Could anyone beat SRR at 147?

[IronDanHamza]

Honestly, there are many fighters that could beat him and would give him great trouble either way. All of the best 147 guys, at their best, were monsters and all could give Robinson more than a good fight.

He had his problems with certain styles. A skilled inside fighter with speed and savvy, a fast boxer and a powerful boxer/puncher have all given him trouble throughout his career. In reality there are many fighters who could have beaten him at 147 on any given night.

I remember reading somewhere (can't remember where right now. I think it was SI) in an article that was asking this question to some great old trainers who had seen Robinson and they had said that they considered Mantequilla and Hands of Stone to give him the toughest fight and were two guys who could beat him on their best night. I would personally throw in Leonard and Hearns too. Napoles is another. McLarnin too, though he would have to lose first before winning.

Let's face it: the welterweights have probably the deepest level of talent along with the lightweight and middleweight division so to say anyone is unbeatable is crazy. Robinson gets closer than anyone else probably, but he would lose to fighters being listed here. There are just too many good fighters. Charley Burley was in Robinson's era and could have given him what for....?

You know, for some reason and for the life of me I don't know why but I forgot about Charley Burley!

Charley Burley is probably the sole fighter that I would pick to get the better of Robinson in a trilogy.

But I have to agree with Poet on the rest. Do I think a fighter could beat Robinson at WW? Absolutely.

Robinson isn't going 3-0 at WW with the likes of Burley, Hearns, Leonard, Griffith, Napoles, Mclarnin, Joe Walcott, Barney Ross, Henry Armstrong, or even the great Kid Gavilan.

But, every one of those fighters, I would favour Robinson to beat if they had only 1 fight where they both came in at theier very best.

[Miburo]

I don't see Armstrong (basically a junior WW fighting up) doing it, Robinson was so much larger than him.

[IronDanHamza]

Wasn't he a welterweight until about 1906? I might be wrong about this. I think he had 30+ bouts at the weight. Almost all of which he won by KO. He fought only journeymen and lightweights I believe.

I remember reading somewhere that Abe Attell named Stanley Ketchel as the greatest welterweight of all time. This is clearly bull****, but does seem to suggest he must have spent some worthwhile time in the division.

I'm not trying to claim he had a world class resume at 147, just that a welterweight Ketchel must have carried some power.

I'm not too sure myself to be honest.

I think he may have started at WW but I do know if he did, as you stated he did pretty much nothing there.

[joseph5620]

No, good point. Right you are.

However, a lot of the rest I don't really agree with. There's a big difference between the power punching Hearns and the relatively light punching Lamotta.I could easily see Hearns dropping him, but not keeping him there just as he did Leonard.

Their primes? I would absolutely say they were both iron chinned and unstoppable in their primes. Ray's chin was also one of his best assets. Tested by some of the truly most vicious fighters and tested very, very well. I would argue that having Hearns hit you with some perfect right hands is having your chin tested more than Robinson's ever was in his prime. Having a brilliantly conditioned, like the lightweight version of Duran testing your chin over and over without it breaking is another test well passed.

I still think, especially in their primes (as it wasn't until Leonard was inactive, shot or drug ****ed that he seemed to lose it), that they were both iron chinned beasts with very similar chins.

That's true but Lamotta was so much bigger than than Robinson in that fight. It was a fight betwween a middleweight and a 144 pound welterweight. And I have no doubts that the Middleweight Lamotta was much stronger than welterweight Hearns.

[McGoorty]

Can someone provide me links to full fights of Sugar Ray Robinson at welterweight

[joseph5620]

I know I posted earlier, but I can't believe that I forgot,.... and so did the rest of you. But I have to throw his name in,... In my opinion there is one guy who was a monster at WW, and possibly the man with the tools to beat Sugar Ray Robinson...... MICKEY WALKER the forgotten Welterweight by the looks of things....... at WW Walker had the chin, the hand speed, a huge ****er, and the ability to dominate Ray on the inside,.. Mickey's intensity could be a real problem for Ray.... I don't see Walker trying to box for long, but the only way Ray keeps him off for long is by hitting hard enough to discourage Walker...... discourage Walker ???....... The big advantage I have for Walker is that I believe he is stronger than Ray, I believe that Walker was a near perfect WW, but he wanted the glory to be had in the Heavier divisions......... I just can't believe it took me this long to mention him........ he was a very great fighter.... period.

That looks like hyperbole to me. Walker was not unbeatable or perfect at 147 and not only could Robinson discourage Walker, he could have knocked him out too.

[McGoorty]

That looks like hyperbole to me. Walker was not unbeatable or perfect at 147 and not only could Robinson discourage Walker, he could have knocked him out too.

Oh I don't know about that, it seems funny to me that he wasn't mentioned at all,,,, Nobody is the perfect Welterweight but Robinson is the closest. But can't you just think about all the things he had at WW and the fact that as a fighter who could take Jack Sharkeys best punches is going to easily succumb to Ray. To me the fight would be one of the best of all time,... Ray would be drawn into a slugfest,..... and he was just as brilliant in a slugfest as he could ever be as a boxer I know,,.... just look at the footage I provided for Mr. Pew,.... Ray is trading bucketloads with those guys, especially Georgie Abrams (a bloody good fighter too,.... and so was Angott),.. but as everyone knows,.. that can get you beat,..... especially from Mickey Walker ,,, one HELL Of a ****ER,.... and a very quick finisher,...... if that sounds like hyperbole to you,... then sue me.

[McGoorty]

Can someone provide me links to full fights of Sugar Ray Robinson at welterweight

[joseph5620]

Oh I don't know about that, it seems funny to me that he wasn't mentioned at all,,,, Nobody is the perfect Welterweight but Robinson is the closest. But can't you just think about all the things he had at WW and the fact that as a fighter who could take Jack Sharkeys best punches is going to easily succumb to Ray. To me the fight would be one of the best of all time,... Ray would be drawn into a slugfest,..... and he was just as brilliant in a slugfest as he could ever be as a boxer I know,,.... just look at the footage I provided for Mr. Pew,.... Ray is trading bucketloads with those guys, especially Georgie Abrams (a bloody good fighter too,.... and so was Angott),.. but as everyone knows,.. that can get you beat,..... especially from Mickey Walker ,,, one HELL Of a ****ER,.... and a very quick finisher,...... if that sounds like hyperbole to you,... then sue me.

Walker was no longer a welterweight when he fought Sharkey. That's a different version of him. I assumed you were talking about matching him against Robinson at 147 where I don't see him winning under any scenario.

[McGoorty]

Walker was no longer a welterweight when he fought Sharkey. That's a different version of him. I assumed you were talking about matching him against Robinson at 147 where I don't see him winning under any scenario.

I was referring only to Walkers chin,.... Great at any weight.