Comments Thread For: Ellerbe: Mayweather Will Go Down as Greatest Ever

[Mr. Philadel]

This is even news worthy?

this^^^^^^^^^^

[4Corners]

I dunno. Mayweather suffers from Calzaghe syndrome. That '0' is based on too many fights that didn't happen.

Name Floyd's top 5 wins.

De La Hoya. That's a good one.

Hatton. That's a good one although Hatton moved up a weight class for him.

Corrales. A warrior but a very overrated fighter who was exposed as a bit of a hype job in the fights before his death.

Castillo. Most of his 70-odd fights were against bums. A vastly overrated fighter.

Marquez. Forced up 2 weight classes with no preparation, no fights above 135 before fighting at 147. A mismatch, both stylistically and physically.

Who else? Judah? Please, Kosta Tzyu put that fraud to bed a long, long time ago. Baldomir? Pul-lease.

That's just not P4P greatest material.

Ray Leonard; Duran, Hearns, Hagler - already eclipses Floyd and I've just named only 3 guys, even though he lots to one of them.

Pacquiao; Barrera, Morales, Marquez - all at their prime weights in-or-close-to their primes.

Cotto is a good opponent, the best since De La Hoya. I'm glad he's taking opponent selection more seriously now. I hope it continues but he's got a bit of work to do before even getting close to being under consideration as potential GOAT material.

Maybe Floyd will go down as the richest fighter ever, the best paid fighter, the PPV King. That I have a hard time finding fault with. That's not GOAT. They are two different metrics.

Comparing Mayweather and Calzaghe is a sick joke, no offense. Mayweather is far far far greater than Calzaghe and Marciano, the other 2 fighters with 0's.

Genaro was the lineal SFW champ, had never beaten at that weight class. Corrales was unbeaten and Top 5 P4P when Floyd dominated him, and it's not like Corrlaes only beat bums or something. He beat Garcia, Freitas, Manfredy, Castillo, and Casamayor, and was a 2 weight champ, and lineal LW champ at one point. Castillo was a 2x LW champ, the best LW of his era. Overrated??? He beat Johnston, Bazan, Lazcano, Casamayor, Corrales, and should have a win over Mayweather. Hatton had fought at 147 before and won a title over Luis Collazo, when Collazo was one of the Top WW's, it's not like Collazo was a bum. And Hatton was #8 P4P at the time Floyd beat him, unbeaten. Marquez was bulls**t at that point, but we just saw JMM arguably beat Pac at the same exact weight. Floyd must get some credit for shutting JMM out. De La Hoya was past his prime, but he was still a Top 5 SWW, and the only legit champion there to fight at the time, aside from maybe Cory Spinks.

On top of those wins, Floyd still has wins over Manfredy (#1 SFW contender in the world coming off beating a prime Gatti), Goyo Vargas (Top 10 SFW), Carlos Hernandez (Top 10 SFW), Jesus Chavez (Top 10 SFW), Judah (Top 10 WW), Gatti (Top 2 JWW), Mosley (#1 WW/Top 10 P4P), at those times thats what they were.

Leonard, it's not even close. Floyd could have never had the resume of Leonard. Leonard beat 4 ATG's in Benitez, Hearns, Duran, and Hagler, Floyd could have never touched someone like Ali, Leonard, Robinson, Johnson, etc.

You overrate Pacquiao though by mentioning him with Ray Leonard, because he can't touch Leonard either. And what you fail to mention about Barrera-Marquez-Morales is simple......Pac arguably has never even beaten Marquez, and he only beat Morales after Zahir Raheem beat him handily, which takes away a little from the win. Had Morales bounced back after losing to Raheem and won a fight or two, it'd be different. He beat a Prime Barrera, his greatest wins hands down and it's a damn good one. He beat a past prime-still good Marquez in 08' by SD, most thought Marquez on that fight. And he arguably just lost to Marquez as well at 144.

Pac shouldn't be mtnioned inside the Top 20 GOAT either, not yet. If he beats Mayweather, sure. Same goes for Floyd. If Floyd beats Pacquiao, and/or Sergio at 154-160, he'd enter The Top 20 discussion.

[The Big Dunn]

I get what you are saying but even as a PBF fan there is no way Manny should have accepted a no ppv money deal. I will just take a wait and see approach if he fights Martinez I will actually try to go to that fight to hell with PPV but if its not Martinez or Manny there is a 99% chance I am not going to buy that PPV. Same goes for Manny as well. I like Bradley but not for $60+. If Manny doesn't fight who I want to see him fight then I am not buying his PPV either. Bradley vs Manny is a better fight than PBF vs Cotto IMO.

At 140 I'd agree, not at 147.

For me its simple, I hold people accountable for their actions and hold both to the same standard. If floyd should fight manny or sergio, manny should fight floyd or sergio. Same level, same standard.

[Realizniguhnit]

But for real though. Floyd has not beaten a prime atg. That's his biggest weakness. Skill wise though there's not many that i would bet on beating him.

True, but remember what era Floyd comes from, there really was no big prime atg around at that particular time 03-06 that would give him a shot, Kosta Tszyu was getting old already, De La Hoya and Arum wouldn't give Floyd a shot, Mosley didn't want to fight Floyd when he was in his prime, the only person they were really talking about floyd fighting back in the day was Margarito, turns out he was cheating, and Bob wouldn't let Floyd near Cotto, probably for good reason as he has milked Cotto for every penny since... So while it's true that Floyd really hasn't fought a prime ATG it's not like he didn't attempt too..

[4Corners]

But for real though. Floyd has not beaten a prime atg. That's his biggest weakness. Skill wise though there's not many that i would bet on beating him.

Floyd never had a shot to fight a Prime ATG. Corrales and Castillo are really great fighters, could wind up in the HOF one day, but are not ATG's. Tszyu was past his prime still good in 2004-2005, wouldn't have been prime even if Tszyu had beaten Hatton and then fought Floyd, and Tszyu isn't an ATG. De La Hoya wasn't available for Floyd until 2006-2007. Cotto in 2008 would have been prime, and he may wind up in the HOF one day, but he's not an ATG. Pac wouldn't have been "prime" in 2010-2011 either, and wouldn't be if they figth in 2012-2013, he'll be past his prime-still good.

Mayweather still has a really good resume, not the greatest ever, but he's still around the Top 30 GOAT, along with Pac. If Floyd beats Sergio and/or Pacquiao, along with Cotto-Canelo-Khan, he'd enter the Top 20.

[tredh]

[quote=Big Dunn;12042282]At 140 I'd agree, not at 147.

For me its simple, I hold people accountable for their actions and hold both to the same standard. If floyd should fight manny or sergio, manny should fight floyd or sergio. Same level, same standard.[/quote]

We on the samething with the bold.

[The Big Dunn]

this is what you do when you really want a fight your sig says. are you saying floyd doesnt really want the fight?

also, was floyd selling massive PPV numbers before de la hoya?

if there has ever been a fight that should be split 50-50, its may vs pac.

Shade your argument is fair but its not complete. Floyd didn't sell much at all on ppv when he fought ODH. But he was recognized as the best in the sport. For this fight, Floyd has both, he is selling the most and he is recognized as the better fighter because he will be favored.

Manny would be sacrificng money for the opportunity to beat the better fighter and bigger(slightly) draw. He should take advantage of the opportinity just like floyd did with ODH.

[-PBP-]

Floyd never had a shot to fight a Prime ATG. Corrales and Castillo are really great fighters, could wind up in the HOF one day, but are not ATG's. Tszyu was past his prime still good in 2004-2005, wouldn't have been prime even if Tszyu had beaten Hatton and then fought Floyd, and Tszyu isn't an ATG. De La Hoya wasn't available for Floyd until 2006-2007. Cotto in 2008 would have been prime, and he may wind up in the HOF one day, but he's not an ATG. Pac wouldn't have been "prime" in 2010-2011 either, and wouldn't be if they figth in 2012-2013, he'll be past his prime-still good.

Mayweather still has a really good resume, not the greatest ever, but he's still around the Top 30 GOAT, along with Pac. If Floyd beats Sergio and/or Pacquiao, along with Cotto-Canelo-Khan, he'd enter the Top 20.

Even throwing out the atg label there were still a lot of good names he could have put on his resume. How about the undefeated Paul Williams at 147 coming off a Margarito victory or even Margarito in 07-08 for that matter. At the time those would have been w' s that would boost his resume up. I do agree though that he suffers from that Roy Jones syndrome where its not his fault that bigger fights didn't happen.

[4Corners]

Shade your argument is fair but its not complete. Floyd didn't sell much at all on ppv when he fought ODH. But he was recognized as the best in the sport. For this fight, Floyd has both, he is selling the most and he is recognized as the better fighter because he will be favored.

Manny would be sacrificng money for the opportunity to beat the better fighter and bigger(slightly) draw. He should take advantage of the opportinity just like floyd did with ODH.

What are the most PPV's Oscar sold aside from Floyd-Oscar, 1.4 million with Felix. What are the most Floyd sold aside from that fight, 1.4 million with Mosley......

[trainhard_187]

Greatest ever, come on.. Boxing analyst have been questioning Floyds opponents even before this whole Pac nonsense and when Floyd retires without taking the fight with Pac he'll have a bigger question mark on his resume?