could tyson have beat ali if tyson fought like he fought mitch green?

[Verstyle]

What are your examples of this? Sure he was hurt against Cooper in the first fight, but despite the circumstances i.e. torn glove etc, he still did very well to recover from Henry's Hammer and go on to stop him in the fifth round as he predicted.
Ali was most certainly hurt after his exile! The difference is his style had changed so it was more apparent how strong/weak his chin was because he was taking more punches than he did in the first stage of his career, and he was also facing a better level of competition IMO. Therefore, if it was more obvious in the first stage of his career that he was hurt, then how come a better level of opponent couldn't hurt him equally or more in the latter part of his career?
Ali would sometimes play act when he was hurt (especially against Frazier) aiming to give his opponent the impression that he wasn't hurt, but this sometimes made it more obvious that he was IMO.
The bottom line is that i don't think that it was more obvious that Ali was hurt in the first stage of his career. His style changed after his exile, not his 'chin!'

i dont care about the recovery part. he was obviously still dazed. but compared to when frazier knocked him down he got up like it wasnt ****. so all im saying is he covered it up well

[Verstyle]

Good post.

get off his nuts already.your cutting off circulation

[butterfly1964]

i dont care about the recovery part. he was obviously still dazed. but compared to when frazier knocked him down he got up like it wasnt ****. so all im saying is he covered it up well

That's because the punch wasn't that hard. Ali just went down because he was dead tired. He even admits that the punch Cooper hit him with that floored him was much harder than the punch that Frazier hit him with that floored him.

[Verstyle]

Let me explain something to people about this fight. Cus D'Amato had a word for fighters like Mike Tyson. It's a weasel. A weasel is the opposite of someone with character, someone who was mentally strong enough to persevere and win through adversity. Mike Tyson never had that.

Tyson's hands were fast, but Ali's were faster. Tyson, because he always came in with his feet in perfect position for a power shot, was slow of foot. He would be lost by the movement of Ali. Most fighters have only one direction they can elude from, either the left or the right. Ali was so good with his feet, you get the impression he could slip through the middle if he wanted to.

Do you think that Ali, who got inside the head of better fighters than Tyson, would have been quiet and given Tyson free reign to intimidate at the press conferences? Let me tell you something. Ali would've been on his ass worse than he was with Frazier at the press conferences, embarrassing him and making him look like an ignorant animal. Tyson would have been destroyed at the press con alone.

Tyson's worst tendency is to get frustrated. When things aren't going his way, he'll start to go crazy and winging one punch at a time. You DO NOT throw one shot at a time and expect not to get countered. For Thomas Hauser's bio of Ali, he asked 5 people close to Tyson, Bill Cayton, Teddy Atlas, Jose Torres, Floyd Patterson, and Kevin Rooney who would win if Tyson-Ali fought. EVERY ONE OF THEM picked Ali, with Torres and Atlas picking Tyson to quit.

The people who see Tyson and are like "No one can beat Tyson, Tyson is from the streets" live in a rap and hip hop fantasy world where being the champion of their block makes them the ****.

wait wait wait wait. u know i respect u as a poster and all but that bolded part with tyson being slow on his feet is straight up bull****! it takes alot of quickness to move like that especially weighing 217.i move like he did in his prime but i weigh 175 big difference and ppl still say thats fast for my weight.

and u know i've never said ne1 can beat tyson ahaha im not dumb.but i never saw that bio but i did see on some kind of thing with rooney when asked could tyson being ali and he stumbled.so in that i believe he thinks ali can beat him. but i have never eeeeeeeeeeever said that ali couldnt beat tyson.ever since i saw the tillis fight and the first round of the biggs fight i was convinced that it is possible and vise versa.but for some1 to say that tyson wouldnt have a chance against ali,needs to brush up on more studying

[butterfly1964]

wait wait wait wait. u know i respect u as a poster and all but that bolded part with tyson being slow on his feet is straight up bull****! it takes alot of quickness to move like that especially weighing 217.i move like he did in his prime but i weigh 175 big difference and ppl still say thats fast for my weight.

and u know i've never said ne1 can beat tyson ahaha im not dumb.but i never saw that bio but i did see on some kind of thing with rooney when asked could tyson being ali and he stumbled.so in that i believe he thinks ali can beat him. but i have never eeeeeeeeeeever said that ali couldnt beat tyson.ever since i saw the tillis fight and the first round of the biggs fight i was convinced that it is possible and vise versa.but for some1 to say that tyson wouldnt have a chance against ali,needs to brush up on more studying

Good post. Tyson definetely had great footspeed, and would have a good chance of beating him.

[Yogi]

Don't these numerous "Ali vs. Tyson" discussions get old for you guys after awhile?

[Verstyle]

Don't these numerous "Ali vs. Tyson" discussions get old for you guys after awhile?

yes it does.but this 1 was different i was just asking with that style he had how would he differ. no1 has done something like that before.the key word i was using was "could"

[Yogi]

yes it does.but this 1 was different i was just asking with that style he had how would he differ. no1 has done something like that before.the key word i was using was "could"

I would have thought that every and all fights from Ali & Tyson, when at or close to their respective bests, would be part of the equation, but...

*shrugs*

P.S. I'm glad you took my question as being an honest one, because that's what it was intended as.

[Mr. Ryan]

wait wait wait wait. u know i respect u as a poster and all but that bolded part with tyson being slow on his feet is straight up bull****! it takes alot of quickness to move like that especially weighing 217.i move like he did in his prime but i weigh 175 big difference and ppl still say thats fast for my weight.

and u know i've never said ne1 can beat tyson ahaha im not dumb.but i never saw that bio but i did see on some kind of thing with rooney when asked could tyson being ali and he stumbled.so in that i believe he thinks ali can beat him. but i have never eeeeeeeeeeever said that ali couldnt beat tyson.ever since i saw the tillis fight and the first round of the biggs fight i was convinced that it is possible and vise versa.but for some1 to say that tyson wouldnt have a chance against ali,needs to brush up on more studying

Tyson's feet were fast for a guy who is always in position to sit down on punches and whatnot, but he'd be lost against Ali. It was primarily Tyson's feet that left him in position to get caught coming in, he had good offensive footwork, but didn't recover the best when getting hit and getting back in position.

Also, Tyson was vulnerable to a jab that was timed properly. We saw this early with Biggs and at moments with Pinklon Thomas.

I don't think Tyson could beat Ali, plain and simple. The Tyson in his prime, maybe 1988-ish, was fighting mentally weak nobodies or guys who simply were over the hill. Truth is, Ali wasn't a guy you could intimidate. Ali fought guys like Foreman, Liston, and Frazier, guys as scary or perhaps even scarier.

Be real with me, if Tyson was getting played out at press cons and found out that not only wasn't Ali intimidated but that Ali thought he was a punk, would Tyson already have it in his mind to quit before the bell rang?

Tyson was a weasel in that he never learned how to face his fears or adversity. That's why he needs that big entourage, because they help mask up where he failed to overcome his greatest adversary, himself.

[Mr. Ryan]

Don't these numerous "Ali vs. Tyson" discussions get old for you guys after awhile?

This is the first one I am actively engaging in, I'm having a bit of fun myself.