Well, all in good sport, it's nice to actually see some die-hard boxing fans. lol. Anyways, we can argue all and all... so he didnt face Morales which makes one less person on his resume. HE LOST TO CHRIS JOHN!!! Cause I can say Pacquiao won both fights but the judges say one... that first fight was even after the first round... for anyone to give JMM so many rounds after the first round for him to end up 115-110 on a scorecard is ridiculous! That fight was close, but those 3 knockdowns should have gave the edge to Pacquiao. but Marquez lost to CHRIS JOHN!!! and I don't care what anyone says, I thought it was wrong to give John the UD with such a blowout, but I still thought it was a close enough fight in which either fighter could have got the win... so where should Chris John's name be on the P4P rankings??? and De La Hoya was naturally the bigger guy... he has fought at 160, and bigger also means height-wise. He had 5 inches on PacMan which made him BIGGER. And Ricky Hatton was still considered to be champ at 140 so he was still in his prime... I honestly never thought he had to much credibility to begin with other than Kosta Tszyu and he's been livin off that win ever since. but again, it's nice to see some die hard fans... we got our opinions and I aint tryin to persuade anyone. but fa real tho, name some quality wins Marquez has under his belt... explain to me why he is better than Pacquiao.
Paul Williams doesnt have a big fanbase which means not enough money coming in from the fight. PBF is about money not securing his name in the sport. I love both boxers to death but in the end, I dont even think the right amount of money will make PBF wanna fight Paul Williams... that would be smart on his behalf. I don't think anyone at 147 has the guts to do it... maybe Shane Mosley, but I don't think its a big enough fight for him either. Paul Williams needs to fight some more big names so he can build a better fanbase. I think he's one of the top 5 fighters today.
what was is inactivity due to. his stubborness to fight fighters for lesser money at a point in which he had done enough of.
I thought ur list was based on the fighters that DON'T fight for the money Mr. "GURU"???
Shane doesn't warrant a spot over Marquez IMO. And Shane is a HOFer but he's not in his prime anymore. Margarito's style is tailor-made for him. Yes he did give Cotto a very good fight tho...
What makes you say he isn't in his prime anymore??? He still has fast hands and we witnessed he still has power against Mayorga and Margarito. What big wins does Marquez have that can overthrow what Mosley has recently been able to do and what he has done in the past. I mean, I can agree he's not in his absolute prime, but you make it sound like he pulled a modern-Roy Jones or post-jail Mike Tyson on his own career. He's not too far past his prime and he is still making a lot of noise between 147-154. Not tryin to knock ur opinion or anything... I respect it.
Flippin your retired because you use money as a reason for bhop to duck dawson and you dont know the story why Vic and Donaire havent gotten it on again. sit back and watch a pro.
B-Hop backed out on a fight with Adamek after being greedy and only offering a flat $500K for a fight with no incentives... and he's not about money??? If he really wanted the challenge, he would have at least tried to negotiate a better deal. And why call out a no name like Carl Froch at 168 when he can call out a better name in Chad Dawson at the weight class he's already fighting in??? answer that for him... you seem to know everything.
And by the situation with Darch-Donaire, u mean the one that involves Gary Shaw and how he won't let Donaire fight Darchinyan because he's not "loyal". Donaire was supposed to get 3 fights a year and it took him to get a fight cancelled last April, jump ship and sue Shaw for breach of contract to finally get one fight last year in November. All a promoter does is set up fights and throws a contract in the fighter's face. If Darchinyan really wanted that rematch as much as he claims he wants it, then all he has to do is quit signing on the line for all these other fights... plain and simple.
but you seem to be the BOXING GURU, so how bout you tell me why B-Hop wont fight Dawson and Vic won't rematch with Nonito. Cause if that list is based on fighters that dont care for money and don't duck other fighters, then that sh*t is BOGUS as F*CK!!!
Your opinion is pretty much obsolete homie...
Yes I am new so I'm not sure how to do the quote thing. But paul williams had a very off nite against Quintana but came back and KO'd him 3 months later. I believe Paul Williams power is unerrated. Pavlik has fought a bunch of nobodies until he fought Taylor which I would agree was a notable significant win for him. A victory over glass-jaw Miranda isn't nothin great. And he went up against a vet like Hopkins and got straight schooled. Paul Williams fought Winky Wright who is basically the same type of fighter as Hopkins and beat him decisively. We can argue about the lay off times and whatnot but I'd rather not. Anyways, point I'm tryin to make is that it would be an interesting fight. I don't think Pavlik-Abraham would be better money-wise because no one knows Abraham. He's a decent fighter but I wanna see him fight some better competition before I can say he's really good.
we have same scorecard i think
Round 1: Pac
Round 2: JMM
Round 3: Pac(10-8)
Round 4: Pac
Round 5: JMM
Round 6: JMM
Round 7: Pac
Round 8: JMM
Round 9: Pac
Round 10: Pac
Round 11: JMM
Round 12: JMM
THANK YOU FOR POINTING THIS OUT!!! Both fights were close but the knockdowns made the difference in both fights. And because of the 3 knockdowns, the first fight shouldn't been as close as it was on the scorecards cause there is no way Marquez won every round after the first.
JMM was catching him with solid combo everytime Diaz came in. Once Diaz got cut I knew the fight was over, he doesn't take cuts well. In no way the KO was because of the cut, JMM was working on it the whole fight.
Marquez didn't hurt him with any combinations until he cut him in the 8th, and like you said Diaz doesn't take cuts well. Just ask Nate Campbell. lol. I never saw Diaz looking hurt in the fight until he got busted open.
I think Dawson should fight Roy Jones Jr. The names at the top of the LHW division that actually carry weight are all the old timers (B-Hop, Johnson, Tarver, RJJ... ) He should just continue down the line and fight Jr.cause he's unlikely to land a fight the Hopkins... So why not fight another future HOF??? See if he's good enough to beat a past-his-prime-but-still-an-ok-boxer RJJ. Lol
Shane is good. He's an exciting and dynamic fighter who has won linear titles in three different weight classes, but when you put a jab in his face he turns pretty ordinary really quick. If you want to put him at #2 P4P go ahead. I just don't see it.
I'll agree on the jab thing. haha. but I'm just sayin, compare his resume to those ahead of him in the top 5. The only argument I could agree with is Hopkins being ahead of him. I feel everyone else at the top of the rankings have not faced the level of competition Mosley has faced and as many times as he has... other than Pac and B-Hop. And Mosley is still a beast out there.
I probably not the last 10 rounds, but at least 8 for the rest rounds.. By the way, the formula you are saying will beat marquez, is not a recommended formula.. Diaz got knocked beacuse he thought markez wasnt strong to do hurt him.. Boxers who do that kind of fight, are at risk of getting ko.. Just watch what happend to Margarito..
Tru. I can agree, but you cant say it didn't work up until Diaz got cut. Throw a vet in their instead of a young fighter like Diaz... a fighter that didn't leave himself open as much as Diaz did... then Marquez could have easily lost that fight. but it never happened like that and I never thought Diaz was that good to begin with. lol
Cuz he's a cheater, cuz he has a basketball head, cuz he almost lost to a shot, fat Mayorga, cuz he lost to Cotto.
Cuz he's not good enough to be p4p #2. Thats Manny's spot.
He's lucky Tony didnt take the fight seriously and had to drop to much weight.
When Tony comes back its gonna be Mosleys ass.
If Manny is #2, suprise me with who ur #1 is.
And Tony as in... Antonio Margarito??? Antonio "Plaster Man" Margarito???
I believe you said "cheater" about Mosley... lol.
flippin money that disclaimer isnt accurate. do some research. thank you and come again please.
What's not accurate??? Would you like to specify exactly which part isn't accurate??? cause I'll be glad to make an argument...
b-hop is ducking him to not be exposed that is my claim. thanks for proving that because if not then you tell me why?
that is exactly what Vic would have to do but wait there are laws so if he wanted to get away from Shaw Im sure that contract would have to expire. He sold himself to the devil. This is why Shaw doesnt want it because Vic would have everyright to that status and he wont start ducking for $, n Shaw knows it.
"B-Hop is ducking him..."
if you say that, why is he on ur list??? That's the point I''m tryin to make.
Promotional contracts don't specify who a fighter has to fight... he's signed under Gary Shaw for a certain number of fights and I highly doubt it says in the "legal" contract that "YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO FIGHT NONITO DONAIRE AGAIN IF YOU LOSE TO HIM AND I DON'T PROMOTE HIM ANYMORE"... I'm pretty sure in the end, it's the fighter's decision whether or not to sign on for a fight... Shaw didn't put a gun to his head and tell him to sign the line to fight in all these post-Donaire fights. In conclusion, he's duckin him...
Ur now making reasons for why someone is ducking another fighter, when the list supposedly consists of those that don't duck people.
look... nothin personal, I agree with some of your list and I respect people's opinions. I just don't agree with how u made your rankings of "people who dont care for money and dont duck other people". It's boxing... that's what a lot of boxers do mainly because of the business side of boxing.
With that being said here is the P4P based on truth not $:
2.Juan Manuel Marquez- besides aforementioned, he also doesn't own a duck. A win over Mayweather puts him above Paul.
4.Vic Darchinyan- after only lost by ko to Donaire, he has made adjustments and become a complete terror for any style he has faced since. Also happens to be calling for Manny Pacqauio. NO DUCKS! PLUS HAS ILL INTENTIONS EVERY TIME STEPS IN RING.
5.Winky Wright- Its hard to throw him too far down on the list after only really being beaten by the guy who's #1. He is tough to beat for everybody in 154-160 except..plus he ducked at a time when he was on top not en route to.
7.Bernard Hopkins- He was up there but due to him ducking Wright at 160 but fighting him a year later at 170lbs. He doesnt go beyond Wright on this list. Has done this for all of his so called career defining wins.
9.Manny Pacquaio- He continues to surprise us all with his power, but has yet to show an ability to win against defensive fighter. The first fight with JMM when despite being down 3 times in the first round he was able to fight to a draw.
10.Miguel Cotto- The next Shane Mosley in terms of going on a streak. He is tough as nails and indeed will continue where he left off with Mosley. So what he lost to the plaster master.
barely missed- Andre Berto- Limited competition but speed, agility, moderate power. If Mayweather is the 93 in fuel he is the 89.
most honorable mention-Roy Jones Jr. was the last to be recognized as such without controversy. He began to lose because he kept on trying to do the unthinkable. And that is how you earn your claim to being great. Needs to retire, everyone with this attitude ends up showing the signs. Ali, Holyfield, so in this sense Tyson was smarter than the rest.
Joe Calzaghe doesn't go, only has a win against Lacy as reason. Roy is now a shell of himself, come to think of it its funny he was knocked down by this guy. Did he interpret his gift against Hopkins as a sign to retire. Lets see I guess there is reason why all of his options had he stayed are listed ontop of him on this list. He can't beat any of them.
2. JMM's wins against Casamayor and Diaz are not big. Casamayor's big win was against Diego Corrales, Diaz has no big wins and he lost to Nate Campbell 2 fights before the Marquez fight. Marquez never fought Morales, he didn't fight Barrera until after Pacquiao TKO'd him in their first fight. SOMEONE PLZ GIVE ME A WIN HE HAS THAT IS SIGNIFICANT!!!
4. Darchinyan is ducking Nonito Donaire and keeps trying to move up in weight. Donaire dominated him and now he's scared.
5. Winky Wright is f*cking greedy for money himself... the reason he took such a long layoff is because he couldn't get anyone to pay him the money he wanted for a fight. HE wouldn't fight Kelly Pavlik because the money wasn't good. NO ONE WANTS TO SEE HIM FIGHT!!!
7. B-Hop is ducking Chad Dawson now... He says Dawson has no fanbase and won't make money in a fight with him... NEWSFLASH!!! NO ONE KNOWS WHO CARL FROCH IS!!! He won't sell either, so fight the better fighter in Chad Dawson.
9. I don't see how Pacquiao gets no credit for what he has done in his career. I can't even start to argue about this one...
10. Miguel Cotto??? I never saw a Cotto-Paul Williams fight... everybody in the 147 division has ducked him... whether money is the factor or not. Nobody wants to fight Paul Williams because he's a dangerous fighter.
Andre Berto??? He lost to Collazo and is ducking him for a rematch...
and this list is based on fighters that don't duck other fighters???
He did it for 10 rounds 2 times
why wouldnt he do it for 12 rounds this time?
So you seriously think Marquez convincingly won the last 10 rounds in both fights easily??? If anything, I could see them splitting those rounds... fact still being PacMan knocked Marquez down 3 times in the first fight and once in the 2nd. You make it sound like Pacquiao went to sleep after the 2nd rounds and never threw any punches again. Both fights were great fights for a reason, and that's because they both fought to the finish. I'm obviously a Pacquiao fan and I won't even say he won all the rounds because I actually watched the fights!
And if you wanna talk about formulas, the formula to beat Marquez is to pressure him on the ropes like Diaz did and keep doing it. As soon as Diaz got cut, he turned into a punk and stopped fighting... Diaz was just soft. Marquez didn't turn that fight around until Diaz saw that blood.
JMM is #1. And Plaster man doesnt apply. No proof Tony ever cheated against anyone.
Ok, so they suspended his US license for no reason??? kinda sketchy for the Americans to do that because Margarito was just climbing up the ladder to the top, right?
Hey can someone tell me where to find hand wraps that "naturally" hardens???
Antonio "Plaster Man" Margarito
37-5 when assumed cheating
0-1 when fighting fair
The U.S is a sketchy place...this is the same country that killed JFK, and did 9/11. You think their gonna blink at suspending a boxer to make themselves look better?
I live in the real world.
What does the boxing commission have anything to do with JFK and 9/11??? man, give it up...
I suppose you think Margarito dominated that Paul Williams fight too, right???
Yeah that formula worked the first two fights didn't it??? It's one thing for someone to come in with a game plan it's another for that someone to follow it thru 12 rounds.
Hater = literally, as in: xcaret irrationally hates Manny Pacquiao, 24/7
Hugger = nuthugger, as in: xcaret irrationally hugs Juan Manuel Marquez' nuts, 24/7
Good use in the sentences for the examples. lol
I honestly don't think Froch is on Hopkins' level. You can't throw a nobody up against a legend. Hopkins' says Chad Dawson doesn't bring in enough fans and money and that's why he doesn't wanna fight him. WHO DA F*CK IS CARL FROCH!?! Hopkins thinks he's gonna bring in more money??? I'm lobbying for a Chad Dawson-Hopkins fight. If Hopkins is callin out nobodies, he might as well call out an under-the-radar good fighter such as Dawson.
I thought that Tarver fought so good in the first fight that he deserves a rematch... SIKE!!! lol
I actually wanna see the fight to get another glimpse of Tarver's fine ass wife!!!