounded like his beatings had lasting effects. Some guys do have the ability to destroy a fighter like that. Wilder is one that'd spring to mind. Szpilka went from taking a load of good punches from wilder with ease to just getting destroyed from every punch that lands clean after his chin was shattered. Not to say his chin was ever great but he had recovery powers beforehand.

Yes agreed, well said. Good posts. No worries bro, I see you've paid attention to your boxing too and don't get caught up in fanboy narratives. I think fanboys in general are way too common here, impossible to talk to them.

I appreciate everyone's achievements. No argument from me Rocky was among the best of his day. BUT when we get into these atg dork debates or just overrated or underrated like got brought up here we gotta be realer & take things apart a little more. Looking at Rocky's title run idk that it's THAT quality a run outside of the name value. 1952 KO13 JJW, 38yrs old, 2nd to last fight 1953 KO1 JJW, 39yrs old, last fight KO11 LaStarza, lost next 3 fights before a 2yr layoff 1954 W15 Ezzard KO8 Ezzard 1955 KO9 C#ckell, 3rd to last fight, KO'd quicker in last 2 fights KO9 Moore, 38yrs old He fought old guys & guys on their way out primarily. The Ezzard W's are the most impressive by a mile cuz he was prime & wasn't on his way out. To be fair many many fighters who fought Rocky retired not too long after because it seems he kinda destroyed a lot of them physically and mentally.

This list was originally compiled by forum member hhascup. All you armchair historians sit back and learn how boxing men of times gone by viewed Marciano's place among the greats. Cox's Corner All Time Heavyweight Ratings THE TOP 20 HEAVYWEIGHTS OF ALL TIME Joe Louis Muhammad Ali Jack Johnson George Foreman Larry Holmes Jack Dempsey Sonny Liston Jim Jeffries Lennox Lewis Mike Tyson Rocky Marciano Joe Frazier Riddick Bowe Evander Holyfield Sam Langford Gene Tunney James J. Corbett Ezzard Charles Jersey Joe Walcott Max Schmeling Here's Bert Sugar's list: 1. Louis 2. Ali 3. Johnson 4. Dempsey 5. Tunney 6. Marciano 7. Charles 8. Foreman 9. Frazier 10. Holmes Historians Rankings (Please Note The Dates) Nat Fleischer, Founder of Ring Magazine, 1958, 1971. 1.Jack Johnson 2.Jim Jeffries 3.Bob Fitzsimmons 4.Jack Dempsey 5.Jim Corbett 6.Joe Louis 7.Sam Langford 8.Gene Tunney 9.Max Schemling 10.Rocky Marciano Charley Rose, 1968 1.Sam Langford 2.Jack Johnson 3.Jack Dempsey 4.Joe Louis 5.Jim Jeffries 6.Gene Tunney 7.Sam McVey 8.Rocky Marciano 9.Jim Corbett 10.Max Baer World Boxing 1974 Readers Poll 1.Joe Louis 2.Jack Dempsey 3.Rocky Marciano 4.Jack Johnson 5.Muhammad Ali 6.Joe Frazier 7.Gene Tunney 8.Jim Jeffries 9.Sonny Liston 10.Ezzard Charles Nat Loubet, 1975 1.Joe Louis 2.Jack Dempsey 3.Jim Jeffries 4.Jack Johnson 5.Rocky Marciano 6.Gene Tunney 7.Bob Fitzsimmons 8.James J. Corbett 9.Muhammad Ali 10.Joe Frazier John Durant -Author of "The Heavyweight Champions" (1976) 1.Joe Louis 2.Jack Johnson 3.Jack Dempsey 4.Muhammad Ali 5.Gene Tunney 6.Joe Frazier 7.Jim Jeffries 8.James J. Corbett 9.Rocky Marciano 10.Max Schemling Bill Brennan 1978 (Former President of the WBA) 1.Muhammad Ali 2.Joe Louis 3.Jack Dempsey 4.Jack Johnson 5.Gene Tunney 6.Jim Jeffries 7.Max Schemeling 8.Rocky Marciano 9.James J. Corebett 10.Bob Fitzsimmons Big Book of Boxing Reader Poll, 1978 1.Joe Louis 2.Muhammad Ali 3.Rocky Marciano 4.Jack Dempsey 5.Jack Johnson 6.Gene Tunney 7.Joe Frazier 8.Jim Jeffries 9.Ezzard Charles 10.Sonny Liston Bert Sugar, 1991 1.Jack Dempsey 2.Joe Louis 3.Muhammad Ali 4.Jack Johnson 5.Gene Tunney 6.Rocky Marciano 7.Joe Frazier 8.Larry Holmes 9.Sonny Liston 10.Mike Tyson Arthur Harris, 1992 (Nov 1992 Boxing Scene) 1.Muhammad Ali 2.Joe Louis 3.Jack Dempsey 4.Jack Johnson 5.Gene Tunney 6.Rocky Marciano 7.Larry Holmes 8.Jersey Joe Walcott 9.Joe Frazier 10.Sonny Liston Nigel Collins, 1997 1.Muhammad Ali 2.Joe Louis 3.Evander Holyfield 4.Larry Holmes 5.George Foreman 6.Jack Johnson 7.Rocky Marciano 8.Joe Frazier 9.Jack Dempsey 10.Sonny Liston Herbert Goldman, 1997 1.Muhammad Ali 2.Joe Louis 3.Sonny Liston 4.Mike Tyson 5.Larry Holmes 6.Jack Johnson 7.Jack Dempsey 8.George Foreman 9.Rocky Marciano 10.Joe Frazier Steve Farhood, 1997 1.Muhammad Ali 2.Joe Louis 3.Jack Johnson 4.Larry Holmes 5.Rocky Marciano 6.Jack Dempsey 7.Jim Jeffries 8.Evander Holyfield 9.Mike Tyson 10.George Foreman BBC Sports, 2004 1.Muhammad Ali 2.Joe Louis 3.Jack Johnson 4.Larry Holmes 5.Jack Dempsey 6.Rocky Marciano 7.Lennox Lewis 8.Mike Tyson 9.George Foreman 10.Evander Holyfield IBRO Member Poll, 2005 1.Joe Louis 2.Muhammad Ali 3.Jack Johnson 4.Jack Dempsey 5.Rocky Marciano 6.Larry Holmes 7.James Jeffries 8.George Foreman 9.Sonny Liston 10.Joe Frazier Tracy Callis Heavyweights: 1.Jim Jeffries 2.Jack Johnson 3.Jack Dempsey 4.Joe Louis 5.Muhammad Ali 6.Gene Tunney 7.Jim Corbett 8.Sonny Liston 9.Rocky Marciano 10.Larry Holmes ALL-TIME POUND-FOR-POUND BOXERS Max Kellerman: 1. Sugar Ray Robinson 2. Henry Armstrong 3. Muhammad Ali 4. Harry Greb 5. Sam Langford 6. Pernell Whitaker 7. Roberto Duran 8. Willie Pep 9. Benny Leonard 10. Ezzard Charles 10a. Jimmy Wilde Tony Atlas: 1. Sugar Ray Robinson 2. Henry Armstrong 3. Muhammad Ali 4. Benny Leonard 5. Sam Langford 6. Harry Greb 7. Mickey Walker 8. Roberto Duran 9. Gene Tunney 10. Carlos Monzon 10a. Joe Louis ESPN.com: 1. Muhammad Ali 2. Alexis Arguello 3. Henry Armstrong 4. Sugar Ray Robinson 5. Joe Louis 6. Roy Jones Jr. 7. Julio Cesar Chavez 8. Abe Attel 9. Ray Leonard 10. Rocky Marciano 10a. Wilfred Benitez Abe Attel in that ESPN list is a great shout, haven't heard his name since I read about the 1918 world series scandal.