Why I've come to respect Rocky Marciano so much (and it's not about 49-0).

[Mr Mitts]

Quite rarely is a paleface able to move around the ring like a flashy black. Johnny Tapia? Others?

[Bronson66]

- - Neither Dempsey or Rocky drew the color line and thems the facts Jackson. Used to be Rocky retired to avoid Liston floated by the usual lowbrows who heavily penetrate boxing in all aspects. Facts were Liston was avenging his loss to little Monte Marshall in 1955 when Rocky had his last fight vs Archie and wasn't even rated by Ring until 1958 long after Rocky retired.

Dempsey is my favourite fighter,but he must take his share of the blame for the Wills fight not happening.
ps It's Marty

[them_apples]

Is the argument here that no race has ever dominated boxing.... or that boxing has always been dominated by non Black boxers...?

that no race has actually dominated boxing. There have been good fighters of many races, because it starts in the heart and mind.

noobs think its athleticism cause thats all they see

boxing is timing and balance..just act jack Blackburn

people think Roy Jones was so athletic but completely ignore the fact that he had an insane work ethic

Even James Toney - sure he didn't run - but he sparred more than everyone and had one of the best coaches in the fight game. it's all surface level observation.

[GhostofDempsey]

In theory his Suzie Q was as important in its hip movement as it was his right hand.

There was more going on in Marciano than just being a mere thug.

But to many he wasn't the right skin color to be a great boxer. There is a racist rule that says white skin can't fight so he must have been given help, while all black fighters were held back.

Anyone claiming whites never faced prejudice or discrimination in boxing needs to wipe the fog from their glasses and find better sources.

Invisible Italian American boxers – To the untrained eye, it seemed that prior to the 1920s there were few noteworthy American boxers of Italian origin—and a limited presence in the decades that followed. But behind many Irish boxing names, there frequently stood an olive-skinned, dark-haired fighter with a hidden identity. More than one thousand Italian professional boxers went by Irish pseudonyms.

Italian immigrants entered boxing at a time when the booming American economy took advantage of Italian muscle to fuel the nation’s growth. However, the ruling elites—the very ones who benefitted from cheap immigrant labor—disparaged Italians, describing them as “biologically incapable” and a “burden on America.”

In addition to enduring these attacks, Italian immigrants came into conflict with the established Irish working class in almost every sphere of society. They fought over municipal and construction jobs. They argued over church matters within the predominantly Irish-controlled Catholic Church. In many instances, Italians were forced to worship in the back, and sometimes even in the basement, of these buildings.

Boxers with Italian names were often met with "virulent hostility" and jeers from crowds, particularly from the predominantly Irish boxing patrons. The National Police Gazette in 1903 observed this hostile reception, noting a clear difference in how Irish and Italian fighters were received.

In 1903, the National Police Gazette captured this, reporting that:

It is amusing to note the way in which the crowd at ringside receives the different nationalities of fighters. There is always a hearty cheer and earnest backing for the Irishman; grins and good-humored tolerance for the German and virulent hostility to the Italian and the Negr0. Put a boy of any race in with an Italian and everybody in the house who is not himself of Italian origin at once begins to root frantically against the son of ancient Rome. It is to the credit of the Italians that they have pushed so far forward against such adverse influences.

Those who refused to change their name frequently complained at the lack of regular fights. Minnesota-native Tony Caponi, who fought between 1902-1917, blamed his lack of booking on his surname, believing that to promoters his real name sounded “more like a music master than a prizefighter.” For a time, Caponi changed his name to TC O’Brien. For the next several decades, a host of other Italian boxers from all across the country followed this trend.

New Jersey-native and pre-World War I heavyweight contender Andrew Chiariglione claimed his Irish moniker on a Utah boxing card. Irritated by the announcers’ inability to pronounce his surname correctly and anxious to get the fight under way, Chiariglione bellowed, “Oh, hell, just call me Jim Flynn.” From then on he became known as “Fireman” Jim Flynn.

The Italians were forced to change their names because the Irish and the Germans were running everything,” he reflected. “They had to change their names otherwise they would have got the worst of it. They got better jobs.

While no area remained untouched, having an Irish moniker was a necessary evil just to get a foothold in the boxing arena. It offered more prominent billing on boxing cards and ensured a wider appeal to audiences expecting to see men with the crowd-pleasing qualities that were synonymous with Irish-American prizefighters.

[QueensburyRules]

That's not true.

- - Useless sound bite quote. As soon as record $$$ hit the Wills fight, Dempsey and even Kearns were all in.

$$$ talks while you know shyte.

[Bronson66]

Anyone claiming whites never faced prejudice or discrimination in boxing needs to wipe the fog from their glasses and find better sources.

Invisible Italian American boxers – To the untrained eye, it seemed that prior to the 1920s there were few noteworthy American boxers of Italian origin—and a limited presence in the decades that followed. But behind many Irish boxing names, there frequently stood an olive-skinned, dark-haired fighter with a hidden identity. More than one thousand Italian professional boxers went by Irish pseudonyms.

Italian immigrants entered boxing at a time when the booming American economy took advantage of Italian muscle to fuel the nation’s growth. However, the ruling elites—the very ones who benefitted from cheap immigrant labor—disparaged Italians, describing them as “biologically incapable” and a “burden on America.”

In addition to enduring these attacks, Italian immigrants came into conflict with the established Irish working class in almost every sphere of society. They fought over municipal and construction jobs. They argued over church matters within the predominantly Irish-controlled Catholic Church. In many instances, Italians were forced to worship in the back, and sometimes even in the basement, of these buildings.

Boxers with Italian names were often met with "virulent hostility" and jeers from crowds, particularly from the predominantly Irish boxing patrons. The National Police Gazette in 1903 observed this hostile reception, noting a clear difference in how Irish and Italian fighters were received.

In 1903, the National Police Gazette captured this, reporting that:

It is amusing to note the way in which the crowd at ringside receives the different nationalities of fighters. There is always a hearty cheer and earnest backing for the Irishman; grins and good-humored tolerance for the German and virulent hostility to the Italian and the Negr0. Put a boy of any race in with an Italian and everybody in the house who is not himself of Italian origin at once begins to root frantically against the son of ancient Rome. It is to the credit of the Italians that they have pushed so far forward against such adverse influences.

Those who refused to change their name frequently complained at the lack of regular fights. Minnesota-native Tony Caponi, who fought between 1902-1917, blamed his lack of booking on his surname, believing that to promoters his real name sounded “more like a music master than a prizefighter.” For a time, Caponi changed his name to TC O’Brien. For the next several decades, a host of other Italian boxers from all across the country followed this trend.

New Jersey-native and pre-World War I heavyweight contender Andrew Chiariglione claimed his Irish moniker on a Utah boxing card. Irritated by the announcers’ inability to pronounce his surname correctly and anxious to get the fight under way, Chiariglione bellowed, “Oh, hell, just call me Jim Flynn.” From then on he became known as “Fireman” Jim Flynn.

The Italians were forced to change their names because the Irish and the Germans were running everything,” he reflected. “They had to change their names otherwise they would have got the worst of it. They got better jobs.

While no area remained untouched, having an Irish moniker was a necessary evil just to get a foothold in the boxing arena. It offered more prominent billing on boxing cards and ensured a wider appeal to audiences expecting to see men with the crowd-pleasing qualities that were synonymous with Irish-American prizefighters.

This statement may have been relevant in the early 1900's,but I don't think it applied to the 40's and 50's when Rocky came up .

Mancini
De Marco
Basilio
Loi
Rosi
Jannazzo
Janiro
Fusari
Zannelli
Durando
Castellani
Giardello
Giambra
Apostoli
Mauriello
Graziano
Lamotta
Bettina
Lastarza
Pastrano
Muscato
Valentino
Maxim
Dorazio
Bucceroni
DeJohn
Miceli
Were all very popular fighters in the 40's and 50's and if a couple of them shortened their names , it was for billboard purposes not because of prejudice. By the 40's men of Italian heritage were increasingly becoming fight fans and, more importantly,they had the do re mi to show it by buying tickets to see their ethnic heroes. Being of Italian origin in those two decades certainly wasnt a draw back financially,and that was the era the fighter in question ,Marciano plied his trade.

[travestyny]

- - Useless sound bite quote. As soon as record $$$ hit the Wills fight, Dempsey and even Kearns were all in.

$$$ talks while you know shyte.

You're obviously just lonely. All you posts is nonsense. Back in the ignore bin you go.

Talk to you next year when I do my annual iggy bin clean out. I'm sure I won't miss anything.

[Bronson66]

You're obviously just lonely. All you posts is nonsense. Back in the ignore bin you go.

Talk to you next year when I do my annual iggy bin clean out. I'm sure I won't miss anything.

He's a harmless attention seeker

[travestyny]

He's a harmless attention seeker

Now he's going to have to seek someone else's attention for the rest of the year.

[GhostofDempsey]

- - Useless sound bite quote. As soon as record $$$ hit the Wills fight, Dempsey and even Kearns were all in.

$$$ talks while you know shyte.

He has his anonymous sources all queued up anytime Dempsey's name is mentioned. LOL