WOW! PBC has burned thorugh 143M dollars, investors lose 27.5% of its value!

[Scipio2009]

The problem is, he's still not picking up any real traction with advertisers and ratings have been mediocre at best.

.... have you actually been watching any of the commercials? Even in this three-month period, the PBC show have gone from featuring only PBC and Corona commercials, to local spots airing during the shows, to this most recent PBC show (Guerrero-Martinez) featuring commercials from Honda and Procter&Gamble (among other smaller companies).

The momentum is clearly building, especially as the PBC showss continue to deliver in that 18-54 demographic that advertisers covet.

[Fetta]

.... have you actually been watching any of the commercials? Even in this three-month period, the PBC show have gone from featuring only PBC and Corona commercials, to local spots airing during the shows, to this most recent PBC show (Guerrero-Martinez) featuring commercials from Honda and Procter&Gamble (among other smaller companies).

The momentum is clearly building, especially as the PBC showss continue to deliver in that 18-54 demographic that advertisers covet.

Yep noticed that too.

Wanted to come on NSB to see if the same ones who cried about no commercials were gonna cry about to many commercials but its to soon for them to flip-flop. Its coming

[Scipio2009]

This 'venture' will not be around for 'years'. Once the investment capital is gone, so is the PBC. I love people who say that you have to invest money to make money. Yes, this is true to an extent. But you do not invest almost half a BILLION dollars without seeing the beginnings of a return. Once the money is gone, even if they have begun to break even they will be dead in the water. Even if they begin to turn a million dollar profit per show, they will dead in the water. Because the investors will eventually expect a return on their investment. At a 1 million profit per show, it would take them over 500 shows to just break even. At 40 shows per year, that is over twelve years to break even!

Good luck with that!

The UFC signed a content deal that got them a $100m per year TV rights fee from Fox.

If Haymon proves that boxing can work on broadcast TV and the advertisers are interested, what's stopping him from securing a similar deal (especially with Haymon delivering more potentials show with far less intrusion from fights on PPV)?

You're missing the forest for the trees; individual shows don't matter as much as you seem to want.

If the plan proves to work, the venture is returning money to investors within the decade; not a bad deal for risking 1% of your company. lol

[Barcham]

The money from local commercial spots goes to the local station affiliate or cable provider, not to the network. When you see local spots on a show, it means the network was unable to sell enough advertising to fill all the available spots in the show. So it is not a good sign, it is actually a bad sign for the program.

[Furn]

I think youve got to remeber boxing has become an elitist sport over the years

Its basically only been on premium cable and ppv at a decent level for years now, so its going to take time for people who didnt previously have access to it to catch on.

Outside the really big names Pac/Floyd or fighters they've fought which get on the news, alot of people have never heard of Thurman, Garcia, Wilder etc let alone seen them. So you cant expect to do big numbers straight up.

[AddiX]

The UFC signed a content deal that got them a $100m per year TV rights fee from Fox.

If Haymon proves that boxing can work on broadcast TV and the advertisers are interested, what's stopping him from securing a similar deal (especially with Haymon delivering more potentials show with far less intrusion from fights on PPV)?

You're missing the forest for the trees; individual shows don't matter as much as you seem to want.

If the plan proves to work, the venture is returning money to investors within the decade; not a bad deal for risking 1% of your company. lol

UFC deal was 100 mill total, not per year.

That was also a deal that was signed at the very peak of UFC popularity. There popularity has dropped dramatically, there coming off there worst year in a long time and I guarantee you they won't get a similar deal to there last one.

Haymon will get his TV deal, and he will still have Showtime as a fall back option which is good for 20 + mill a year, the question is how much $ will he land for his deal from other networks.

[Barcham]

NHL averages less than a 1 for non playoff or winter classic games, so no they don't. MLS averages more than NHL and their ratings have been stagnate for a decade or more. I don't think the EPL averages more than a 1 either. All have deals worth hundreds of millions.


Golf does fine~ tennis does fine~ racing does fine~ mma does ok~ why is boxing the only sport that won't get paid for?

Because with golf, you can follow your favorite golfer in each tournament. Usually keeping up with your fave throughout the entire week. Same thing in Tennis. Auto racing the same thing, you will follow your favorite driver or team each weekend through qualifying and race day. Now, once again, how often does someone's favorite boxer fight in a year? When he has a fight, what exposure does he get other than the fight itself? Can you follow him over his months of training and sparring sessions? Would you even want to?

This is why boxing will never compete with other sports. Fans can never build the intense connection that they can build with their favorite hockey team or baseball team or football team or soccer team or race team. Boxing does not attract the same kind of involvement. Wear a PBC t-shirt on vacation in Europe or Asia and no one will have a clue. Wear a Yankees jersey or a Canadiens sweater and every one will recognize it. Wear a Ferrari team cap and everyone will recognize it. Wear a sweatshirt with 'BRONER' across it and in some countries you will probably be arrested for indecency because they think it says BONER.

I fail to see why some people have so much trouble understanding the limitations inherent in the sport of boxing. It baffles me.

[Scipio2009]

Doesn't matter if they had $40 Trillion. No businessman/investor likes to lose money. Sure they can expect to take some losses in the beginning while building their brand, but once they see consecutive losses over a period of time without the tides reversing, they will eventually pull the plug.

This almost reminds me of Jay Z and Tidal. I don't see how that becomes successful for him, and I don't see PBC becoming successful for Haymon and his investors. He just doesn't have enough stars in his stable to draw massive viewership and fan interest. Signing a bunch of obscure C-level fighters is not a recipe for success in this sport.

A 1% bet to eventually emerge as the market leader in a brand new category, in a segment that tv broadcaster are frantically throwing money into? Are you serious?

Jay-Z and Tidal are a bit different, in that Tidal doesn't have exclusive rights to hardly any of the content that they are marketing (even if their payout is relatively better for the artists); if Tidal was the only a fan could go and listen to an artist's catalogue of music, the conversation would be different.

As things currently stand, the only thing that makes TIDAL different from Spotify or anyone else is that they pay the artists 15% more, a fact that means nothing to most fans who stream music.

[The Gambler1981]

Because with golf, you can follow your favorite golfer in each tournament. Usually keeping up with your fave throughout the entire week. Same thing in Tennis. Auto racing the same thing, you will follow your favorite driver or team each weekend through qualifying and race day. Now, once again, how often does someone's favorite boxer fight in a year? When he has a fight, what exposure does he get other than the fight itself? Can you follow him over his months of training and sparring sessions? Would you even want to?

This is why boxing will never compete with other sports. Fans can never build the intense connection that they can build with their favorite hockey team or baseball team or football team or soccer team or race team. Boxing does not attract the same kind of involvement. Wear a PBC t-shirt on vacation in Europe or Asia and no one will have a clue. Wear a Yankees jersey or a Canadiens sweater and every one will recognize it. Wear a Ferrari team cap and everyone will recognize it. Wear a sweatshirt with 'BRONER' across it and in some countries you will probably be arrested for indecency because they think it says BONER.

I fail to see why some people have so much trouble understanding the limitations inherent in the sport of boxing. It baffles me.

All I see is a naysayer.

Boxing can capture the public in the way few sports events can, it baffles me that you can't see the strengths the sport has when you are on a boxing message board.

I mean it can fail if they don't play their cards right but we are so far off from that.

Did a PBC truck run over your dog or something, I can't fathom the reason you would have so much ill will toward the venture.

[Scipio2009]

You start a business, and spend 200 million. You make back 150 million. The value of the venture is now worth 300 million.

Are you 50 million in the hole or are you 250 million ahead?

Depends on what you need to do at the time; if all of the money made went to paying down that current debt, you're $50m in the hole with a sellable asset worth $300m.

If you needed cash tomorrow (no opportunity to get debt to cover), you might be in a little trouble ; stress sale of assets likely gets you 50 cents on the dollar, but the debt still gets covered with you still making out okay.