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in legacy......and now that he lost, i don't know where that puts him?
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No he wasn't. Wlad defended his title against the best available time after time. Wilder often defended his title against unworthy challengers often ranked in the 30s or 40s by boxrec. Wilder only had a few quality title defenses and his title run is very weak next to Wlad's.Comment
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By beating Ortiz and Stiverne?Comment
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Lol what? He's not anywhere near the same stratosphere.Comment
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Wlad never took vol in his entire career.
Don't you think it's unfair to acknowledge his official mandatories as "best available" even though the man is champion by 2000. He could have made a voluntary defense against much better opposition than Derrick Jefferson or Charles Shufford.
Truth is Wlad's career overlaps quite a few great names doesn't it?
In 2001, when Wlad fought Shufford the Ring ratings looked like this:
Lennox Lewis, Champion
Wladimir Klitschko
Mike Tyson
Chris Byrd
Hasim Rahman
Kirk Johnson
Evander Holyfield
John Ruiz
Jameel McCline
Fres Oquendo
David Tua
Outside of fight Byrd for the title he hadn't fought a single top ten defense. Not prior to them being a top ten, not as a title defense, not for title elim. Simply put did not fight a top ten outside of the man he fought to win the title in the first place....unless you acknowledge WBO rankings, then Wlad did fight top tens as he was only handling his mandos of course.
Wilder had not fought a top ten outside of the man he fought for the title or his own ranking body's top ten for a while too....but....let's only downplay Wilder's career because of it. Wlad's forgiven.
Look at that list of names. No one like those names existed in Wilder's whole career. Wlad was a champion while Lennox was champion and Mike Tyson was still an active boxer. His best name on his resume is Povetkin or Haye though....maybe Chagaev.
Corrie Sanders wasn't even a top ten when he KO'd Wlad...well...unless you include official rankings...kinda like Wilder....hmmm.Comment
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Just imagine if Ress would’ve waved the fight after the 4 count in the 12 th . Tyson was paralyzed with his eyes closed I believe that messed with wilder mentally for the rematch .Comment
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Wilder still has a chance to add to his legacy!
Honestly if he would’ve stopped Fury while he was the favorite, no one would care and said it was a lucky punch or that Fury changing trainers was the reason Wilder won!
Now, that Wilder lost in the way he did and with Fury looking the best he’s ever had and him being the number 1 heavyweight in the world and with Wilder being a significant underdog in the trilogy, a win for Wilder now would definitely give him more credibility since his back is against the wall against all odds!
Coming back from crushing defeats and winning against all odds is what boxing is all about and is what makes the heart of a world champion!
Wlad did it
Tyson did it
Holyfield did it
Ali did it
Foreman did it
And so many others in different eras and weight classes!Comment
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I think it's important to add context by looking at what was going on around that time, specifically who the fighters on that list fought instead of Wlad and vice versa (courtesy of Boxrec)
Lennox Lewis
2001: showed up out of shape and was upset by Hasim Rahman, then returns later that year to avenge that loss in dominant fashion.
2002: Wins a long overdue mega-fight against Mike Tyson
2003: Finishes his career with a brutal, tougher-than-expected (and somewhat controversial) stoppage against Wlad's brother Vitali
Verdict: If Lennox doesn't lose against Rahman then perhaps Wlad gets a shot that year. Lewis-Tyson was a dual PPV event and I don't blame Lennox for calling it quits after the war with Vitali. Sometimes the stars just don't align and I think that's what happened with Lennox and Wlad, even though their careers overlapped.
Tyson
Tyson was more of an attraction than a fighter by 2001 and the fight with Lennox was the biggest attraction at the time. If Mike was gonna lose badly at the top level then he wanted to get paid as much as possible for the trouble.
Chris Byrd
You already covered this in your post
Hasim Rahman
Split two fights with Lennox Lewis as stated above in 2001, then lost to Evander Holyfield in 2002. Wlad would eventually stop an old Rahman years later.
Kirk Johnson
Kirk Johnson would have been a better opponent than the guys Wlad fought in 2001, I will give you that. Johnson's opponents were'nt that great either though.
Holyfield
Went 1-1-1 with John Ruiz in 2000-2001, beat Rahman in 2002 and then lost decisively to Chris Byrd and James Toney. I doubt that Wlad would have gotten much credit for beating Holyfield at that time when he was so far past his best.
John Ruiz
Was tied up with Holyfield, then won by DQ over Kirk Johnson before losing his title to Roy Jones Jr. on PPV
Jameel McCline
Wlad stopped him in 2002
Fres Oquendo
Same as Kirk Johnson, I guess Wlad could have fought him but Oquendo's opponents weren't that great either, plus got stopped by David Tua in 2002
David Tua
Lost to Chris Byrd in 2001
In summary, I think the best Wlad could have done in 2001 was to face Fres Oquendo and Kirk Johnson given what everyone else was doing. Those names are better than the guys he fought but it's not like they were huge misses.
Also, I think it's fair to say that Wlad didn't really hit his stride until around 2005, after surviving a tough fight with Sam Peter. After that he was dominant for a decade until running into Tyson Fury in 2015.
As for Haye, Povetkin, and Pulev, they were the top available contenders according to Ring magazine in 2011, 2013 and 2014 respectively. He was never going to fight his brother of course and I believe that he was the best heavyweight of the 2010's.Comment
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