Mike Tyson vs Rocky Marciano

[Jim Jeffries]

As little as I like Tyson and as big of a fan of Marciano's as I am, if the fight happened today, it would most likely be stopped on cuts, or an accumulation of knockdowns, with Tyson winning by TKO prob around rd 7 or 8. But if Marciano fought today, he wouldn't even be a cruiserweight, and would be forced to fight light heavy, where I like his chances a lot better against an old Hopkins.

[Hawkins]

The think is, Douglas was a BUM, a 42-1 underdog, and Tyson was in his PRIME. And people that say he was past it at 30 when Holyfield stopped him, damn, is Mayweather PAST it too?

Correction, before the fight Holyfield was given little chance. He was over-the-hill and past his prime at 34. It was until after the fight that people said Tyson was done.

[RockyMarciano]

Danny Williams Knocked out Tyson......need I say more? Tyson fights a fighter with a smidgen of talent he cant win....we all know it just admit it!

[Hawkins]

Danny Williams Knocked out Tyson......need I say more? Tyson fights a fighter with a smidgen of talent he cant win....we all know it just admit it!

Well, I'm not Tyson defender. And I have been very critical of him, however, to use this analogy is completely baseless. Tyson was way past it, not motivated and just there for the payday.

I'd give Prime Tyson a good chance against any heavyweight within the first 4 rounds or so.

[them_apples]

Danny Williams Knocked out Tyson......need I say more? Tyson fights a fighter with a smidgen of talent he cant win....we all know it just admit it!

whats the logic behind this? That's like me saying Berbick Beat Ali so Ali must suck.

Mike Tyson didn't naturally "lose his prime" he could have fought longer and beat more opponent,s but the truth is, he didn't want to..his training regime was a joke, he fired his good trainer and partied a lot more. The stuff he says after his fights are so degrading to other fighter's such as "It's ludacris that these mortals attempt to even enter my realm" and stuff like that.

However, it's his fault that he was ******, thus making him around number 10 on people's ATG lists, if on it at all.

During his reign however, he was undeniably one of the the best boxers that ever stepped in the ring, and I would side with him in most heavy weight match ups for a winner.

[The Iron Man]

I think its unfair for Marciano to be put up against other heavys especially the greats. He wasnt a great fighter, it was his heart, and determination and his 49-0 record (in probably the worst era) that has him in the top 20 mayb 10 atg. He wouldnt beat any other of the atg. Sorry to say it, as i love watching his fights (wen i can) but thats just fact. These topics arent ment to put fighters down and i see it too mch against tyson so i just felt i should say this

[ROSS CALIFORNIA]

The think is, Douglas was a BUM, a 42-1 underdog, and Tyson was in his PRIME. And people that say he was past it at 30 when Holyfield stopped him, damn, is Mayweather PAST it too?

Tyson wasn't in his prime. For Tyson, being in or out of his prime had nothing to do with age like most fighters, it was frame of mind. Barrera (SP?) was 29 and out of his prime when he was stopped by Pac man. Many wars during his career was the cause not age.

[ROSS CALIFORNIA]

1. Spinks was a washed up light heavyweight.

No, he just looked washed up when matched up against Tyson. He would have looked a lot better at LH.

2. Spinks was quoted as saying "to tell you the truth, I'm not crazy about getting in the ring with that man."

No question he was scared.

3. Spinks was 212 lbs for the fight, heavier than he'd ever fought.

He didn't belong at heavyweight anyway but did better there than most could have.

4. Spinks' only fights at heavyweight were an aging Holmes, Steven Tangstaad (??????) and Gerry Cooney.

Good point.

5. Spinks doesn't try to box Tyson, doesn't try to evade him, doesn't really jab him, no lateral movement, and doesn't throw any bombs at him.

He threw his bombs, they just didn't land and weren't hard enough anyway. Look back at the fight.

6. Spinks was just in there to collect his huge paycheck and retire.

I honestly think he tried, he was just way in over his head. Anyway, that was a prime Tyson. That's when he looked his best. Ali looked at his best when he fought Williams who was passed his prime as well.

[Hawkins]

Tyson wasn't in his prime. For Tyson, being in or out of his prime had nothing to do with age like most fighters, it was frame of mind.

I don't think thats a fair estimation to make. If you go by that assumption you can make excuses for lots of guys who weren't in the right frame of mind when they were defeated.

I think the more appropriate definition of physical prime would be knowing what you need to do but aren't physically able to anymore. Take the Marciano/Charles II fight. There were times when you could clearly see that Ezz saw the openings, yet was unable to pull the trigger. Or he clearly saw the punches coming, yet was unable to avoid them.

Tyson on the other hand was very capable of doing what he had done but he was distracted and he severely underestimated Douglas to the point where he hardly trained.

I could maybe understand that argument if Tyson had been a vast majority of wars where the accumulation of punishment had contributed to advanced wear and tear. But the fact was thats not the case, up until that point he hadn't been in one single fight even close to that. So to say he wasn't in his prime becase he wasn't in the right frame of mind should not be used to explain his loss to Buster.

[ROSS CALIFORNIA]

I don't think thats a fair estimation to make. If you go by that assumption you can make excuses for lots of guys who weren't in the right frame of mind when they were defeated.

I think the more appropriate definition of physical prime would be knowing what you need to do but aren't physically able to anymore. Take the Marciano/Charles II fight. There were times when you could clearly see that Ezz saw the openings, yet was unable to pull the trigger. Or he clearly saw the punches coming, yet was unable to avoid them.

Tyson on the other hand was very capable of doing what he had done but he was distracted and he severely underestimated Douglas to the point where he hardly trained.

I could maybe understand that argument if Tyson had been a vast majority of wars where the accumulation of punishment had contributed to advanced wear and tear. But the fact was thats not the case, up until that point he hadn't been in one single fight even close to that. So to say he wasn't in his prime becase he wasn't in the right frame of mind should not be used to explain his loss to Buster.

Basically I agree with all of what you said besides what the word "prime" means to you. To me it's not when your physically at your best but when your at your best. lol Being in the wrong frame of mind or distracted for any reason is not what I consider being at your best. It can be for both reasons why someone is out of their prime, old or mentally not there. IMO I think most would agree that Tyson was at his best when he was with Keven Rooney.