Is Froch an ATG

[LacedUp]

Ok lets compare it, Hearns resume:

Leonard - ATG- lose and draw(possibly win) - FOTY and Nomination Of FOTY
Duran - ATG - win - K.O of the year
Hagler - ATG - lose - FOTY
Benitez - HOF - win - nomination of FOTY
Virgil Hill - HOF - win -
Cuevas - HOF - win -
Iran barkley - Borderline HOF - Lose 2x FOTY
Roldan - good - win
Andries - good - win
Muangsurin - good - win
Doug DeWitt - wbo MW champ- win
Eddie Gazo - wba LMW champ- win
Mark Medal - ibf LMW champ- win
Espada - WBA WW champ- win
Bruce curry - WBA SLW champ- win
James Shuler- win
James Kinchen- win

So that stacked resume and acclompisment it's not definitely better than Froch?? care to give us Froch stacked resume?? does he even have a HOF in there? maybe ward but Froch lose right??

Well first and foremost, I don't think I have to defend Froch's resume. It's clearly great. One of the greatest of this era.

With regards to the fighters you mention, where were they in there careers? For example, you mention Duran as an ATG win. Also, you point out that he's had fights with ATGs that he lost, some of which were KO losses with only one draw.

Other than that, you mention guys like Doug Dewitt, Eddie Gazo, Mark Medal (who was KO1d by a guy with only 3 fights) and who's best win is Earl Hargrove who never beat anyone - I mean, you might claim they were WBO this and IBF that (very new titles at the time as well and weren't even picked up by ring, especially wbo) so what does that really mean?

Once again, I'm not claiming Hearns was bad as you seem to imply, I think he was great. I just think Froch's quality in depth can be compared to it.

- Ward - Undisputed SMW champ
- Kessler (twice) 5 time SMW champ
- Bute (undefeated IBF champ)
- Pascal (undefeated no 1 contender and future LHW champ)
- Taylor - Undisputed middleweight champion
- Dirrell (undefeated top contender)
- Arthur Abraham (2 weight world champion)
- Glen Johnson (former light heavy champ, beat some good fighters)
- Robin Reid (should have been IBF supermiddleweight champion, was robbed blind by Sven Ottke)
- Brian Magee (WBA Supermiddleweight champion)
- George Groves *twice (undefeated, beat an olympic champ and is now no 1 for WBC)

Froch doesn't have as many fights as Hearns, but his resume is obviously ridden with pure quality.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Hall of famer but not an ATG

[BennyST]

I can't say he is for other people, but he is in my eyes.

Well your eyes need to get checked pronto. Of course he's not a ****ing ATG!

That is absurdly daft to think so. He's not even the best champion of his division now, let alone of all time.

Sheesh.....this place.

[betmen]

Well first and foremost, I don't think I have to defend Froch's resume. It's clearly great. One of the greatest of this era.

With regards to the fighters you mention, where were they in there careers? For example, you mention Duran as an ATG win. Also, you point out that he's had fights with ATGs that he lost, some of which were KO losses with only one draw.

Other than that, you mention guys like Doug Dewitt, Eddie Gazo, Mark Medal (who was KO1d by a guy with only 3 fights) and who's best win is Earl Hargrove who never beat anyone - I mean, you might claim they were WBO this and IBF that (very new titles at the time as well and weren't even picked up by ring, especially wbo) so what does that really mean?

Once again, I'm not claiming Hearns was bad as you seem to imply, I think he was great. I just think Froch's quality in depth can be compared to it.

- Ward - Undisputed SMW champ
- Kessler (twice) 5 time SMW champ
- Bute (undefeated IBF champ)
- Pascal (undefeated no 1 contender and future LHW champ)
- Taylor - Undisputed middleweight champion
- Dirrell (undefeated top contender)
- Arthur Abraham (2 weight world champion)
- Glen Johnson (former light heavy champ, beat some good fighters)
- Robin Reid (should have been IBF supermiddleweight champion, was robbed blind by Sven Ottke)
- Brian Magee (WBA Supermiddleweight champion)
- George Groves *twice (undefeated, beat an olympic champ and is now no 1 for WBC)

Froch doesn't have as many fights as Hearns, but his resume is obviously ridden with pure quality.

No i do not implies that you claim Hearns resume is bad, i implies that you claim froch resume is as great as Hearns.
and you talk like hearns loses is bad, it was Fight of the year loses. do you think hearns loses to Leonard and hagler in brutal FOTY tarnish his ATG status?? and regarding his win to Duran do you think is bad? before the fight Duran stood toe to toe with Hagler for 15 rounds in FOTY candidate, then Duran still have colorful career beating Iran brakley for MW title in 1989 FOTY 5 years after KOed by hearns, it was clearly an ATG win.

about the name on my list i stacked name in 5 levels : ATG (Hagler, leonard, durans), HOF (Benitez, hill, cuevas), borderline HOF(barkley), good champs at the time, finally title holder and top contender like schuler and kinchen. but they're still great win considering the time hearns fight them. for example when hearns is just 21 years old contender he fight eddie gazzo 30 years old former LMW champ with 58-5 record. and you talk about mark medal lose like you could've fooled me, medal lose in his 4th fight but since then he win all of his fight until callenging carlos santos for his title(another good belt holder in the 80s). dont go to boxrec you'll only got number checking boxrec go to youtube and watch many fight from the past, hear the commentator at that time talk about the fighters resume

Finally about you list, You ad Glen johnson, really?? 41 years old glen johnson is a good win?? Bute, pascal, abraham, kessler, taylor, direll is only good champs (4th on my level), reid, maggee, groves is only in the title holder & top contender level. that leave ward as the best in froch resume a borderline HOF or HOF some may argue, which froch lose.

[LacedUp]

No i do not implies that you claim Hearns resume is bad, i implies that you claim froch resume is as great as Hearns.
and you talk like hearns loses is bad, it was Fight of the year loses. do you think hearns loses to Leonard and hagler in brutal FOTY tarnish his ATG status?? and regarding his win to Duran do you think is bad? before the fight Duran stood toe to toe with Hagler for 15 rounds in FOTY candidate, then Duran still have colorful career beating Iran brakley for MW title in 1989 FOTY 5 years after KOed by hearns, it was clearly an ATG win.

about the name on my list i stacked name in 5 levels : ATG (Hagler, leonard, durans), HOF (Benitez, hill, cuevas), borderline HOF(barkley), good champs at the time, finally title holder and top contender like schuler and kinchen. but they're still great win considering the time hearns fight them. for example when hearns is just 21 years old contender he fight eddie gazzo 30 years old former LMW champ with 58-5 record. and you talk about mark medal lose like you could've fooled me, medal lose in his 4th fight but since then he win all of his fight until callenging carlos santos for his title(another good belt holder in the 80s). dont go to boxrec go to youtube and watch many fight from the past, hear the commentator talk about the fighters, you'll only got number checking boxrec.

Finally about you list, You ad Glen johnson, really?? 41 years old glen johnson is a good win?? Bute, pascal, abraham, kessler, taylor, direll is only good champs (4th on my level), reid, maggee, groves is only in the title holder & top contender level. that leave ward as the best in froch resume a borderline HOF or HOF some may argue, which froch lose.

I didn't even claim Froch's resume was better Just said it wasn't as far fetched to compare the two as was said by you or someone else.

Iran Barkely was literally the only good fighter Duran ever beat after losing to Hearns, and no Barkely is not borderline HOF.

Or please give me the fighters Barkley beat other than Hearns that would support such a ludicrious statement.

Well since you mentioned every single fighter worth anything on Hearns resume, I guess it's fair enough to mention Glen Johnson, no?

If Iran Barkley is borderline HOF how the hell can Ward be a maybe for HOF? Jesus, such drivel. Barkley was good, and his wins over Hearns were awesome, but his resume doesn't have the quality to enter the HOF frame in my opinion.

[betmen]

I didn't even claim Froch's resume was better Just said it wasn't as far fetched to compare the two as was said by you or someone else.

Iran Barkely was literally the only good fighter Duran ever beat after losing to Hearns, and no Barkely is not borderline HOF. That's just insane.

Or please give me the fighters Barkley beat other than Hearns that would support such a ludicrious statement.

Well since you mentioned every single fighter worth anything on Hearns resume, I guess it's fair enough to mention Glen Johnson, no?

If Iran Barkley is borderline HOF how the hell can Ward be a maybe for HOF? Jesus, such drivel.

Who said you claim Froch resume is better? is "As great as" means "better", i dont speak english but i'm sure it doesnt mean that.

Iran barkley as borderline HOF is debatable but if you dont think he is we can put him in the good champs level.

of course you only know fighter i mentioned in my post because you check only it from boxrec and you claim fighter like bute, groves, direll, magee is HOF resume because you knew them, you and i are from this era. like i said dont just check them in the boxrec, go to youtube watch the fights and hear experts from those era talk about fighters resume.

[damit305]

Does Froch crack an ATG top 100 poll? I'd think so!

[LacedUp]

Who said you claim Froch resume is better? is "As great as" means "better", i dont speak english but i'm sure it doesnt mean that.

Iran barkley as borderline HOF is debatable but if you dont think he is we can put him in the good champs level.

of course you only know fighter i mentioned in my post because you check only it from boxrec and you claim fighter like bute, groves, direll, magee is HOF resume because you knew them, you and i are from this era. like i said dont just check them in the boxrec, go to youtube watch the fights and hear experts from those era talk about fighters resume.

Please don't go down this route, you'll look like a fool.

I never claimed any of them were HOF, if I did, please find the quote. Otherwise stop making things up.

[BennyST]

Well first and foremost, I don't think I have to defend Froch's resume. It's clearly great. One of the greatest of this era.

With regards to the fighters you mention, where were they in there careers? For example, you mention Duran as an ATG win. Also, you point out that he's had fights with ATGs that he lost, some of which were KO losses with only one draw.

Other than that, you mention guys like Doug Dewitt, Eddie Gazo, Mark Medal (who was KO1d by a guy with only 3 fights) and who's best win is Earl Hargrove who never beat anyone - I mean, you might claim they were WBO this and IBF that (very new titles at the time as well and weren't even picked up by ring, especially wbo) so what does that really mean?

Once again, I'm not claiming Hearns was bad as you seem to imply, I think he was great. I just think Froch's quality in depth can be compared to it.

- Ward - Undisputed SMW champ
- Kessler (twice) 5 time SMW champ
- Bute (undefeated IBF champ)
- Pascal (undefeated no 1 contender and future LHW champ)
- Taylor - Undisputed middleweight champion
- Dirrell (undefeated top contender)
- Arthur Abraham (2 weight world champion)
- Glen Johnson (former light heavy champ, beat some good fighters)
- Robin Reid (should have been IBF supermiddleweight champion, was robbed blind by Sven Ottke)
- Brian Magee (WBA Supermiddleweight champion)
- George Groves *twice (undefeated, beat an olympic champ and is now no 1 for WBC)

Froch doesn't have as many fights as Hearns, but his resume is obviously ridden with pure quality.

Hold on, hold on, hold on....did I read this right? Did I really just read that Hearns and Froch are comparable ATGs and that their resumes are comparable? Is that actually what I just read?

I think this could take the NSB 'muppet post of the year' award.

Seriously man, on you on ****ing crack? You're comparing a resume across five divisions, with literal top ten ATGs in it, multiple HOFers and legends to Froch, a champion in one division, with maybe 6 paper titlists beaten?

You're listing 41 year old Glen Johnson, 40 year old shot to absolute **** Reid, and an absolute nobody in George Groves...as in literally a nobody...never beaten a champion, never been a champion, even in today's world of fifteen titles per division....why?

Brian Magee? BRIAN MAGEE? You're trying to use Brian Magee as someone worthy to be compared to Tommy Hearns' resume?

What in the world has this place come to?

[BennyST]

By the way, Brian Magee was not the WBA champion. Where in the hell did you hear that? Or did you just make it up? He's never been a champion and isn't remotely championship caliber, even in today's five titles per world.

This is just lunacy.

Contenders, and not even good ones at that, being used as comparisons to Hearns' record.

If you added all the random contenders that Tommy Hearns beat on to his resume, like you're weirdly doing with Froch, you'd have a list the size of Frochs entire resume. As in, every single fight he's ever had.

You're adding in guys who have never won titles, who were hardly even solid top ten fighters, and who were nothing more than just simple domestic level contenders and you're rating them with ATGs, HOFers and world champions of all class across five divisions for Hearns.

Seriously....what in the hell do you think is the response you're going to get? Just use your goddamn brain. Just because you know the names of Groves and Magee does not make them comparable in any way, shape or form to Hearns' resume.

Compare their contenders, then you've got a realistic comparison that makes sense.