Because he came up through the rankings as a middleweight ( JONES ). He beat Hopkins fair and square. Although he beat Toney at 168 I feel he would have beat him too at 160. This is the same Toney who got by another great, Mike McCallum.
01) Harry Greb
02) Sugar Ray Robinson
03) Carlos Monzon
04) Ezzard Charles
05) Marvin Hagler
06) Jake LaMotta
07) Bob Fitzsimmons
08) Charley Burley
09) Gene Fullmer
10) Stanley Ketchel
11) Mickey Walker
12) Emile Griffith
13) Sugar Ray Leonard
14) Roy Jones Jr.
15) Tony Zale
16) Dick Tiger
17) Joey Giardello
18) Marcel Cerdan
19) James Toney
20) Mike McCallum
I did not include Bernard Hopkins. Although I have the utmost respect for
Bernard and his long reign, I do not feel that he was strongly tested during
his tenure as champion.Granted this was not his fault and granted he was the
BEST of his time. I honestly feel the 20 I have listed would have beat
Bernard.
Hey it's IMO just like you have your own. It's no different then could Ali have beaten Joe Louis ? Or could Bob Foster beaten Archie Moore ? We'll never really know.
It's interesting to talk and debate about but there will never be a clear winner. Maybe that makes us both retarded.
Hey...Who's retarded ??? You're talking about some of the greatest middleweights of all time. Surar Ray Leonard and Tommy Hearns would have beat Hopkins. Good God I hate to think what Monzon would have done to him.
MANFREDO MANHANDLES SPINA Oct 15, '06 12:25 AM
MANFREDO MANHANDLES SPINA Oct 15, '06 12:25 AM
by Jim for everyone
neverlast
It wasn't even close... The cream rises to the top...Peter Manfredo Jr. took apart the bigger but less skilled Joey Spina. The bout was stopped in the third round after a game but outclassed Spina got up from a knockdown but took a vicious right hand that prompted the towel to come in from his corner. A wise stoppage. Poor Joey was in way over his head.
With Joe Calzaghe winning tonight and also Mikkel Kessler's impressive KO of Markus Beyer...Well a big opportunity is knocking. How good is Manfredo ? That remains to be seen but he sure is marketable. There is even talk of Manfredo - Roy Jones Jr. Hey, why not ? Manfredo is streaking and Jones is hanging on. It's a fight that would draw a lot of fan interest. Hell, my cheap ass might even pay for that one.
Gomez was the GREATEST 122 pounder !
In there best weight class, Gomez was Numero Uno. NOBODY beat him at 122 and he turned back the challenges of terrific fighters like Carlos Zarate and Lupe Pintor. He was a superb boxer with outstanding balance and brutal power.
Rosario was good and hard hiiter but he was beatable. Trinidad was great but I still think Oscar beat him. There's a few names that should be metioned like Carlos Ortiz, Esteban DeJesus, Alfredo Escalera, Wilfred Benitez, Jose Torres and that's just in my time. There are more before my day.
I have to cast my final vote for Gomez who was and always will be the "KING" of the 122 lb. class !
Puerto Rico has produced some great fighters. So who is the Ultimate Puerto Rican fighter?
Is it Wilfredo Gomez who dominated the 122lb division against greats from Mexico big names that include:
Carlos Zarate, Guadlupe Pintor
Or is it Edwin Rosario who at young age, Defeated tough Mexican veteran Jose Luiz Ramirez in their first bout, beat a young Frankie Randall. He also after suffering a devastatin TKO loss against JLR in the rematch, arguably defeated and changed a Prime Hector Camacho into a runner?
Or is it Felix Trinidad
Who gave Yori Boy, and fernando Vargas their first official and real loss and first person to KO william Joppy?
Dwight+Vander !!!
The first fight between defending champion Dwight Qawi and challenger Evander Holyfield. That was back when they were REAL fights that were scheduled for 15 rounds. It was a brutal affair. Qawi deserved to be inducted into the Hall Of Fame. His only setbacks during his championship prime were to all time greats Michael Spinks at 175 and Holyfield at cruiser.
Toney-Jirov was a great fight but to me a distant second to Qawi-Holyfield I.
To me the biggest upset in a cruiserweight title fight was when S.T.Gordon bombed out a shell shocked defending champion Carlos DeLeon in two rounds. It was a massacre. When they met again a more on the ball DeLeon handled Gordon easily.
DeLeon is one of top five cruiserweights since the division was created.
Hearns-Duran !!!
Roberto Duran WAS my idol. When he whipped Leonard in Montreal, well... That goes right up there in the important date column with the birth of my kids and March 8, 1971 when Joe whipped Ali's ass.
With that said, you can fully understand my disappointment when Roberto said "No Mas" during Leonard-Duran II. Still there was this feeling that it wasn't a complete victory for Leonard. Who knows what was going on in Roberto's head when he uttered those now famous words ? It left the door open for a rubber match that would take place years later.
It was so different when Hearns nearly tore Roberto's head off. Up to this fight only the great Esteban DeJesus had put Duran on floor. Tommy CREAMED him. It was unbelieveable. To see Roberto flat on his stomach at the feet of the towering Hearns was humbling to Roberto and his fans. Roberto had just gone fifteen tough rounds with Marvin Hagler. Who would have thought that Roberto would be so easily dispatched. They didn't call Thomas Hearns the "Hit Man" for nothing.
I don't recall Roberto ever pushing hard for a return match with Tommy !
Post Hearns Duran...
Everlast, what you wrote is what I felt. The "No mas" and the destruction at the hands of Thomas Hearns were hard to take and understand. Those loses were devastating for a Duran fan.
However, those two terrible Duran loses did make the stunning victories over Moore and Barkley two of the most memorable sports nights in my life. Without the bad ("No mas" and Hearns) we wouldn't appreciate the spectacular (Moore and Barkley) as much.
Hey No Mas,
I agree. The Barkley fight is one of my all time favorites. Nobody gave Roberto a chance in that one. I thought Roberto beat Paz the first time around. Duran looked very lethargic in the return match. I just re-watched Duran-Camacho I the other night. NO WAY Roberto lost that fight !!! That to me was probably the last time Roberto looked good in the ring.
McCallum would have been a very tough fight for Marv but I see Hagler coming out on top. Mc Callum in my eyes was an all time top 20. Very under rated. He was not flashy but he was a very complete fighter.
Hagler would have had trouble early with a prime Michael Nunn. I just see Marvin doing what he did best...Outwilling and outfighting his foe.
A prime James Toney at 160 was an all time great. His style would have been very difficult for Marvin. On the other hand Marvin's ability to switch from right handed to southpaw so smoothly would have caused James some problems.
Based on style differences and work rate, I'd have to go with Marvin.