Froch gets Cobra'd by Sir Joe!

[Dirk Diggler UK]

When did this happen?

I think it was November 2007 in front of 50 thousand people in Cardiff, Wales

What wins? Seriously?

Took Dirrell's 0. Took Pascal's 0. Took Groves' 0. Took Bute's 0. More or less took Abraham's 0. Damaged jermain taylor for life (and bute) and beat Kessler.

All of these were either world champions when they fought or became world champions after - except for Groves who is favourite to become champ in his next fight.

I'd say those wins are pretty good.

Yeah the wins are pretty good. The best of them is Kessler who Calzaghe pretty much played around with.

[LacedUp]

I think it was November 2007 in front of 50 thousand people in Cardiff, Wales

Yeah the wins are pretty good. The best of them is Kessler who Calzaghe pretty much played around with.

Hmm, I don't remember anyone playing with anyone. In fact, pretty sure Joe said that was one of, if not the toughest fight he ever had.

And that was against a one-handed Kessler which you seem to want to brush under the carpet.

[Dirk Diggler UK]

Hmm, I don't remember anyone playing with anyone. In fact, pretty sure Joe said that was one of, if not the toughest fight he ever had.

And that was against a one-handed Kessler which you seem to want to brush under the carpet.

A one handed Kessler? Based on what? A rumour started by Battling Nelson?

After the first four or five rounds, Kessler got completely outclassed.

And it was probably against a zero handed Calzaghe.

[Chrismart]

literlly no one cares about either of these guys,,i mean think about it calzaghes claime to fame was winning a robbery against b hop i mean wtf,,and froch is old and washed up and is known for getting btfo by ward

But your profile pic is of Garcia and Broner. Ironic.

[LacedUp]

A one handed Kessler? Based on what? A rumour started by Battling Nelson?

After the first four or five rounds, Kessler got completely outclassed.

And it was probably against a zero handed Calzaghe.

I think Frank Warren mentioned it the other day, or it might have been Spencer Fearon on Sky who said people "inside boxing" knew Kessler had a broken hand.

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/ar.../t-144845.html - before the fight.

Well, your argument was that Kessler was prime vs Calzaghe and not Froch - not whether Calzaghe had two hands.

[IronDanHamza]

Froch was inexperienced?

Dirrell was what? 25? And never been close to that level of fight and he was in Froch's backyard and made him look foolish at times.

Calzaghe was inexperienced against Reid who was a former world champion. It was a good back n forth fight where Reid admitted Calzaghe was the better boxer on the night. I don't remember Calzaghe being made to look like a rank amateur, the way Froch did at times against Dirrell.

Was he not? He clearly was.

I didn't sau Dirrell wasn't.

Froch today would slaughter Dirrell.

Reid said he was the better man because he got the decision. No complaints as it was close. He still thought he won as did many.

And yes Reid did make him look like an amateur at times. Many people did with Calzaghe.

Still don't see the difference. If Dirrell is arguably better than Froch then so is Reid with Calzaghe. Both lost close fights.

[IronDanHamza]

I think it was November 2007 in front of 50 thousand people in Cardiff, Wales



Yeah the wins are pretty good. The best of them is Kessler who Calzaghe pretty much played around with.

Doesn't matter. Like I said styles make fights.

The wins you asked for have been listed.

What's wins? Those wins..

[Dirk Diggler UK]

I think Frank Warren mentioned it the other day, or it might have been Spencer Fearon on Sky who said people "inside boxing" knew Kessler had a broken hand.

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/ar.../t-144845.html - before the fight.

Well, your argument was that Kessler was prime vs Calzaghe and not Froch - not whether Calzaghe had two hands.

It was a rumour that was never substantiated. Kessler was landing the right hands with full force before Calzaghe adjusted and pissed the rest of the fight.

Calzaghe would beat him easily 10 times out of 10 whereas Froch would always have some kind of struggle.

[Dirk Diggler UK]

Was he not? He clearly was.

I didn't sau Dirrell wasn't.

Froch today would slaughter Dirrell.

Reid said he was the better man because he got the decision. No complaints as it was close. He still thought he won as did many.

And yes Reid did make him look like an amateur at times. Many people did with Calzaghe.

Still don't see the difference. If Dirrell is arguably better than Froch then so is Reid with Calzaghe. Both lost close fights.

Froch was in his 30s and had defended his world title. He was fighting a virtual prospect.

Calzaghe was fighting an experienced ex world champion.

The difference is in the way each fight panned out. We've seen Froch get outboxed by Groves and Taylor too. Like I said, it's about levels.

Doesn't matter. Like I said styles make fights.

The wins you asked for have been listed.

What's wins? Those wins..

Yes, the best of which is a Mikkel Kessler who Calzaghe played around with like a child and actually came closer to stopping than Froch ever did.

[BennyST]

What wins? Seriously?

Took Dirrell's 0. Took Pascal's 0. Took Groves' 0. Took Bute's 0. More or less took Abraham's 0. Damaged jermain taylor for life (and bute) and beat Kessler.

All of these were either world champions when they fought or became world champions after - except for Groves who is favourite to become champ in his next fight.

I'd say those wins are pretty good.

They really aren't that good though. Solid, decent wins, but nothing to go to say he's head and shoulders above Calzageh because of. None of those 0's you mention are of fighters who have gone on to do anything of note whatsoever so far.

Dirrell is a never was at the moment. Same with Groves. Pascal a good solid win. Bute a good solid win. Taylor was damaged goods and never particularly good to begin with. Abraham a good solid win, but he was good at middleweight, not sr middle.

Taking someone's 0 is only good when that fighter actually goes on to show that it was a good win. If they don't do anything, it literally means nothing more than beating a dude with 10 losses. So far, the only guy to have gone on to do anything after Froch beat him was Pascal and he's been a good, but very patchy, flawed fighter.

These wins are absolutely no better than the Reids, Lacy's, Bikas, Mitchell's etc. it's just because they are doing it now, so you have the full memory of how good they are. In another twenty years, it'll get looked back upon without that bias and most of those wins you mentioned won't be considered particularly good and certainly no better than someone like Byron Mitchell for Calzaghe.

I think it comes down to Froch is fighting now and so people remember his opponents. When that's passed they'll be seen for what they are, and that is no better than many of Calzaghe standard wins.

See, people look at Dirrell as some great win, but he's literally lost every big fight he's had and even in today's title ridden landscape, hasn't managed to win even a minor title...sorry, he won by DQ against Abraham. How can you say that's any better than Lacy? They were both guys with potential and both never reached it. Lacy though was considers a hell of a lot better/hyped than Dirrell. It's no different.

Groves is the same so far. He hasn't done anything, two losses in his only title fights, except beat an inexperienced 10 fight Degale. Maybe he'll beat Badou Jack, but that's not exactly putting him in the HOF is it?

How do these two wins, against literal contenders in an age where it's harder to be a contender than it is champion, say great things about Froch resume compared to the same types of fighters for Calzaghe like a Mario Veit or David Starie? You don't remember them because they don't fight today, but as a comparison, Starie beat future LHW champ Clinton Woods before losing to Calzaghe and was all but undefeated. How's that different to Groves or Dirrell?

Even if Groves or Dirrell do manage to win some half baked title, they'll be comparative to a Richie Woodhall. Brief champions that got beat by the good guys.

Hopkins and prime Kessler. Better than any wins Froch has.