UFC is taking over

[Luciano]

Dumbass.. Boxing is a lot bigger in the world especially in Europe and in Asia.

MMA is not taken seriously in Asia and if you think MMA is still hot in Japan then you are a bigger idiot. The Kameda boxing brothers, especially Koki Kameda gains 50%+ TV ratings each time he fights while the MMA and k-1 scene in japan is not so hot right now and it got worse with the death of PrideFC.

I also bet you don't know that EliteXC lost a huge amount of money last year..

Get your facts straight you idiot..

First of all time to school your ass. DREAM and WVR are way bigger than Koki Kameda. And you're naming one boxer. Look at all the judo Olympic medalists who transfer into mma, and realize that the amateur mma scene in Asia is 10x bigger than the one for boxing, obviously you don't know ****. As far as EliteXC goes, you're talking about last year, I'm TALKING ABOUT A PRIMETIME NETWORK TV DEAL. WHERE IS BOXING'S???? Idiot. K-1 is huge in Europe, especially Eastern Europe, way bigger than boxing. Same with mma. When you have ***** attending Fedor's sambo and mma matches, I think that tells you something. When a country has a national sport (wrestling, judo, sambo, kickboxing) and top level guys join mma, and continue to do so, it will always grow. MMA has been around since 1993, more specifically as far as the mma we see today, the late 90s. I'm not talking the dark age UFC, Pancrase, or any of that. I'm talking sanctioned mixed martial arts. When mma goes the same way of boxing (independent promoters) the sport will really take off. Thanks for embarassing yourself, now go back in whatever hole you crawled out of.

By the way, mma fights have 5 minute rounds, 10 in Japan. Some mma fights have gone over an hour. Cardio is comparable in both sports, top notch wrestlers are in just as good of shape if not better then top notch boxers. Idiot.

[Luciano]

First of all time to school your ass. DREAM and WVR are way bigger than Koki Kameda. And you're naming one boxer. Look at all the judo Olympic medalists who transfer into mma, and realize that the amateur mma scene in Asia is 10x bigger than the one for boxing, obviously you don't know ****. As far as EliteXC goes, you're talking about last year, I'm TALKING ABOUT A PRIMETIME NETWORK TV DEAL. WHERE IS BOXING'S???? Idiot. K-1 is huge in Europe, especially Eastern Europe, way bigger than boxing. Same with mma. When you have ***** attending Fedor's sambo and mma matches, I think that tells you something. When a country has a national sport (wrestling, judo, sambo, kickboxing) and top level guys join mma, and continue to do so, it will always grow. MMA has been around since 1993, more specifically as far as the mma we see today, the late 90s. I'm not talking the dark age UFC, Pancrase, or any of that. I'm talking sanctioned mixed martial arts. When mma goes the same way of boxing (independent promoters) the sport will really take off. Thanks for embarassing yourself, now go back in whatever hole you crawled out of.

By the way, mma fights have 5 minute rounds, 10 in Japan. Some mma fights have gone over an hour. Cardio is comparable in both sports, top notch wrestlers are in just as good of shape if not better then top notch boxers. Idiot.

As far as GSP vs A. Silva, I don't think that will be close at all. A. Silva defended takedowns from Marquardt and Hendo, Hendo would absolutely steamroll GSP. A. Silva's striking is in another world compared to GSP, who hasn't struck with anybody since the first Serra fight. A. Silva also has better BJJ, better technique, a better chin, and has never been knocked out. I don't think that fight is even close.

[flem1]

First of all time to school your ass. DREAM and WVR are way bigger than Koki Kameda. And you're naming one boxer. Look at all the judo Olympic medalists who transfer into mma, and realize that the amateur mma scene in Asia is 10x bigger than the one for boxing, obviously you don't know ****. As far as EliteXC goes, you're talking about last year, I'm TALKING ABOUT A PRIMETIME NETWORK TV DEAL. WHERE IS BOXING'S???? Idiot. K-1 is huge in Europe, especially Eastern Europe, way bigger than boxing. Same with mma. When you have ***** attending Fedor's sambo and mma matches, I think that tells you something. When a country has a national sport (wrestling, judo, sambo, kickboxing) and top level guys join mma, and continue to do so, it will always grow. MMA has been around since 1993, more specifically as far as the mma we see today, the late 90s. I'm not talking the dark age UFC, Pancrase, or any of that. I'm talking sanctioned mixed martial arts. When mma goes the same way of boxing (independent promoters) the sport will really take off. Thanks for embarassing yourself, now go back in whatever hole you crawled out of.

By the way, mma fights have 5 minute rounds, 10 in Japan. Some mma fights have gone over an hour. Cardio is comparable in both sports, top notch wrestlers are in just as good of shape if not better then top notch boxers. Idiot.

LOL! lemme see.. I think you just started wtaching MMA right? K-1 is not huge in Europe. Boxing is a lot bigger in there. Boxers who are obscure in the US but popular in Europe almost always has 20,000 - 50,000 audiences when they fight. They also earn alot of dough that dwarves the MMA fighters measly pay. They are also watched by Millions in Europe. Also ***** was in attendance when Ibragimov fought Holyfield.

And whoah! You were talking about Asia in your previous post but I see you were just talking about Japan, haha.. Anyways if you watch the Amateur Boxing Scene in Asia, you would be amazed at how many boxers join in each event, there are hundreds. K-1 is more popular in Korea compared to boxing.

Dream and WVR is bigger than Koki Kameda? HAHAHAHAHA!! This just shows how clueless you are. Didn't you know that even before PrideFC died the Kameda brothers were trampling them with the TV ratings they have? Hell, K-1 and K-1 Max in Japan only does 10-12% viewership in while when these brothers fight, they have like 50%+ tv ratings. DREAM did not even fare well in ratings in their first show and got only like 8.9%, HAHAHA!.

[flem1]

Also, Quit fooling yourself Luciano, MMA fighters have much worse stamina than boxers. Almost all of them always seem to blow their stamina after a brief flurry of punches.

[Luciano]

LOL! lemme see.. I think you just started wtaching MMA right? K-1 is not huge in Europe. Boxing is a lot bigger in there. Boxers who are obscure in the US but popular in Europe almost always has 20,000 - 50,000 audiences when they fight. They also earn alot of dough that dwarves the MMA fighters measly pay. They are also watched by Millions in Europe. Also ***** was in attendance when Ibragimov fought Holyfield.

And whoah! You were talking about Asia in your previous post but I see you were just talking about Japan, haha.. Anyways if you watch the Amateur Boxing Scene in Asia, you would be amazed at how many boxers join in each event, there are hundreds. K-1 is more popular in Korea compared to boxing.

Dream and WVR is bigger than Koki Kameda? HAHAHAHAHA!! This just shows how clueless you are. Didn't you know that even before PrideFC died the Kameda brothers were trampling them with the TV ratings they have? Hell, K-1 and K-1 Max in Japan only does 10-12% viewership in while when these brothers fight, they have like 50%+ tv ratings. DREAM did not even fare well in ratings in their first show and got only like 8.9%, HAHAHA!.

I've been watching mma since '94. When I was talking about Asia I obviously was talking about Korea as well. Hence mention of Judo medalists, which as you know, are not just Japanese like Yoshida. K-1 and mma is way bigger then boxing in countries like Russia, Croatia, Netherlands, France etc. Not to mention the thai influence (I know they like boxing too, but muay thai a lot more). I know about the amateur boxing scene in Asia (why capitalize that?), and it pales in comparison to the amateur judo and mma scene. K-1 is more popular in Korea, and in Japan as well, despite the Kameda brothers huge ratings you claim (I honestly don't know much about the ratings of them) on a whole mma is more popular then boxing. Just because two brothers who box outdraw any mma show (aside from the old Shockwaves of course) does not mean boxing is more popular and that mma is dead over there, which is what you argued. It means those brothers are stars, and have captured mainstream attention, more so then the average mma card. I know DREAM did not do well. You though, also know why. I forget the name of the channel, TBS or something, they have been with K-1 for years now. They are horrible, edit the cards, have too many commercials. In comparison, when PRIDE FC was on Fuji before the yakuza scandal, it was a lot bigger. So on a whole, in western europe and asia, THE SPORT OF MMA is far bigger than boxing.

[Luciano]

Also, Quit fooling yourself Luciano, MMA fighters have much worse stamina than boxers. Almost all of them always seem to blow their stamina after a brief flurry of punches.

I'm fooling myself and you just claimed they gas after a flurry of punches??? How a guy who knows things can post such ridiculous crap is beyond me. Do some research and watch some training of fighters like Koscheck, Sherk, Wanderlei etc. Did you ever think that wrestling and the ground, along with multiple strikes from 4 oz. gloves would affect the stamina??? LOL

[flem1]

Read this Luciano, this is about the MMA scene in Japan right now posted by a big MMA fan from Japan.:

Not many people "cared" about MMA to begin with. MMA is hard to sell. Unlike K-1, that anything-goes feel is violent, with so many tattoo-ed up guys literally ****ing each other. Hardcore tattoo=yakuza=scum for many Japanese. It's not like MMA has ever gotten monstrous ratings before. Just a particular kind of people were very passionate about it, and that included many 30-49 year-old guys who occupied creative/good positions in the media world and elsewhere. They created that sense of euphoria in the Japanese MMA world, because they were influential. But for the other people, it was just some new spectacle after K-1, maybe a little bloodier and interesting, and obviously you can't get good ratings if you only rely on the aforementioned people. Those people don't watch network TV at all other than news and live sports (as I don't). Since PRIDE disappeared in such a dramatic fashion, the momentum has been lost. They can't mobilize the general public like they used to be able to do.

That being said, this (rating) was very much expected. Even in the PRIDE context, you gotta say it was a Bushido + Mirko against some unknown dude. Fuji TV never allowed Bushido to be aired in the prime time slot for a reason. LW bouts look too much like an actual sport rather than a show, and not much spectacle there. You need to be semi-knowledgeable about the sport to appreciate it, and the overwhelming majority of the Japanese general public aren't. Kid's popularity relies a great deal on his family's legacy too (his older sister might still be better-known than Kid himself is for many people, actually), so he's just a special case.

That's why DREAM 1 was damned as soon as it was confirmed that there would be no PPV. Just symbolically so. Bushido without PPV and Gomi is simply meaningless. Who were they trying to appeal to? Few remember Mirko now, and the actual fans aren't exactly excited about his "return." Aoki is not star material, neither is Kawajiri. Gomi would not be either, but at least he is a sort of a symbol, and he fights like a son of a *****.

And yeah, Naito got very good ratings just a week ago. His personality has been fully exploited, and his boxing isn't pretty, but there is something about boxing as well. It's legit. It's a legit way to spend some time in front of TV on. People might not care about boxing any more, but its myth is still alive. People at the age of 50-60 still fondly remember the days when they religiously read a manga series called A****a no Jo and shed tears in their room when he died in the last episode (sorry for the spoiler, lol). Jo is still a hero for a lot of them. He's someone who represents all of the baby boomers' achievements and ultimate failure, communism, socialism, capitalism, colonialism, social injustice, peace, love, hate, and money.

The attendance for the Naito fight was actually miserable, but it triumphed on TV. MMA can punch out far better attendance numbers, but it bombs on TV like this. It's not really fair, but just the reality.

Also, a few weeks before that, a completely meaningless soccer match between South Korea and Japan got 17.7% in the SAME time slot on TBS. This is "thank you and good-bye" ratings by Fuji's standards, but maybe it is by TBS's standards as well.

http://forum.kakutougi.info/showthread.php?t=9800&highlight=dream+ratings

[Luciano]

Read this Luciano, this is about the MMA scene in Japan right now posted by a big MMA fan from Japan.:



http://forum.kakutougi.info/showthre...=dream+ratings

The article was biased, look at the b.s. said about Gomi, who is one of the biggest stars in Japan in any sport. What about Sakuraba, Yoshida or countless others??? Don't forget, PRIDE averaged over 50,000 a show at the Saitama Super Arena. And TBS is horrible, which is why the product is suffering TV ratings wise.

[flem1]

I'm fooling myself and you just claimed they gas after a flurry of punches??? How a guy who knows things can post such ridiculous crap is beyond me. Do some research and watch some training of fighters like Koscheck, Sherk, Wanderlei etc. Did you ever think that wrestling and the ground, along with multiple strikes from 4 oz. gloves would affect the stamina??? LOL

Koschek? the guy who like to pin down opponents on the ground? Sounds tiring eh, hehe.. Sherk? The roided guy who got banned right? He also gulps 72 capsules last time I saw him on TV.. Wanderlei Silva? bad example dude, he is another guy who can't pace himself, swing wildly and tires out in the 2nd round. Hell, most MMA fights that I watched that did not have takedowns had both fighters tiring quick.

Most boxers punch 30-100 per round with 8-10oz gloves on while MMA fights that which were fought mostly standing up had both fighters quickly gassing.

[flem1]

The article was biased, look at the b.s. said about Gomi, who is one of the biggest stars in Japan in any sport. What about Sakuraba, Yoshida or countless others??? Don't forget, PRIDE averaged over 50,000 a show at the Saitama Super Arena. And TBS is horrible, which is why the product is suffering TV ratings wise.

It's not biased, it's reality.