Im Getting Pig Sick Of Arseholes Derailing My Threads with Agenda Driven BS

[Ivich]

Trying to stimulate discussion and rekindle some interest in what is starting to be an apathetic Forum is becoming a thankless task.I made a thread about Joe Jeannette and what would have happened if he had beaten Johnson in1912?

Dr Z jumps on it like a dog with a bone and commences to turn it into a hate fest against Johnson when the thread is about Jeannette! I'm heartily sick of this lunatic he is banned for life for just this sort of behaviour on another forum.

WTF is the point of making an effort when you have moronic haters like him waiting to turn threads into agenda driven sewage?

[Marchegiano]

To keep away the second death of the men we cover.

[Willow The Wisp]

It is thankless. You are good to do it.
Alota foolish folks in the world.
You can't convert them, they are resolutley against self improvement or community contribution.

All we can do, really; is to murder them, grind up their flesh, ****e them and sell them as famous meat pies.

[GhostofDempsey]

You're cherry picking your outrage. Travesty turns every thread he posts on into a Dempsey hate thread, even if it's about Johnson or other fighters of the era. You've never raised a fuss because he largely agrees with you about Johnson. At least Johnson was part of the topic in your thread. He was open game for any criticism that came along. Non-Dempsey threads always get highjacked by one individual with an agenda, you don't seem the least bit phased by it. This has been going on for years.

[Willie Pep 229]

To keep away the second death of the men we cover.

Some guy said: You die three times.

First time you realize you are mortal.

Second time when you actally die.

Third time when they stop talking about you. (When you are forgotten.)

[BattlingNelson]

I can recommend using the forum feature of ‘ignore list’. That should help.

[Ivich]

You're cherry picking your outrage. Travesty turns every thread he posts on into a Dempsey hate thread, even if it's about Johnson or other fighters of the era. You've never raised a fuss because he largely agrees with you about Johnson. At least Johnson was part of the topic in your thread. He was open game for any criticism that came along. Non-Dempsey threads always get highjacked by one individual with an agenda, you don't seem the least bit phased by it. This has been going on for years.

I don't cherry pick and Travestny and I profoundly disagree about Dempsey . He feels the same way about Dempsey as you and Z feel about Johnson,but at least he provides primary sources to back his opinion!

I've made numerous comments about a poster derailing my and other peoples threads , so you are totally wrong about that..
You've been on my case since my very first post,that's fine you are entitled to decide you don't like me or my content,just don't misrepresent me because of your antipathy.
The subject of my thread was Jeannette and whom he would fight had he beaten Johnson in1912
NOT WHO JOHNSON DID NOT FIGHT DURING HIS REIGN
You know it and I know it so cut the crap.

For the record my thread is aimed at Z not you.

DR Z sees every thread as an opportunity to get his hate licks in on a champion,whether it be
Johnson,Dempsey, Louis ,or Lewis .So spare us the disingenuous BS

If you make what I consider is a good post I give it a like,I certainly don't expect any reciprocation from yourself on that score , so I'm not destined to be dissapointed any time soon!

You're a Dempsey fan yet when Z makes BS remarks about Dempsey hitting Sharkey when he wasn't looking,that Dempsey had an iron bolt in his hand when he fought Willard,that he avoided Kid Norfolk. You're as silent as the grave!
We both know why, because you share a hatred of Johnson.So kindly do not ascribe motives to me which are all too apparent in yourself!

[Shadoww702]

Before my time So I stay in my lane....

[GhostofDempsey]

I don't cherry pick and Travestny and I profoundly disagree about Dempsey . He feels the same way about Dempsey as you and Z feel about Johnson,but at least he provides primary sources to back his opinion!

I've made numerous comments about a poster derailing my and other peoples threads , so you are totally wrong about that..
You've been on my case since my very first post,that's fine you are entitled to decide you don't like me or my content,just don't misrepresent me because of your antipathy.
The subject of my thread was Jeannette and whom he would fight had he beaten Johnson in1912
NOT WHO JOHNSON DID NOT FIGHT DURING HIS REIGN
You know it and I know it so cut the crap.

DR Z sees every thread as an opportunity to get his hate licks in on a champion,whether it be
Johnson,Dempsey, Louis ,or Lewis .So spare us the disingenuous BS
If you make what I consider is a good post I give it a like,I certainly don't expect any reciprocation from yourself on that score , so I'm not destined to be dissapointed any time soon!

You're a Dempsey fan yet when Z makes BS remarks about Dempsey hitting Sharkey when he wasn't looking,that Dempsey had an iron bolt in his hand when he fought Willard,that he avoided Kid Norfolk. You're as silent as the grave!
We both know why, because you share a hatred of Johnson.So kindly do not ascribe motives to me which are all too apparent in yourself!

I actually provide sources when criticizing Johnson, you guys just ignore them or dismiss them. His "primary" sources are usually anonymous news clippings without much if any context, or it was news on the date it was printed but more recent developments aren't printed or posted. We all know promoters and managers had access to the media to get articles they wanted run in the local papers. McKetrick was notorious for doing this.

I have not been on your case, you began our interactions with angry posts and name calling. You set the tone for our earliest communications, you even created an alt to cheer you on. That said, I could have done a better job at diffusing those back and forth disagreements rather than escalating them.

I've made posts to the contrary of Dr. Z's comments about Dempsey. As far as I'm concerned, the topic has been done to death and then some. No one will change anyone's mind on where they stand with Dempsey, Wills, Johnson, Ali or any other fighter often discussed on this forum. At some point I need to drop the rope and quit the endless tug-o-war battles that muck up the forum.

For anyone interested in this topic, both of Pollack's recent books on Dempsey is a must read for anyone who is a fan of him or hates him. Lots of context regarding the Wills saga that would dispel the Dempsey ducking myths. But some posters here would rather cherry pick sources from Google than actually read a well researched book or question the motives of their sources.

The problem here is when someone posts anything negative about a fighter, the defenders often insist it is out of hatred. I don't hate Jack Johnson. I have commended him in some of my posts for the climate in which he was champion and the challenges he faced as the first black HW champion. That said, I never thought he deserved all of the praise and adulation he receives and I honestly believe he drew the color line as champion. Jeannette, McVey and Langford who were there, also believe that. I also think his resume is overrated given the times in which he fought them where they were either novices or overmatched in size. That is my prerogative. I'm entitled to that opinion and I've supported it with valid sources.

If you understood some of the underlying resentment on this site, you would know that Travesty never showed any interest in Dempsey until I started posting on this site. He made it his personal agenda to attack Dempsey in a childish attempt at goading me into a drawn out debate with his often anonymous or out of context irrelevant sources. He purposely ignores sources presented to him and deflects. He hijacks every thread on the history forum and always finds a way to make it about Dempsey--go back and look at his post history. He plays the whataboutism game and refuses to take context into consideration. He makes allowances for Johnson's comments and choice of opponents, but takes Dempsey's out of context. It's a waste of time. By the way, this all began because I dared to criticize Mayweather years ago while he was arguing with a few posters on a Floyd/Manny thread where he went on for hundreds of pages and thousands of posts over the course of several years. Since then he has stalked me all over the forums hopelessly trying to prove me wrong and failing at every turn.

I don't have a personal beef with you. But when people disagree with you, you have a tendency to get prickly and take it personal. We all get ****** into heated arguments from time to time. We all get a little defensive and stubbornly hold our ground. If you are frustrated with a particular poster over a beef that has carried over from other forums, I understand the tone of your posts. I've engaged in arguments where I look back and think it would have been best to just disengage instead of taking the bait. We live and we learn.

[Ivich]

I actually provide sources when criticizing Johnson, you guys just ignore them or dismiss them. His "primary" sources are usually anonymous news clippings without much if any context, or it was news on the date it was printed but more recent developments aren't printed or posted. We all know promoters and managers had access to the media to get articles they wanted run in the local papers. McKetrick was notorious for doing this.

I have not been on your case, you began our interactions with angry posts and name calling. You set the tone for our earliest communications, you even created an alt to cheer you on. That said, I could have done a better job at diffusing those back and forth disagreements rather than escalating them.

I've made posts to the contrary of Dr. Z's comments about Dempsey. As far as I'm concerned, the topic has been done to death and then some. No one will change anyone's mind on where they stand with Dempsey, Wills, Johnson, Ali or any other fighter often discussed on this forum. At some point I need to drop the rope and quit the endless tug-o-war battles that muck up the forum.

For anyone interested in this topic, both of Pollack's recent books on Dempsey is a must read for anyone who is a fan of him or hates him. Lots of context regarding the Wills saga that would dispel the Dempsey ducking myths. But some posters here would rather cherry pick sources from Google than actually read a well researched book or question the motives of their sources.

The problem here is when someone posts anything negative about a fighter, the defenders often insist it is out of hatred. I don't hate Jack Johnson. I have commended him in some of my posts for the climate in which he was champion and the challenges he faced as the first black HW champion. That said, I never thought he deserved all of the praise and adulation he receives and I honestly believe he drew the color line as champion. Jeannette, McVey and Langford who were there, also believe that. I also think his resume is overrated given the times in which he fought them where they were either novices or overmatched in size. That is my prerogative. I'm entitled to that opinion and I've supported it with valid sources.

If you understood some of the underlying resentment on this site, you would know that Travesty never showed any interest in Dempsey until I started posting on this site. He made it his personal agenda to attack Dempsey in a childish attempt at goading me into a drawn out debate with his often anonymous or out of context irrelevant sources. He purposely ignores sources presented to him and deflects. He hijacks every thread on the history forum and always finds a way to make it about Dempsey--go back and look at his post history. He plays the whataboutism game and refuses to take context into consideration. He makes allowances for Johnson's comments and choice of opponents, but takes Dempsey's out of context. It's a waste of time. By the way, this all began because I dared to criticize Mayweather years ago while he was arguing with a few posters on a Floyd/Manny thread where he went on for hundreds of pages and thousands of posts over the course of several years. Since then he has stalked me all over the forums hopelessly trying to prove me wrong and failing at every turn.

I don't have a personal beef with you. But when people disagree with you, you have a tendency to get prickly and take it personal. We all get ****** into heated arguments from time to time. We all get a little defensive and stubbornly hold our ground. If you are frustrated with a particular poster over a beef that has carried over from other forums, I understand the tone of your posts. I've engaged in arguments where I look back and think it would have been best to just disengage instead of taking the bait. We live and we learn.

You provide verified sources and I won't ignore or dismiss them. I have never had an alt, neither on here or any other forum.I've changed my user name on Classic once .I don't require anyone cheering me on.

I have Pollack's Vol 1 of Dempsey and will buy Vol2.
I also have both Vols of Johnson and his Jeffries and Fitzsimmons bios.
I take it personal when posters cannot back up their claims or are agenda driven arseholes like Z .The **** Z did on another forum is exactly what he is doing here,the difference is he is being allowed to get away with it here and he was banned for life for it on there.
As far as the posters here are concerned I think Queensbury Fool is a ******ed troll who contributes nothing. and Z is a 22 carat lying
arsehole.

I've no problem with anyone else There are some fine posters here, but most seem to be content to let somebody else make the posts and carry the load.
I'm getting a bit weary of that and,as I am on 3 sites,may take a back seat and watch how this forum evolves or alternatively doesn't.

At least you and I are managing to be civil to one another.