Is Calzaghe the Greatest of All Time?

[bsrizpac]

Only a true **** would say Calzaghe is on Ottkes level.

True.

Ottke > Calzaghe.

[royjonesjr11]

His record is impressive but is also a fraud? How does that one work?

his record is impressive to look at because when you see 46 and 0 you go wow and then you see he defeated champions like lacy, kessler, hopkins and rjj and then you're blown through the roof. that is the only reason why people put calzaghe up there in my opinion. but if you actually dig up the files and look at them carefully, you'll realise that lacy was overrated; kessler had only defeated euro club fighters in his career; hopkins and rjj both old men need i say anymore? i will give credit that hopkins is actually still 43 years young as we are all aware after his pavlik fight but i still insist that i think he should have taken the bout back in april. so besides these 4 big names calzaghe has fought nobody but bums. boxing aint all about the records, you've gotta look at the fights and take everything else into consideration.

wiley, calzaghe isn't both "right and left handed", every boxer is either one or the other - calzaghe wouldn't have fought all 46 of his fights strictly in southpaw stance if he hadn't had favoured his left hand. fact. if you're gonna tell me that he adopted a southpaw stance to be awkward, then he should have switched back to an orthodox stance while fighting other southpaw fighters. but he didn't. so there we go. calzaghe is left handed.

calzaghe is a tremendous athlete, has a good chin and is very determined and has a good winning menality. the fighter has heart. that's as far as i will go. as far as a skillful boxer goes i give him naff. it's a joke for him to be even considered near the all time greats

over and out

[Wiley Hyena]

The use of statistics as a yard-stick for achievement doesn't sit well with me at all. I like Calzaghe well enough but personal feelings on a fighter shouldn't come into play if you're weighing something as heavy as where a boxer sits on an ATG list. Statistics?

Against Clottey Margarito set a compubox record for the most punches ever thrown in the history of the sport. Does that mean he's the best conditioned boxer ever? Does it mean he's the most grueling pressure fighter the sport of boxing has ever seen? I don't really believe so...statistics can deceive if not taken in context.

Further, if you want to use statistics let's continue with Compubox - love it or hate it, it's decently respected in the sport. There was mention of how many punches Calzaghe lands and how that shows the effectiveness of his offense and possibly adds to his 'ATG' status.

Most punches ever landed, by Compubox, in boxing history? Who do you think? Answer: Phillip Holiday's '96 win over Ivan Robinson. Is he the best boxer of all time? I mean, statistically he's landed more punches than anyone in the sport's modern history, right? Sure, the Compubox record book for most punches landed has Hall of Fame worthy names like James Toney, Oscar De La Hoya, Pernell Whitaker, Barerra, Morales and even Arturo Gatti. But guess what? Kasim Ouma and Daniel Zarazoga are also in the top 5 for most landed punches in compubox history. Where do they stack up in ATG lists?

Going by statistics- plain numbers- Sugar Ray Robinson lost 19 times by the time he hung it up. 19 times! Based on numbers he's not looking to good against the undefeated likes of Joe Calzaghe and Floyd Mayweather, huh? Anyone who argues those two names are better than Robinson are smoking some very good ****. Yes, Robinson had a far more amazing number of wins - but I'm illustrating how misleading numbers can be.

Like others have said- Joe Calzaghe was probably the first career HoF fighter at suppermidleweight. He didn't use it as a stop-off up or down the boxing weight class ladder, and the man held a title there for his entire career. He'll make the Hall of Fame and probably some ATG lists....but weighing what he's done in a arguably much weaker division makes it hard to stack him up against the sport's other illustrious fighters and have Joe come out on top. Statistics lie but examining a boxer's fight-by-fight achievements can help you come to a more clear picture of where they stand in the history of the sport.

In short: statistics are bull****, Joe Calzaghe was a good, unorthodox fighter in a largely unheralded weight class that held a significant title, fought a few ATG veterans late in their careers before hanging it up. He'll go down at one of the sport's best but- in a very crowded list- he'd be lucky to crack the top 30, let alone even approach the top of the short list.

Nice post, but statistics are not b.s. They are something that have to be considered when evaluating a champion's place in history. In this respect, Calzaghe is number TWO. This cannot simply be ignored by objective boxing purists.

[bsrizpac]

Nice post, but statistics are not b.s. They are something that have to be considered when evaluating a champion's place in history. In this respect, Calzaghe is number TWO. This cannot simply be ignored by objective boxing purists.

About time you admitted Floyd > Joe.

[Dan...]

Nice post, but statistics are not b.s. They are something that have to be considered when evaluating a champion's place in history. In this respect, Calzaghe is number TWO. This cannot simply be ignored by objective boxing purists.

Haha. Nothing can really be said can it?

[Derranged]

No..........................

[daggum]

julio cesar chavez was 87-0 before he even got his first draw. guess he should have retired then. he would have been 41 times better than calzaghe.

[Wiley Hyena]

About time you admitted Floyd > Joe.

We'll watch Floyd for the future....if there is one. He makes ATG unless he gets seriously exposed. I doubt he'll ever fight one of his truly dangerous peers, though. His track record suggests otherwise. This is the lingering question regarding Floyd.

[Wiley Hyena]

julio cesar chavez was 87-0 before he even got his first draw. guess he should have retired then. he would have been 41 times better than calzaghe.

Chavez.....a great fighter. I will edit my thread starter to include his name. Thanks for mentioning him.

[Wiley Hyena]

his record is impressive to look at because when you see 46 and 0 you go wow and then you see he defeated champions like lacy, kessler, hopkins and rjj and then you're blown through the roof. that is the only reason why people put calzaghe up there in my opinion. but if you actually dig up the files and look at them carefully, you'll realise that lacy was overrated; kessler had only defeated euro club fighters in his career; hopkins and rjj both old men need i say anymore? i will give credit that hopkins is actually still 43 years young as we are all aware after his pavlik fight but i still insist that i think he should have taken the bout back in april. so besides these 4 big names calzaghe has fought nobody but bums. boxing aint all about the records, you've gotta look at the fights and take everything else into consideration.

wiley, calzaghe isn't both "right and left handed", every boxer is either one or the other - calzaghe wouldn't have fought all 46 of his fights strictly in southpaw stance if he hadn't had favoured his left hand. fact. if you're gonna tell me that he adopted a southpaw stance to be awkward, then he should have switched back to an orthodox stance while fighting other southpaw fighters. but he didn't. so there we go. calzaghe is left handed.

calzaghe is a tremendous athlete, has a good chin and is very determined and has a good winning menality. the fighter has heart. that's as far as i will go. as far as a skillful boxer goes i give him naff. it's a joke for him to be even considered near the all time greats

over and out

Wrong. Calzaghe is truly ambidextrous. This is a fact.