Who had better boxing fundamentals Muhammad Ali or Roy Jones jr

[F l i c k e r]

Ali easily. Even with his hands down style, still Ali easily.

Evidence is when they both aged. Ali had something to fall back on when his speed and movement dwindled. Still able to compete with the best. When RJJ's speed and movement dwindled he had nothing to fall back on. Hence being owned by guys he would have annihilated in his prime.

Ali had the better fundamentals. When all else fails, go back to boxing 101. RJJ couldn't do that.

[THE REED]

Ali easily. Even with his hands down style, still Ali easily.

Evidence is when they both aged. Ali had something to fall back on when his speed and movement dwindled. Still able to compete with the best. When RJJ's speed and movement dwindled he had nothing to fall back on. Hence being owned by guys he would have annihilated in his prime.

Ali had the better fundamentals. When all else fails, go back to boxing 101. RJJ couldn't do that.

Really it was Ali's ability to take a punch... take that away and he would have had plenty of knock out losses...

[F l i c k e r]

Really it was Ali's ability to take a punch... take that away and he would have had plenty of knock out losses...

Possibly. I'm not even big on Ali to be honest. But when they aged, he was able to fend opponents off better than what RJJ is doing now. Even shot, RJJ is still trying to do that little stutter w/ the hands down and pull the leaping hook. If he had better fundamentals he wouldn't resort to those sort of actions.

[THE REED]

Possibly. I'm not even big on Ali to be honest. But when they aged, he was able to fend opponents off better than what RJJ is doing now. Even shot, RJJ is still trying to do that little stutter w/ the hands down and pull the leaping hook. If he had better fundamentals he wouldn't resort to those sort of actions.

Not possibly, Definitely.

Some of the shots he took laying on the ropes would knock most men out... Frazier hit him with some unbelievable left hooks on the ropes, that I honestly don't know how he stayed on his feet.

Or a better chin...

[F l i c k e r]

Not possibly, Definitely.

Some of the shots he took laying on the ropes would knock most men out... Frazier hit him with some unbelievable left hooks on the ropes, that I honestly don't know how he stayed on his feet.

Or a better chin...

lol, I know you like RJJ a lot but come on. He's still doing things shot, that he did in his prime and he is losing because of it. Not as fast or reactive and still leaping chin up hands down towards opponents.

With a better chin, does he beat Calzaghe?

[THE REED]

lol, I know you like RJJ a lot but come on. He's still doing things shot, that he did in his prime and he is losing because of it. Not as fast or reactive and still leaping chin up hands down towards opponents.

With a better chin, does he beat Calzaghe?

I'm talking about the comparison between him doing better than Ali post prime... Ali's chin is what made him be able to lay on the ropes and fight off them... without that chin, that wouldn't work. Roy doesn't have that chin so he tries to box in the center of the ring... and no it doesn't work, either..

[joseph5620]

Really it was Ali's ability to take a punch... take that away and he would have had plenty of knock out losses...

That's really all that matters in the long run. When fighters get older and start slipping they are going to get hit more. Period. Either they can take the punches or they can't. And that goes for all fighters regardless of their "technical" abilities. I don't care what kind of "fundamentals" an old fighter uses. He's going to get hit more when he becomes an old fighter. How did an old shot Joe Louis "fundamentals" work against Marciano and Ezzard Charles? Even some of the best defensive boxers in history got hit consistently when they got old.



What prime Ali and Jones jr did in their primes worked very well for them. That's all that matters.You don't try to fix something that's not broken.

[Kid McCoy]

Forget all the walking around weight and in ring stuff, he had to weight in at 175 which meant an 18 pound difference from his last weigh in. I don't see how an 18 pound difference isn't going to significantly hurt a fighter when they are 35 years old and in the 50th fight. It wasn't like Roy had gotten fat or whatever heavyweights blow up in weight all the time, Roy was shredded when he fought Ruiz and his body couldn't handle the weight loss it at that stage in his career.

That punch that Tarver KO'd Roy with wasn't any harder then the punch Lou Del Valle knocked him down with or the over hand right that Montell Griffin hit him with but forget the KO even in the first fight you could tell Roy was a shell of himself.

Roy always cut down from the 180s to 175. He was just starting from a point ten or so lbs higher than usual. I don't believe that going 10-12 lbs higher than his regular ring weight somehow destroyed his chin in a fight that took place 14 months later. If that were the case then how come Tarver didn't come close to KO'ing Jones in their other two fights? That Tarver punch was much harder than that half punch half shove Del Valle shot, and Jones even looked shaky for a few moments after that one. Tarver was just a Hail Mary shot, could have happened to Jones at any point in his career.

If Jones weighed over 180 for his light heavyweight fights I would be willing to bet it was the very low 180's.

He was 181 for Woods, 182 for Reggie Johnson, 180 for Tarver II. Those are all the ones I know, but I'd guess all the others are around that mark too.

[SCtrojansbaby]

Roy always cut down from the 180s to 175. He was just starting from a point ten or so lbs higher than usual. I don't believe that going 10-12 lbs higher than his regular ring weight somehow destroyed his chin in a fight that took place 14 months later. If that were the case then how come Tarver didn't come close to KO'ing Jones in their other two fights? That Tarver punch was much harder than that half punch half shove Del Valle shot, and Jones even looked shaky for a few moments after that one. Tarver was just a Hail Mary shot, could have happened to Jones at any point in his career.

He was 181 for Woods, 182 for Reggie Johnson, 180 for Tarver II. Those are all the ones I know, but I'd guess all the others are around that mark too.

We are getting off the point Roy after the Ruiz fight had no chin and no reflexes which will make any fighter useless.

[JAB5239]

We are getting off the point Roy after the Ruiz fight had no chin and no reflexes which will make any fighter useless.

He still had better reflexes than most of the division. The problem was his lack of fundamentals caught up with him and he no longer had the natural ability to avoid taking bombs.