Anyone else feel like Jeffery’s head got huge after the Pacquiao gift. Manny trained in that gym Hell even Floyd trained in there when he was with top rank. I can’t wait for bud to finish off this paper champ I also can’t wait to hear from his promoter and trainer after all the **** talking they’ve been doing.
Everyone knows why Floyd retired. The whole my body was breaking down excuse was bs and I love how floyd fans can use medical excuses but anyone else does it they are full of crap.
Fact is the welterweight division Was hot and all those guys beat each other. When mayweather fans talk about his undefeated record it’s the only damn thing they cling too because his overall record after the hatton fight were carefully picked money fights. Who first talked about A side and B side Floyd did because unless he had full control over the situation he wouldn’t fight. Against maidana he complained about his gloves to get into maidanas head.. there was nothing wrong with the gloves but to Floyd he wanted him in grant pillows. With manny he wanted random blood testing but it had to be his own handpicked drug testing company usada that he pays way more then what vada asks for and vada actually catches cheaters. When manny agreed to everything floyd cried about 50/50 this was in 2012 and hbo has him on tape saying “50/50 you don’t want a fight then” he wanted to send manny 20 before and 20 after the fight with no ppv of course manny will say no to that bs.
But he’s tbe flashing his money his hoes his jets all you guys get pulled into that gloss but in reality pretty boy Floyd was a fighter money mayweather was an opportunist who knew how to work the system let all the other guys beat themselves up and we all bought into the gloss.
Now he’s fighting exhibitions against guys that are way smaller then him jeez.
Roach trains both
I know but TMTFOREVER put me on an ignore list so I couldn't tell him off for supporting a cotto mayweather 2 fight instead of fighting manny so screw him and screw Floyd for not giving the fans what the truly want.
It will be a Hispanic fighter most likely cotto or canelo. It won't be Garcia because if the fight with manny isn't made I think Garcia and manny fight in April
There are two sides to this. The OP has a point in that a lot of fans, especially Floyd fans, seem to live vicariously through him. And to make it even worse, and more dangerous, they live in denial.
So it's like every thing that Floyd does, they think they do!
But for healthy, normal fans, it is good to know the PPV buys so we can have legitimate discussions when debating negotiations, and discussing the cultural, social significance of boxers - to give us a look at boxing outside of the hardcore realm.
I've said once and I'll say it again you put manny on cinco de mayo or Mexican independence day he will hit 1million buys. Floyd having his fights on Mexican holidays and fighting Latin fighters on those holidays obviously he will crack high PPV numbers. Case in point at mannys peak he wouldn't fight on holidays and would crack close to a million buys.
Oh and tmtforever sucks how you can't make every thread and block everyone who has a different opinion then you right. You just like Floyd except he hides behind excuses and al haymon while you hide behind the ignore button.
The numbers (PPV, gate, TV, etc) are important because they offer a cogent frame for the larger value discussion; Pacquiao walked away from $40m, arguing that the offer was too low, and Top Rank seems to have walked away from $40m +35% of the upside. If those offers were "lowball", it would make sense to try and compare the type of business that they're doing currently. logical enough, i'd imagine.
The Venetian didn't pay $20m to host Manny Pacquiao in Macau; doubt that the number was even $10m.
Still, for the sake of argument, let's assume that Top Rank did get $10m. $10m to go, so the PPV would need to generate ~$25m, to cover just Pacquiao's guarantee.
$70 a pop and you're looking at roughly 350,000 buys to just break even.
event sponsors and TV rights fees bring that assumed number down a bit, but you're still looking at at least 300k buys to cover costs.
The last Macau number that Arum went to the media with, take that for what it is, was 400k buys.
If Pacquiao events are just breaking even for Top Rank, what grounds are there for Top Rank to "turn their nose up" at $40m +35% of the upside?
Where did you pull that load of crap about manny walking away from 40 million with a 35% upside? Was it that fight hype interview with ariza? Manny doesn't have to pay us taxes which right there could increase mannys take. PPV gate all that stuff is made a big deal in negotiations so someone like FLOYD can boast about being the A side and him getting to control everything to feed his ego.
http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-boxing-manny-pacquiao-20141119-story.html There's the article about how top rank gets more out of site fees.
Anyone with a brain knew that the 32 mil flat guarantee for floyd for any fight would cause cbs/showtime to lose money.. Whatever executive signed off on that deal should be fired if he hadn't already..
For 32 mil a fighter needs to do huge PPv numbers something in the neighborhood of 1.2 mil buys,,, there isn't a fighter alive that could consistently do those numbers without another big name opponent sharing the card,,,
Give floyd- manny, canelo, Oscar, cotto, mosely and yeah he will justify the 32 mil guarantee... But if it's a fight with a lesser known fighter like Maidana, ghost, Ortiz, etc no matter how competive the matchup, it won't draw the money needed to cover Floyd's 32 mil..
It's not Floyd's fault as he is took a deal he couldn't refuse,, the showtime executive that signed off on the deal should be fired...l
It was a no brainer when they signed him that they had the canelo and a manny fight as the only big draws left as floyd had already fought shane, cotto, Oscar on hbo....
You can't blame floyd, only showtime for making a stupid deal
I said it in another thread the 3 headed monster of (haymon,schafer,mayweather) thought that they could run boxing and showtime who's new president at the time that deal was made was Golden Boy's old lawyer so cmon it was obvious what they were trying to do. Consolidate everything to one network give floyd that huge deal and have him be the face like oscar was the face for hbo at his peak but guess what happened Oscar figured out what was going on and gave richie the boot and even though floyd saved grace with showtime with the canelo fight after the crappy numbers he got with his debut fight he still hasnt lived up to his end of the contract and now that golden boy is under oscar Haymon and Floyd are on their own and stephen espinoza president of showtime cant say **** because Moonves is working on getting the pac deal done himself to get his money back.
Its pretty simple FLoyd ego and his line of bull **** that he "runs boxing" blew up in his face.
how come this right here hasn't sunk in yet..how do you walk away from 50/50 split..it means he was on the juice and got called out on it...
How is it that it can't sink in that it was 5 years ago and your hero won't man up put his name on a contract and fight him.
They Rehydrated Oscar through IV's before the fight thinking that it was the best course to take. Oscar to Me and a lot of fighters looked good at the weigh in he looked strong during his training camp. But come fight night going against that speed and power made him look old and dead. Hell Brandon Rios looked exactly the same in his fight with Manny.
What's the point of this thread? Did anybody really think Pacquiao in Algeiri live from China was going to do big numbers? This was expected....only Floyd fans were consumed with PPV numbers running with the excuse of "Pac does not sell more PPV's then Floyd" as another excuse for not making the fight.
Floyd fans think pay per view is the end all be all for a fight that generates revenue. Arum gets money from the site fee which ventian probably paid enough to offset the pay per view loss. So he could pay manny 20mil. If manny fought a Latin fighter on cinco de mayo and Mexican independence day he would have a million pay per view buys each time because his style is more entertaining to watch then Floyds.
Okay let me put this out there first, I love slick boxers, I think their are several boxers from the seventies who did it well without taking away from the game.
Any boxer has to make a choice stylistically between speed and power and lately the slick technical boxers in the scene have chosen to rely on speed exclusively to win matches. Running behind the jab and relying on decisions. They don't even seem preoccupied with hurting their opponents at all.
In the bygone, more exciting ages of boxing people cared more about knocking out their opponents about really beating them and not just winning a "game". It used to be the technical guys still scored a hell of a lot more knockouts even if they weren't power punchers.
I guess this is kind of a rant and I'm sorry but I feel like this is killing the soul of boxing. I enjoy a good technical schooling as much as the next guy hell I appreciate it but if you never commit because your scared of getting caught then your just scared.
Casual Fight fans who dont know much about the sport get turned off from slick boxers. Which is why Floyd promotes himself as the undefeated obnoxious money hungry guy that people want to see lose because casual fans dont want to see him fight they want to see him lose in contrast to Manny Pacquiao who likes to throw a lot of punches and put on a show and doesnt need to promote himself because people already know what to expect they have seen the knockouts. Casual fans are influenced by movies like Rocky they want to see action. Hardcore fight fans can appreciate both the brawlers and the slicksters and can know the difference between the two. For every slickster there is a brawler and people will tune in to watch because they know if the brawler has his chance he'll take the slickster out.
Spence is a southpaw, GGG is orthodox, they hurt different eyes man.
Just stop
You should stop.... trying to save this crap thread.... I guess spence is the new Floyd so hectari got the lube ready to start riding.
the only thing that is proven is your jealousy of mayweather
I'm not jealous of mayweather but I can see that you are quick to accuse people of being jealous. Tell me has floyd ever given you anything? What has floyd done except paint a stupid picture of what it means to have money woman and live a life that he believes money can buy anything except reading skills and honesty. Because all those hoodrats and leaches will all be gone when his well dries up and while manny may have his faults I would rather be jealous of him seeing that he is admired by a country and has done more for it then flash his money and get with *****es
Funny thing is David Haye would decapitate Kneeguel Quitto in one round and you know it, so you have nothing to laugh about.
Hahahahaha yea i do have something to laugh about you just said a heavyweight that got destroyed by wlad and made a crap load of excuses before and after the fight should destroy a middleweight like cotto REALLY YA THINK. Just stop and retire like haye did and say you have a cramp in your hand so you have an excuse not to respond.
You are the tard, you don't call some one the lineal middleweight champion of the world when he fought for said championship at a catchweight. GTFO of here.
Still crying
Oh that's what happened. Don't forget that against Morales his socks were too tight. And that against Marquez he saw Mitt Romney in the audience, tried to wave and never saw the right hand. Sure.
It's guys like you that make this forum crap sometimes because instead of stating facts you prefer sarcasm
I'm wondering when Pacquiao became this mauler type of the kind of fight Maidana did. Did I miss something? Or is it simply because Mayweather looked vulnerable that now people are going to change their minds and declare Pacquiao the obvious winner of this fantasy matchup. Well then what about the vulnerability Pacquiao showed against Torrecamp? Hussein? Morales? Marquez? Exactly.
Have you ever looked back and read the history of those first 2 losses. How manny was really raw and young and in his second loss had to wear bigger gloves for not making weight. Morales he avenged that loss twice and Marquez had 4 chances and like he said on 24/7 "FINALLY!!" Took him for tries to finally beat manny after getting his ass laid out 3 times in the first fight once in the second and when he starts building all this muscle he "FINALLY" knocks out manny.
Ive said it once ill say it again its a 50/50 fight Floyd hasnt fought a fast speedy southpaw since zab judah If manny gets floyd on the ropes who knows what could happen. Hell floyd could counter and move all night but guess what manny will still be there throwing combinations.
my god i would mess that little wannabe ganster wannabe tough guys ass up. He is exactly what is wrong with society these days. Gets away with anything and everything and in an actual fight would have his body guards take care of it.
I had Floyd Winning 8-4, scoring aside everyone on this board can agree this was the hardest fight Floyd has had in years. Maidana kept coming after him legal shots or illegal he touched floyd and hit him more then any fighter has ever hit him period end of story.
Golden boy is not the damn problem AL freaking Haymon is the problem. His alliance with mayweather and schafer is making it hard for great fights to take place. Haymon is not a manager he is a promotor he hides in the background sending his minons the watsons to do is dirty work. A majority of the fighters signed to Haymon are not even golden boy fighters so its so obvious what they are trying to do and that is control the sport of boxing. Oscar see this and Oscar knows that his contribution to the sport that he loves and his legacy is golden boy promotions. He sees how close the 3 of those guys are and he knows the only way to get his company back and give balance to the sport is to co promote with bob arum's top rank, Don King and main events. When Mayweather retires I can totally see Richard running mayweather promotions which by the way isnt a real damn company. I honest to god feel like mayweather promotions is al haymon promotions that uses golden boy resources to put on shows to avoid tax issues for haymon and mayweather.
Im a fan of both guys i love mayweathers defense and skill and i love mannys power and just overall style of fighting. That being said. IF the two were to ever meet seeing how floyd acted with the gloves manny wouldnt be wearing reyes like he usually does and if he complains floyd would probably pull out the fight to just get his way.
This version of Manny Pacquiao is a smarter Boxer then 3 years ago. He is a veteran of so many wars and different styles that many people on this board forget how smart and skilled a boxer he is and only focus on the BS (drug testing,peds). IF they got in the ring manny would swarm floyd for the first 5 rounds landing 4 punches to floyds 1 or 2 counter shots. If you watch Maidana he pressured floyd on the ropes and i see manny doing the same (pac bradley 2 round 7). Manny is a good counter puncher as well and the shoulder roll is not as effective against a southpaw so manny would do damage in the first 5 rounds.
Depending on those first 5 rounds if manny was to hit the body and make floyd fight that will determine the next 7 rounds floyd will try to adapt and manny will continue to move. Its a 50/50 fight the best offensive fighter vs the best defensive fighter i can see floyd hitting pot shots and running but i can also see manny bringing it to him so its so hard to pick a winner.
Dude you don't get it. I think that Floyd chose not to fight Pac because he calculated the risk of loss as too high to warrant it. That doesn't mean he was correct in his calculus. Floyd was never in any danger. He calculated poorly.
Btw, anybody that calls a professional fighter a coward is the worst kind of keyboard warrior. Pacquiao would without doubt disown you as a fan were you sufficiently notable for him to realize that you exist because he is a real warrior. Not a keyboard one. You bring shame to your idol with your quasi religious zeal.
Now log off and go and think about what I told you.
Anyone who gets in that ring is far from a coward. Mayweather is a business man and being a business man the one thing that separates him and everyone else is his "0" that is his marketing the TBE stuff everything is based off that "0" Manny Pacquiao is beloved by boxing fans casual and non casual because he goes in there humble and puts on a show and fights. Mayweather knows that his style is not marketable to the casual fan so he has to play the villain be flashy and sell himself as the villain you pay to see him potentially lose.
If they ever do fight it will be a crazy event and a 50/50 fight. If Mayweather loses he loses his marketability his "0" if manny loses he goes back to being a congressman. Floyd has more to lose which is why he doesnt want to risk it.
I would pay money for the glove selection process alone if Floyd and Manny ever fought. It would be war in that room Roach would go crazy and mayweather's boys would cry foul on everything. Ive worn Grant,everlast and reyes. There is a reason why Floyd picks grant everyone knows this, Grant gloves are cushioned like crazy and protect the hand so much but the result is a lack of power. Everlast gloves depending on what type are the same thing but how much does anyone want to bet that these were the same type of gloves he used against Broner and floyd got shook. Reyes gloves everyone knows that they are punchers gloves and i have 2 pairs of those.
floyd's bs excuse before the fight was that he was going to go toe to toe with maidana so he already had his bs excuse loaded in all his fans minds that he was going to fight and people would defend him like always. Chino did work on his body and Floyd took advantage when they were in the middle of the ring but even then he couldnt land his lead right hand consistently maidana's rhythm was throwing him off and i wouldnt be surprised if Floyd was dying on the inside from the body shots.
To anyone who says that Manny Would get killed by Floyd remember this, Floyd has issues with southpaws because the shoulder roll isnt as affective against lefties and with manny's speed and angles he would pressure floyd on movement alone. Floyds last 5 opponents never pressured Floyd this much except for cotto. Manny would hit floyd from so many angles but even then i would give credit to floyd who would counter a lot of mannys shots but one counter puncher to manny throwing a dozen punches and landing 3 or 4 is still better then landing 1.
gloves to a fighter is like his weapons of war when you have been use to fighting or training in a certain pair of gloves then you will be pissed if they make you change them.
Different when One company ex ceo says they wont ever work with the other company and takes all business to another network all together. No one will ever call bob arum a saint but before schafer and haymon got so buddy buddy golden boy at least talked about making fights together.
It's unfortunate what's happened to them because for so long they were the boxing network for real boxing fans. They catered to the hardcore following and they made the absolute best fights possible back when HBO had no real interest in doing anything other than showcasing 'stars' (or guys they were overpaying, ramming down our throats and attempting to convince us that they were stars.)
The one positive thing to come out of this is that odious, stumpy little prick, Stephen Espinoza, is sent packing. That gutless, creepy-looking f*ck is responsible for the current mess they're in.
That ****y little prick would talk down to fans on his Twitter and before today was saying "BIG THINGS COMING" for shobox lol he was talking so much trash when haymon and Schafer were working with him now he's just a washed up whore. Haymon had his fun now on to his new girl haha.