Why I've come to respect Rocky Marciano so much (and it's not about 49-0).

[QueensburyRules]

<it is not in my personality to do something like this. While I may sound ungrounded - I am generally quite a detached person. It comes across as hero worship - I assure you it is not. Rock is a master of subtlety.

his style is not graceful - and this is why I use words like cunning and clever not high IQ or ring generalship. Its all in how he presents himself>

Detached? Perhaps from your senses, lad. A master of subtlety is about the weirdest supposedly sincere statement I have ever seen on a boxing forum. Do you actually believe you are convincing anyone of this tomfoolery?--That Marciano was quick, clever and full of strategies and traps?

Conclusion: you are not for real but playing games, thinking up and then saying the most bizarre and outlandish propositions you can dream up for entertainment purposes. Even that is a more subtle strategy than Marciano ever had. Love ya anyway

- - Obviously Rocky was a feather fisted, fleet footed sissy in disguise.

[Mr Mitts]

To answer this:

it is not in my personality to do something like this. While I may sound ungrounded - I am generally quite a detached person. It comes across as hero worship - I assure you it is not. Rock is a master of subtlety.

his style is not graceful - and this is why I use words like cunning and clever not high IQ or ring generalship. Its all in how he presents himself.

Let me rephrase that then: Marciano was a long way from cunning or clever.

[Bronson66]

Why I Have Come to Respect Rocky Marciano So Much And Its Not About 49-0


I wasnt always a big Marciano fan. I didnt grow up idolizing him and I didnt just accept the 49-0 argument at face value. In fact for a long time I didnt rate him as highly as others did

That changed when I actually started studying him. Watching the fights closely. Looking at how he moved how he broke guys down. And I will be honest my respect for him now doesnt come from his body of work it comes from the way he fought

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The Obsession Behind the Fighter


Marciano was obsessed. This wasnt just some hard working guy. He trained every hour of every day to build a body that could go to war. He worked on his neck jaw rotator cuffs back core legs and lungs constantly not just to look good but to become a machine

He didnt train for fights. He lived like he was always in camp. Every detail mattered. He understood that you dont build power or endurance just with technique you build it with obsessive full time conditioning

I call this the art of effort. He wasnt the most athletic guy or the tallest or the fastest but no heavyweight in history pushed harder longer or more consistently than Marciano. His average day was probably harder than most fighters peak days

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Baseball Timing and Why His Power Was Different


Before boxing Marciano was obsessed with baseball. That is not a throwaway fact it actually explains a ton about his punching mechanics

Baseball is all about timing. You are trying to generate power and precision against a fast moving object. You swing with your entire body legs hips shoulders wrists in one explosive chain. That is exactly how Marciano punched

He didnt throw textbook shots. He punched like he was swinging a bat short loaded shots with every ounce of his kinetic chain behind them. That is where his true power came from. Not brute strength but sequencing leverage and torque. He understood the physics of violence

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The Resume Not the Deepest But Definitely Underrated


People love to discredit his resume. Too small Too old Weak era. But that is lazy analysis

First of all Marciano weighed 184 to 187 lbs. He wasnt big himself so acting like he bullied smaller guys makes no sense. Most of his opponents actually outweighed him

And he did fight some big guys they just werent elite enough to be remembered by the public. But the best names on his resume They were technically brilliant fighters

• Ezzard Charles was more skilled and experienced than anyone on Alis resume.
• Jersey Joe Walcott was clever durable and gave Joe Louis serious problems. He didnt suddenly become useless overnight
• Joe Louis while past his prime was still beating contenders and could have avoided Rocky if he wanted to. He didnt and Rocky ended his career

Let us not ignore that Marciano ended careers. He didnt squeak by. He broke guys down and retired them. That matters

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Lets Compare That to Liston and Tyson


If we are going to talk resumes let us stop pretending Marcianos is worse than Sonny Listons or Mike Tysons

• Liston lost early lost in his prime and folded late. His best win was over Patterson a blown up middleweight who got stopped multiple times in his own right
• Tyson was a beast no doubt. But when he faced top level guys who didnt fold Holyfield Lewis he broke. His resume is loaded with guys who were beaten before the first bell

Meanwhile Rocky Never folded Never got outworked Never once took a round off

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And This Is Why I Rate Him Now


Look this isnt about making Marciano number one on some mythical all time list. Its about understanding why he was special

He didnt just win. He imposed his will

He had a motor no one could match. Joe Frazier Love the guy but he didnt have Marcianos reserve tank. He didnt carry that kind of relentless pace deep into fights. He got hurt. Rocky You cannot find a moment where he really looked hurt. Go watch the tapes even when he touches down the lights never went off and the legs never wavered. if anything this signalled something bad was coming in retaliation

And listen to the guys who fought him they all say the same things

• You could not hurt him
• The pressure never stopped
• He was freakishly strong

When both Ali and Joe Louis say a guy was immensely strong not just strong but like something otherworldly you better believe there is something there worth noticing

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Final Word


I didnt start off as a Marciano fan. But the more I watched the more I learned and the more I respected him

Not for being perfect Not for having the best opponents

But for showing what true obsessive total dedication to fighting looks like. For fighting like every second mattered. For turning himself into the most efficient relentless machine the sport has ever seen. TRUE DEDICATION produces exactly what Marciano was, extremely light for his size but immensly strong and durable. Many simply cannot understand this because he's one of the only guys who did this. Out side of a few other great fighters like Sam Langford and Harry Greb. both of them accomplished this in the same way he did with obsession.

That is why I rate him the way I do
â

'I died a thousand deaths every time I watched Rocky in the ring. But I never missed one of his fights - I was always there at ringside.
Now that Rocky is through and will never go back to the ring, I can still scare myself remembering those 49 nights and 49 fights. I mentioned how scared I was at these times, and Rocky teases me. But now I can laugh about it, too, because I know he retired so he could be a full-time father to Mary Anne, our daughter - and I know he'll never try a comeback. Rocky wants to be a family pleaser, not a crowd pleaser.
I think the worst of those 49 fights was the night he won the title from Jersey Joe Walcott. He got a cut on his head and the medication they put on it ran into his eyes and blinded him. For three rounds he stumbled around the ring and I could hear him saying, 'I can't see... I can't see.'
That was a son-of-a-gun of a fight and I never suffered like that before or since. I was seven months pregnant but I couldn't stay away. And there was my Rocky up there, blinded and bIeeding. I could have died.
Frank Sinatra was sitting right behind me during the fight. Afterward he told me, 'Barb, I didn't see that fight at all. I couldn't keep my eyes off you. I'm a nervous wreck.'
During all his fights, I never worried about Rocky getting licked. I just prayed he wouldn't get hurt.'
- Barbara Marciano

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[them_apples]

'I died a thousand deaths every time I watched Rocky in the ring. But I never missed one of his fights - I was always there at ringside.
Now that Rocky is through and will never go back to the ring, I can still scare myself remembering those 49 nights and 49 fights. I mentioned how scared I was at these times, and Rocky teases me. But now I can laugh about it, too, because I know he retired so he could be a full-time father to Mary Anne, our daughter - and I know he'll never try a comeback. Rocky wants to be a family pleaser, not a crowd pleaser.
I think the worst of those 49 fights was the night he won the title from Jersey Joe Walcott. He got a cut on his head and the medication they put on it ran into his eyes and blinded him. For three rounds he stumbled around the ring and I could hear him saying, 'I can't see... I can't see.'
That was a son-of-a-gun of a fight and I never suffered like that before or since. I was seven months pregnant but I couldn't stay away. And there was my Rocky up there, blinded and bIeeding. I could have died.
Frank Sinatra was sitting right behind me during the fight. Afterward he told me, 'Barb, I didn't see that fight at all. I couldn't keep my eyes off you. I'm a nervous wreck.'
During all his fights, I never worried about Rocky getting licked. I just prayed he wouldn't get hurt.'
- Barbara Marciano​

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hard as absolute ****ing nails…

I wouldn’t call him a family man though - she was doing the typical sunshine and rainbows talk of the day.

just to clarify as well : the whole purposefully missing to set up a real punch etc was a trick not only employed by Marciano regularly - but by many other fighters as well. It’s not even goldmans own trick. Blackburn was well aware of it, and drilled the strategy into Louis. - swing a cinderblock with the left that misses, close the door with the right hand- something like that- sorry Bronson I cannot source everything I say because I can’t recall the exact source always - but I will say it works like a charm and I certainly won’t take credit making it up.

[QueensburyRules]

- - It was pretty much established in Rock's title reign that he eventually developed a sorta cutie style that allowed him to leverage his power.

In the beginning he was just a club footed clod with a lotta of power, so it didn't look like much of a future then, but now he's a magnet for proto anthropoids.

[Willie Pep 229]

In theory his Suzie Q was as important in its hip movement as it was his right hand.

There was more going on in Marciano than just being a mere thug.

But to many he wasn't the right skin color to be a great boxer. There is a racist rule that says white skin can't fight so he must have been given help, while all black fighters were held back.

[Bronson66]

In theory his Suzie Q was as important in its hip movement as it was his right hand.

There was more going on in Marciano than just being a mere thug.

But to many he wasn't the right skin color to be a great boxer. There is a racist rule that says white skin can't fight so he must have been given help, while all black fighters were held back.

I'd say to some his skin colour is the most important thing about him ,and a factor in his greatness.

[Bronson66]

- - It was pretty much established in Rock's title reign that he eventually developed a sorta cutie style that allowed him to leverage his power.

In the beginning he was just a club footed clod with a lotta of power, so it didn't look like much of a future then, but now he's a magnet for proto anthropoids.

Actually its pretty much established that in the latter part of his career , Goldman sacrificed some of that power coaching Rocky in throwing combinations.

[Willie Pep 229]

I'd say to some his skin colour is the most important thing about him ,and a factor in his greatness.

"Most important" --- I agree!

His white skin helped to insure the audience of the new TV era that would create a golden age of boxing.

He's is always on my list of: The Ten Most 'Important' boxers because of his white skin at just the right time.

And "no" he did have the finesse that Apple wishes he had; he was much more than the simple thug some on this forum try to paint him as.

[Bronson66]

"Most important" --- I agree!

His white skin helped to insure the audience of the new TV era that would create a golden age of boxing.

He's is always on my list of: The Ten Most 'Important' boxers because of his white skin at just the right time.

And "no" he did have the finesse that Apple wishes he had; he was much more than the simple thug some on this forum try to paint him as.

He was a great fighter and champion,that should be enough for anyone.