Comments Thread For: Mayweather, Golovkin earn top billing for 2015’s first half

[kej718]

Floyd should be fighter of the year by himself. He just beat a top 5 p4p fighter in the biggest event of the past few years. What did GGG do (if he is moving done and beats Lara I'd give it to him, or if he moved up and faced Ward)? You could make an arguement and put Wilder above him if that is the case.

KO of the year is fine but these KO's were also good.
Artur Beterbiev KO over Gabriel Campillo
Andrew Tabiti KO over Thomas Hanshaw

[SteveM]

I agree that they see GGG as low reward/high risk which is why they do not fight him. In the case of the guys you mentioned, GGG is a big payday for them so that's why they choose to fight.

"KO artist" should be based on KOing quality fighters, not lower tiered fighters. I like watching competitive fights. I think most fans do.

Do you prefer competitive fights or fights where a guy you like is matched against a guy who will not be competitive?

But wilder is beating guys senseless as well-which is what you called compelling when GGG did it.

How you feel about wilder/Joshua/Parker is similar to how some feel about GGG he is getting over matched opposition. GGG's opponent's have better name value, but they are all over matched opponents there to be KO'd.

Maybe I am coming off to you sounding like I am just watching for the gore and guts - I'm not. What is compelling is not the KO-ing of any fighter but decent competition in the top 10 of the MW division. Geale and Murray were thought of as quality fighters prior to those fights. Too pretend otherwise is just post-revisionism at its worst.

If others think that Joshua's and Parker's opponents are on the same level as Golovkin's then that is their issue - I hope you are not including yourself in that group.

[kafkod]

I agree that they see GGG as low reward/high risk which is why they do not fight him. In the case of the guys you mentioned, GGG is a big payday for them so that's why they choose to fight.

"KO artist" should be based on KOing quality fighters, not lower tiered fighters. I like watching competitive fights. I think most fans do.

Do you prefer competitive fights or fights where a guy you like is matched against a guy who will not be competitive?




But wilder is beating guys senseless as well-which is what you called compelling when GGG did it.

How you feel about wilder/Joshua/Parker is similar to how some feel about GGG he is getting over matched opposition. GGG's opponent's have better name value, but they are all over matched opponents there to be KO'd.

Are you seriously trying to say that Wilder's resume at HW is equal to GGG's at MW?

That is a ludicrous claim. Another huge difference between GGG and Wilder is that GGG's resume would be better if he hadn't been and wasn't being avoided by other MW names and title holders like Martinez, Sturm, Quillin, Jacobs, N'Dam and, of course, Cotto. Not to mention Chavez and Froch.

Can you say the same about Wilder? Has he tried to make fights with the top men in his division and been turned down?

Everybody knows the difference between Wilder and GGG, even if they won't admit it.

[The Big Dunn]

Maybe I am coming off to you sounding like I am just watching for the gore and guts - I'm not. What is compelling is not the KO-ing of any fighter but decent competition in the top 10 of the MW division. Geale and Murray were thought of as quality fighters prior to those fights. Too pretend otherwise is just post-revisionism at its worst.

If others think that Joshua's and Parker's opponents are on the same level as Golovkin's then that is their issue - I hope you are not including yourself in that group.

I agreed with you that GGG's opponents have more name value. What you are glossing over is GGG was the heavy favorite and that the name opponents had no chance of winning.

This is why I can't call the fights compelling. Compelling is when the outcome is in doubt. You watched these fights, as most GGG fights, waiting for the inevitable KO to happen. That is the same as Joshua/wilder/parker.

If one isn't compelling, I don't think the other is either.

[The Big Dunn]

Are you seriously trying to say that Wilder's resume at HW is equal to GGG's at MW?

That is a ludicrous claim. Another huge difference between GGG and Wilder is that GGG's resume would be better if he hadn't been and wasn't being avoided by other MW names and title holders like Martinez, Sturm, Quillin, Jacobs, N'Dam and, of course, Cotto. Not to mention Chavez and Froch.

Can you say the same about Wilder? Has he tried to make fights with the top men in his division and been turned down?

Everybody knows the difference between Wilder and GGG, even if they won't admit it.

I know you can read, so rather than pretend I said something else, just address the point made.

GGG is beating guys he is heavily favored to beat that do have good name value. Wilder and other guys SteveM mentioned are Koing guys with no name value that they are heavily favored to beat. There isn't much difference to me or to other posters.

GGG fans focus on the name while others focus on the chances of losing.

GGG getting turned down doesn't justify his choices of opponents. A lot of posters do not think its OK to choose a Monroe just because you didn't get a canelo. In other situations when other fighters are in a similar situation as GGG and do not get the fight they want, posters do not give them a pass.

The main point is I disagreed with saying the fights GGG is in are compelling.

[kafkod]

I know you can read, so rather than pretend I said something else, just address the point made.

GGG is beating guys he is heavily favored to beat that do have good name value. Wilder and other guys SteveM mentioned are Koing guys with no name value that they are heavily favored to beat. There isn't much difference to me or to other posters.

GGG fans focus on the name while others focus on the chances of losing.

GGG getting turned down doesn't justify his choices of opponents. A lot of posters do not think its OK to choose a Monroe just because you didn't get a canelo. In other situations when other fighters are in a similar situation as GGG and do not get the fight they want, posters do not give them a pass.

The main point is I disagreed with saying the fights GGG is in are compelling.

Ok, but surely you can see that GGG being so heavily favoured to beat solid top 10 fighters like Murray and Geale, and beat them easily, is what makes him so compelling?

And seriously, who could he have fought instead of Monroe who he wouldn't have been heavily favoured to beat?

[The Big Dunn]

Ok, but surely you can see that GGG being so heavily favoured to beat solid top 10 fighters like Murray and Geale, and beat them easily, is what makes him so compelling?

And seriously, who could he have fought instead of Monroe who he wouldn't have been heavily favoured to beat?

Take ranking out of it like you would in all other instances. wlad koing leapai, a top 10 ranked fighters, was compelling? of course not. If Stevenson just murked Oosthuezin would that be compelling? of course not.

SO can we stop saying watching an inevitable KO is compelling or exciting just because its GGG when we do not do it in other fights including top 10 opponents?

[SteveM]

Take ranking out of it like you would in all other instances. wlad koing leapai, a top 10 ranked fighters, was compelling? of course not. If Stevenson just murked Oosthuezin would that be compelling? of course not.

SO can we stop saying watching an inevitable KO is compelling or exciting just because its GGG when we do not do it in other fights including top 10 opponents?

The possibility of a knockout in a fight is in and of itself not a compelling reason to see a fight viz a viz your examples above.

What IS compelling is 20 knockouts in a row against increasingly decent competition. So we have now arrived to a point where a large percentage of the viewers who tune into a GGG fight do so in order to see whether the 'monster' can continue his knockout streak and make it number 21.
Look upon it as the inverse of a Mayweather fight where the compelling factor is whether or not he can be defeated.

If Golovkin and Mayweather keep fighting then inevitably they would get beaten and the hype will evaporate. In Golovkin's case if he 'only' wins by decision a couple of times against supposedly B level fighters then that will be enough to suck a lot of gas out of his hype balloon. Until then he remains "the most exciting and most feared fighter in the sport" - and that's not me saying that but a consensus of opinion.

Kind of compelling huh?

[The Big Dunn]

The possibility of a knockout in a fight is in and of itself not a compelling reason to see a fight viz a viz your examples above.

What IS compelling is 20 knockouts in a row against increasingly decent competition. So we have now arrived to a point where a large percentage of the viewers who tune into a GGG fight do so in order to see whether the 'monster' can continue his knockout streak and make it number 21.
Look upon it as the inverse of a Mayweather fight where the compelling factor is whether or not he can be defeated.

If Golovkin and Mayweather keep fighting then inevitably they would get beaten and the hype will evaporate. In Golovkin's case if he 'only' wins by decision a couple of times against supposedly B level fighters then that will be enough to suck a lot of gas out of his hype balloon. Until then he remains "the most exciting and most feared fighter in the sport" - and that's not me saying that but a consensus of opinion.

Kind of compelling huh?

Please do not use the term "increasingly decent" to describe the competition. That is not accurate.

No, it's not for the reason you just stated. There is no way he will not keep getting KO's because he fights lowered tiered opponents if he doesn't get what he wants.

I would find it compelling if he fought Ward for instance, and either won or lost. Competition is compelling, waiting for the inevitable KO isn't to me.

The quality of a sporting event isn't determined solely by the outcome but what happens that cause the outcome.

[SteveM]

I know you can read, so rather than pretend I said something else, just address the point made.

GGG is beating guys he is heavily favored to beat that do have good name value. Wilder and other guys SteveM mentioned are Koing guys with no name value that they are heavily favored to beat. There isn't much difference to me or to other posters.

GGG fans focus on the name while others focus on the chances of losing.

GGG getting turned down doesn't justify his choices of opponents. A lot of posters do not think its OK to choose a Monroe just because you didn't get a canelo. In other situations when other fighters are in a similar situation as GGG and do not get the fight they want, posters do not give them a pass.

The main point is I disagreed with saying the fights GGG is in are compelling.

Huh?? You say GGG's fighters have "good name value" - what exactly is that?? You Big Dunn are choosing to use those words - many others would just say they are flat out a better standard of boxer compared to Parker's, Joshua's and Wilder's (pre-Stiverne) opponents. That GGG is heavily favored to beat those B level fighters is neither here nor there. We would all like to see him in with Froch, Ward, Canelo, Quillen, Jacobs but until that happens GGG has more than "passed the eye test".

Regards him fighting Monroe instead of Canelo .... other boxers don't fight 4 times a year so yeah, if you only fight once or twice a year, you will get shat on if you then fight a Salko or equivalent. Look at the crap Ward got for fighting Smith after 17 months out.

I venture that Golovkin's situation is very different to most other fighters. He is willing to fight any other in his division - how many other boxers are willing to do that? - just a handful right, and then over and above that his team (until proven otherwise) are trying to get him in with the biggest names. When they can't they get the best fighter available without a prearranged fight. Last I heard it was Monroe, Heiland or Johnson - none of them impressive names but best available.