Is Oscar De La Hoya an all-time great?

[Mr. Fantastic]

No it doesn't.

Chavez and Whitaker may be ATGs, but their recent form had been even worse than Tarver's. Tarver wasn't too impressive against Jones in the third fight, but he still won by a wide margin. He clearly beat Johnson in the rematch, and should've won a close fight with Johnson in the first fight IMO, after KOing Jones.

That's better than Chavez squeaking by Kamau by the narrowest of margins, and beating Pink Walker, who made his name by beating an 100 year old Arguello. Whitaker had looked awful in recent fights, arguably losing to Rivera the first time around, and needing to rally in the championship rounds to stop Hurtado.

Not only that, but old Hopkins moved up two weight divisions and completely dominated Tarver. DLH-Whitaker could've gone either way.

Doesn't matter what they did in their previous fight, they are still great legends in the sport and DLH beat them. So you're saying Whitaker doing like crap but yet was at the #1 P4P spot. You're just trying to discredit DLH. A victory is a victory.
Tarver isn't anything special aside from beating Jones.

[JAB5239]

No, don't list losses as wins. Winky like it or not lost to Vargas, and DLH lost to Tito and Mosley. But Winky did dominate a still physically close to prime Tito, and Mosley twice. I wouldn't list Quartey, Vargas, or Leija as modern greats, more like good-very good belt holders.

Tito fought one time in 3 years, forget about it. Leija, Hernandez, Quartey and Vargas were all top of the line fighters who will be in the hall of fame and were on top of their game when they fought Oscar. This isn't even arguable.

[lparm]

Tito fought one time in 3 years, forget about it. Leija, Hernandez, Quartey and Vargas were all top of the line fighters who will be in the hall of fame and were on top of their game when they fought Oscar. This isn't even arguable.

Quartey and Vargas HoF? Sure I suppose if Barry did it they could do.

[Mr. Fantastic]

[COLOR="Navy"][FONT="Tahoma"]
I have to respectfully disagree with you on this. I've watched this fight a dozen times with and without sound and always have Oscar giving Tito a boxing lesson.

I agree with this. I've watched the fight plenty of times myself, though not as many and had DLH winning all the time.

[Thread Stealer]

Doesn't matter what they did in their previous fight, they are still great legends in the sport and DLH beat them. So you're saying Whitaker doing like crap but yet was at the #1 P4P spot. You're just trying to discredit DLH. A victory is a victory.
Tarver isn't anything special aside from beating Jones.

P4P rankings are very subjective anyway. It was clear that Whitaker was fading, and he arguably beat DLH anyway. It wasn't a clear victory.

Beating a legend doesn't mean it's a better win, because you have to take into account the stage they are in their career.

Chavez is miles greater than Vargas, but Vargas was a better win for DLH than Chavez was.

Likewise for Tito's wins over Vargas and Whitaker, or Calzaghe's wins over Kessler and Jones.

[Mr. Fantastic]

P4P rankings are very subjective anyway. It was clear that Whitaker was fading, and he arguably beat DLH anyway. It wasn't a clear victory.

Beating a legend doesn't mean it's a better win, because you have to take into account the stage they are in their career.

Chavez is miles greater than Vargas, but Vargas was a better win for DLH than Chavez was.

Likewise for Tito's wins over Vargas and Whitaker, or Calzaghe's wins over Kessler and Jones.

Hasn't Oscar been fading and still the opponents get credit?? Didn't Hopkins get credit for this "fading" Oscar??? Didn't Floyd get credit for the same "faded" Oscar too???

Vargas win was special to DLH cause of all that bad blood between them for all those years. Goes back to the amature days.

The Whitaker win was great, even if DLH barely won.

[JAB5239]

Quartey and Vargas HoF? Sure I suppose if Barry did it they could do.

Lol, this is your rebuttal? So tell me, who fought better fighters, Winky or Oscar?

[lparm]

Lol, this is your rebuttal? So tell me, who fought better fighters, Winky or Oscar?

Who beat the better prime fighters, Winky or Oscar? this is your rebuttal?

[Slotff]

No doubt about it.

[Thread Stealer]

Hasn't Oscar been fading and still the opponents get credit?? Didn't Hopkins get credit for this "fading" Oscar??? Didn't Floyd get credit for the same "faded" Oscar too???

Vargas win was special to DLH cause of all that bad blood between them for all those years. Goes back to the amature days.

The Whitaker win was great, even if DLH barely won.

Floyd mainly only deserves credit for the DLH win because of the size disadvantage. Other than that, I didn't think much of it at all.

I don't think much of the Hopkins win over DLH. It helped somewhat that it was a catchweight of 158, and Hopkins even went to 156, but it is more name value than a actual great quality win for Hopkins.