Boxing and lifting weights?

[Elroy1]

Bodybuilders aren't inflexible because of muscle mass. Many bodybuilders have great flexibility. Even when I weighed 250lb I could clasp my hands together over under behind my back. The reason they might not be as fluid is if they try to muscle things instead of learning technique.

Yeah muscle in itself isn't what makes you inflexible or tense.

But the training of lifting weights contributes to joint and muscle tension. This can be alleviated through stretching and mobility exercises but there is always a stiffening effect which is why top amateur and pro boxers use periodization in their routines. They only perform weights in the first phase of their preparation for this reason.

There is a more basic and fundamental reason why weightlifting has a negative effect on boxing physiology though.

Lifting weights develops motor nervous system adaptions that are bad for punching. You don't want to feel contraction of the muscles through any part of the movement except for the final impact and power transfer. Lifting weights changes your neuromuscular system to load your muscles with tension to push through the movement of a punch, slowing you down and reducing your power in a lb for lb sense.

The main reason for weights is for general prep, body strength and injury prevention early on in the preparation for a fight.

Moreover many guys get caught up in trying to simulate the anterior muscles responsible for launching and forcing the punch. In actual fact the posterior chain muscles are what should be prioritised. It is these muscles that you'll be throwing "into", "behind" the punch and also those which will brace the punch on impact for power transfer. The anterior muscles should mainly be adapted for speed.

The notion that building punching power through weight lifting is definitely false. Sure added muscle is added weight which will add power and the said core and posterior muscles certainly help to transfer that power too. But stand in front of a heavy bag and hit it as hard as you can taking note of the strength of contraction of your muscles as you do so. Whether it's a loaded push punch or the best full body snap punch you can execute, you will notice the maximal contraction of your muscles is sharp but very small compared with the very intense contraction of a heavy lift of any sort on any particular muscle. You never NEED to contract your muscles that hard during the hardest punch. In terms of power, lb for lb, you'd get more benefit from practicing on the heavy bag!

[HedonisticFrog]

Moreover many guys get caught up in trying to simulate the anterior muscles responsible for launching and forcing the punch. In actual fact the posterior chain muscles are what should be prioritised. It is these muscles that you'll be throwing "into", "behind" the punch and also those which will brace the punch on impact for power transfer. The anterior muscles should mainly be adapted for speed.

The notion that building punching power through weight lifting is definitely false. Sure added muscle is added weight which will add power and the said core and posterior muscles certainly help to transfer that power too. But stand in front of a heavy bag and hit it as hard as you can taking note of the strength of contraction of your muscles as you do so. Whether it's a loaded push punch or the best full body snap punch you can execute, you will notice the maximal contraction of your muscles is sharp but very small compared with the very intense contraction of a heavy lift of any sort on any particular muscle. You never NEED to contract your muscles that hard during the hardest punch. In terms of power, lb for lb, you'd get more benefit from practicing on the heavy bag!

It doesn't matter that the way you use your muscles during a punch isn't exactly the same way they're used when lifting weights. You're not going to have increased tension in your muscles just from lifting weights if you know proper technique of how to throw a punch. It's the same reason you can strength train and not flex your legs unnecessarily while walking or running.

If the muscles you use to throw a punch are stronger you will be able to generate more momentum by rotating your body faster. In addition to this you have to transfer this momentum into your opponent through your arm. So if your shoulder, arm and forearm are stronger you will be able to transfer more of your momentum.

[Elroy1]

It doesn't matter that the way you use your muscles during a punch isn't exactly the same way they're used when lifting weights. You're not going to have increased tension in your muscles just from lifting weights if you know proper technique of how to throw a punch. It's the same reason you can strength train and not flex your legs unnecessarily while walking or running.

If the muscles you use to throw a punch are stronger you will be able to generate more momentum by rotating your body faster. In addition to this you have to transfer this momentum into your opponent through your arm. So if your shoulder, arm and forearm are stronger you will be able to transfer more of your momentum.

Yes I do agree with you that a stronger arm and shoulder on impact will help to transfer more power. But since these muscles are mainly for delivering the power, I think they are built for this purpose well enough via bag work, push ups, dips etc. I wouldn't personally use very heavy type weights for this purpose.

As for the 2 other areas you mentioned, the foreman and rotational core, yes, they are 2 special areas that definitely contribute to power the stronger they are. You are right there. Remember though on a time/energy basis it is hard to go past the heavy bag for all those things.

I totally agree with your first point, sometimes ppl who lift weights and box try to punch like they lift which they should not.

[New England]

for the begginner who is looking to box, i woudn't recommend it. save your energy for roadwork, gym work, and sparring. you'll be plenty fatigued already.


if you're coming from a heavy weight lifting or bodybuilding background, it may very well hurt you in boxing. you'll be in shape to lift heavy weights, but you'll have a build that you don't want for boxing, and you'll sacrifice conditioning, fluidity, flexiblity, and speed, unless you're a super talented athlete who can build muscle without sacrificing much speed.


for the advanced fighter who is looking to add something extra to his game, i think weights/resistance in the proper context can be beneficial. just make sure you're doing something that will help you box three minute rounds with a minute of rest.


adding weight to your bench press and your squat isn't likely to make you an explicitly better boxer, make you punch harder, etc.

[HedonisticFrog]

Yes I do agree with you that a stronger arm and shoulder on impact will help to transfer more power. But since these muscles are mainly for delivering the power, I think they are built for this purpose well enough via bag work, push ups, dips etc. I wouldn't personally use very heavy type weights for this purpose.

As for the 2 other areas you mentioned, the foreman and rotational core, yes, they are 2 special areas that definitely contribute to power the stronger they are. You are right there. Remember though on a time/energy basis it is hard to go past the heavy bag for all those things.

I totally agree with your first point, sometimes ppl who lift weights and box try to punch like they lift which they should not.

Well it seems like the main thing we disagree on is how effective it is. Also you mention that the muscles you use for transferring power are built up enough from push ups and dips, but that is still basically weight training. The only difference is that you use your body weight instead of a barbell or dumbbells.

The most effective way to build strength is to increase the resistance your muscles have to work against. You can't effectively do this with heavy bag drills or an ever increasing amount of regular pushups. You'll still become stronger up to a point but it's not as effective as either advanced calisthenics such as one armed pushups or heavy bench press.

Obviously you shouldn't neglect cardio and skill development just to get stronger, but it's definitely worthwhile to do.

[johnm is...]

Most fighters weight train. Kettle bell, tire flips, sledge hammer, etc. is all essentially "weight" training.

The running, sparring, mitts, etc. is great for aerobic endurance. But you're not improving the anaerobic endurance that you'll get with some explosive, low rep weight training.

When you think about it, just as much as you need the stamina to make it 6, 8, 10, or 12 rounds, you also need the explosive 3 to 5 second bursts of energy that allow you to take control of smaller portions of the fight. A 3 minute round is really just a session of multiple explosions of a few seconds of energy.

Squats, bench, leg press, dead lift...all good for improving the fast twitch muscle fibers, which helps build the maximum amount of force, in the shortest amount of time, i.e. hard punches that get there faster.

You just have to use the weight correctly. 4-6 reps. With a weight that fatigues the muscles. Maybe 70% of your 1 rep max. You CAN get stronger without getting "bigger".

Also, improving anaerobic endurance also improves aerobic endurance. The same can't be said in reverse.

[them_apples]

Hey guys so I just started an actual boxing routine a few days ago, and i am curious if doing days of lifting will effect my speed and endurance here is my routine. thanks.

days 1,3,5 boxing exercises.jump rope,speed bag,shadow box,heavy bag,burpies,lunge thrust,lateral bound,clapping pushups, shoulder circuit, abs circuit.

day weights 2 back and legs, goblet sqauts jog, sprint, stiff leg deadlifts, squats, back lunges, front lunges, explosive jumps, pullups.

days 4 chest and arms. dumbbell bench press, dumbbell incline press,dumbbell incline flye, dips,dumbbell alternating curls

in my experience weights are ok, especially dead-lifts, squats etc - and even weighted core exsersizes to armor the mid section.

I found it better to lift weights in your off time and focus more on boxing only during training time. Also keep track of your weight as well.

[johnm is...]

Good post, especially the part about a 3 minute round being mini sessions of explosion.

Though I do both lift and box... if you want to punch harder in the fastest time possible... learning the best technique will get you there... You can hit like a truck at 150lbs if you know how to pivot correctly.

100%. There's no doubt about that. I was just talking from a 'strength and conditioning' stand point.

[IboxSouthpaw]

Hey guys so I just started an actual boxing routine a few days ago, and i am curious if doing days of lifting will effect my speed and endurance here is my routine. thanks.

days 1,3,5 boxing exercises.jump rope,speed bag,shadow box,heavy bag,burpies,lunge thrust,lateral bound,clapping pushups, shoulder circuit, abs circuit.

day weights 2 back and legs, goblet sqauts jog, sprint, stiff leg deadlifts, squats, back lunges, front lunges, explosive jumps, pullups.

days 4 chest and arms. dumbbell bench press, dumbbell incline press,dumbbell incline flye, dips,dumbbell alternating curls

Get on the track asap

[Resilient]

The only problem with lifting weights is gaining weight.

If you're a heavyweight there is no reason whatsoever to not lift, the talk of losing flexibility fluidity etc... is broscience.

If you're in the lower weight classes and boiling yourself down to make the weight to be on par or have an advantage in height and reach, lifting weights will just make it harder to make weight in your division, so I wouldn't recommend it.