Floyd vs Manny, a historical perspective.

[Eff Pandas]

Idk. I think when people think of John L more people think of James J Corbett than Jake Kilrain. History isn't fond of losers in sports or much else. I mean you'll still get your paragraph or chapter in the book, but the winner gets his name & picture on the cover.

I think because of Floyd's exceptionalism he's very likely to historically be less connected to Manny than Manny is to him. I suspect many boxing fans in 100 years or longer will be more separated from the Floyd hater talking points while the 50-0 record & the not so competitive W over Manny will rule the day on their rivalry as odd as that may sound to us living in this era. Not to say Manny wasn't a bad mfer in his own right obviously, but history is often unkind to those that come up short on their biggest night even if they didn't come up short very often beyond that.

[Marchegiano]

Idk. I think when people think of John L more people think of James J Corbett than Jake Kilrain. History isn't fond of losers in sports or much else. I mean you'll still get your paragraph or chapter in the book, but the winner gets his name & picture on the cover.

I think because of Floyd's exceptionalism he's very likely to historically be less connected to Manny than Manny is to him. I suspect many boxing fans in 100 years or longer will be more separated from the Floyd hater talking points while the 50-0 record & the not so competitive W over Manny will rule the day on their rivalry as odd as that may sound to us living in this era. Not to say Manny wasn't a bad mfer in his own right obviously, but history is often unkind to those that come up short on their biggest night even if they didn't come up short very often beyond that.

I understand, the following can be taken argumentatively but really I only mean it for clarification. What I mean to say is don't voice me like I'm being snappy or *****y. I'm good, it's a fine point you have, I just feel like I miscommunicated my point:

I didn't ask who'd be brought up most often or who is the true rival. I said you can't speak to Sully without someone bringing up Jake. So, yeah, but Corbett doesn't negate Jake.

It was the most extreme example I could think of. A man remembered for only because his name is tied to a great name. Far less than Manny or Floyd will be for sure.


So while I get you, Corbett is definitely going to be brought up when talking Sullivan, Corbett, like Manny or Floyd, has his own legacy and stands on his own two feet as a fighter to be remembered. Jake, at best, on his own, is an interesting story about a man who never was and fell short on the big stage. He needs Sullivan to be remembered on the level he is.

While Manny and Floyd may not need one another the ties is still there and them being closer only makes that tie stronger.

Jake-John has almost nothing to do with Manny-Floyd except it is a rivalry that has yet to separate itself. The only point there is to show weaker ties from weaker champions have lasted longer. If Jake is the Manny of them then Jake's a really bad Manny.

Conversely, Theo-Euthy is strikingly similar to Floyd-Manny.

Heathen, Arrogant, Boring, Clinical

vs

Entertaining, Humble, Pius, Determined

Totally inseparable. Since like 484BC these two dudes' stories are tied into one. Theo went 1200-0 if you count all the festivals and such. He has every reason to be remembered on his own. 1200-0, champion in boxing, pankration, and wrestling. Olympian discus and runner. From an athletics point of view it would be fine to cover Theo and all his glories or mytho glories at least without mentioning Euthymos at all because being the man in boxing is just one thing Theo did. He was the man in sport period.

Plenty of books written covering him vs Euthy. Not some such his exploits in the other sports, not so much even his unbelievable records. The great rivalry he once had dominates his story today. You could easily write a very nice story about a young man who looked up to Achilles and as a man became the living real Achilles by having mirrored his sporting accomplishments without ever once mentioning Euthy by name and even just glossing over the rivalry by mention without great detail.

No one does, because it's human nature to see the rivalry as the story. The becoming your idol story is decidedly less universally interesting....IMO

[QueensburyRules]

1. Floyd wasn't at his best when he returned in 09. He was past his prime by then. He was in his 30s.
2. MANNY is to blame. Floyd adjusted the offer to give Manny the money he wanted, which would've been record breaking at the time, and was going to immediately wire Manny $20 mil. That's what MANNY wanted. Manny still turned the offer down because he didn't want to be tested for PEDS. Any other athlete on earth and he'd be shamed and ostracized for that. Only racists ism and hatred against Floyd keeps Manny from being properly chastised for that strangely odd and su****ious decision.
And before you say it's opinion, even though it's not, Freddie Roach himself is on camera saying Manny turned the fight down because he didn't want to be tested.

3. The fight happened AFTER Manny finally agreed to testing. Coincidentally AFTER Freddie was talking about seeing weaknesses in Floyd and his legs being shot. It was always manny's fault it didn't happen earlier. He's been strategic about who he fights, when he fights them, and how he fights them. ATG but people blatantly ignore how strategic he was in picking opponents.

- -U guzzlin' TUE dribble ain't cuttin' warm shhh.

TUE tested lower testosterone levels than thanks to a 3 week backdated TUE.

Incontestable not to mention he refused to sign the $5mil penalty for a positive test.

U like U zero, both stained for life in their public shamelessness.

[just the facts]

- -U guzzlin' TUE dribble ain't cuttin' warm shhh.

TUE tested lower testosterone levels than thanks to a 3 week backdated TUE.

Incontestable not to mention he refused to sign the $5mil penalty for a positive test.

U like U zero, both stained for life in their public shamelessness.

Anyone have any idea what this idiot is trying to say?

[just the facts]

Manny Pacquio is a all time great fighter but Floyd Mayweather Jr retired undefeated, made roughly twice as much money, and easily won a h2h matchup and will be remembered as the better fighter.

[Larry the boss]

In 100 years time when people think k of Pac they will think barrera and morales and jmm and bradley

its 2020 and no one literally no one even mentions Bradley, Morales, Barrera or Jmm period

[maguirre]

Don't know why people keep making these threads, especially posters with known biases. They're all predictable just seeing who the poster is.

Can't you just slurp your fighter's jizz without mentioning the rival? Why do you have to downgrade the other to make your idol look good? Can't you just admire your hero on his own merits, instead of insulting the other fighter?

[pasawayako]

people will remember floyd along with menayothin, marciano, calzaghe and other undefeated fighter.

[Larry the boss]

people will remember floyd along with menayothin, marciano, calzaghe and other undefeated fighter.

How many of them were 5 division champions with over 20 champions defeated??? you literally just post random nonsense

[Ritz Kola]

Its obvious Manny and or Arum derailed the fight, how was Floyd supposed to know Manny would walk away because of testing, no other fighter in history would say no fight because of advanced Ped testing.

Then who actually made the fight meaning went to Manny face to face and said lets go, what did Manny actually do himself to make a Mayweather fight, absolutely nothing other than sue them wtf .

Hindsight is 20/20 vision anybody that sits their today and says Floyd stopped that fight form happening in 2010 is a moron. After the BS court case they both started playing games around the fight, but in the beginning it was all Manny-Arums fault why it didnt happen, I dont blame Manny he was a puppet but Arum knew more than anyone Floyd would have killed his goose that laid the golden egg, thats why it didnt happen until Arum had milked Manny out.

All that needed to be said! Clearly you can read and have been following this predicament the way I have.