Vitaly and steroids

[TheGreatA]

The guy was only a kid, 23 years old. Also, for about 4 years he was both kickboxing and boxing concurrently. Not an activity of a multi-injured, kicked to pieces hulk, that you seem to be portraying him as..........

Do you never stop to think how silly you sound to normal others, except crazies???

I think it's you who sounds rather silly here.

You admit that Vitali used treatment for injuries suffered during his kickboxing career, yet strongly disagree with the notion that Vitali may have been more injury-prone from having gotten kicked to the legs and the arms for several years before even starting as a pro in boxing.

23 years old is hardly a "kid" either I would say. Many Thai kickboxers finish up their careers in their early 20's with broken down bodies. Obviously Vitali did not take so much damage as he is still going strong at 40 years of age but to discount the possibility that his early kickboxing career may have had an effect on his later injuries (such as the 1996 injury which was directly caused by kickboxing) is absurd.

It doesn't take anything away from the man to state that several injuries may have held Vitali back.

[TheGreatA]

You're talking nonsense as usual. Klitschko is not a muscular marvel. he is long, lean, gawky, and not really athletically built. Wheras known steoid users are muscular, I think they call it ripped, with muscle ridges sharply defined all over theor bodies, especially the upper torso.

Use of PEDs doesn't necessarily mean you're muscular at all. Vitali is certainly more physically imposing than James Toney, but it is Toney who has been caught from steroid use during his pro career (allegedly for injury treatment).

[joseph5620]

Well, steroids don't remove age deterioration, they built muscle, there is a strong resemblence between Hopkins' build and Holyfield's. And Evan Fields" who lived at Holyfield's address and used his phone number, was a long time proven steroid user.

And Hopkins is known to do almost anything in the world to win, not neccessariy fairly, in fact almost certainly not fairly, going by his ring behaviour. Why should his training behaviour be different? He's the sort of fellow of whom anything could be believed-except sportsmanship and truth.

The only "similar" thing about Hopkins and Holyfield is they are both black.Which is why you don't have a problem of accusing them of steroids but not Vitali.

[CHOWWOKKA]

You're talking nonsense as usual. Klitschko is not a muscular marvel. he is long, lean, gawky, and not really athletically built. Wheras known steoid users are muscular, I think they call it ripped, with muscle ridges sharply defined all over theor bodies, especially the upper torso.

Yea! like James Toney and Fernando Vargas

[JAB5239]

Everybody has lost his "credibility" but you. You remind me of the old Irish widdow woman watching her son marching in his army squad, saying..."Thar he goes G-D Bless 'im, the only wan in shtep"........

I have no idea what that is supposed to mean. I guess it's just your way of avoiding the point that you suspect one fighter with no proof but can't admit the possibility of another who does in fact have a history.

[edgarg]

That's an excuse that has been used far too many times to be taken as a fact.

I can accept the possibility that he used it to treat injuries unknowingly, but I also accept the possibility that, much like hundreds of other athletes, he used knowingly and had to make an explanation in order to preserve his credibility under the attack of media which labels PED users as unsportsman-like cheaters.

You're arguing that Klitschko used steroids to heal injuries caused by his kickboxing career but you also argue that Klitschko isn't/hasn't been injury-prone. Which is true?

As far as I'm concerned, when injuries have caused three major incidents during your boxing career (the Olympics, the Byrd fight, the retirement) you can be called injury-prone. He also pulled out of a fight with McCline during his comeback due to back injury. What I'm saying is that he suffered from injuries more than most boxers do which set his career back and may have kept him from reaching even greater heights in the heavyweight division.

The knee injury wasn't major, since he could perform with it, although not at the highest level. As he was World Kick-boxing Champion, witha record of 25-1, and was still very young, we can be more than reasonably sure that he was NOT plagued by injuries during that time, which would prevent him from compiling such a great record by his very young age. Compare that to the muscle bound MMA guys who are champions with records of 5-3 or some such drek. And even allowing it to me "major" just to please you, (because i liked long forgotten Petey Sansol) 3 major injuries in a career lasting well over 20 years is hardly anything. And there are boxers just about every week who suffer rotator cuff tears. It's very common.

He could have returned to the ring after about 18 months but was wrapped up in deep political activities at a very high level. He still is but it took 4 years to get everything in working order. So i still think you are over exaggerating, if not completely wrong.

[Joeyzagz]

You're talking nonsense as usual. Klitschko is not a muscular marvel. he is long, lean, gawky, and not really athletically built. Wheras known steoid users are muscular, I think they call it ripped, with muscle ridges sharply defined all over theor bodies, especially the upper torso.

Gross misconception.

Rafael Palmeiro tested positive for roids in baseball and everyone was shocked because he never looked the part..turned out he was dirty as sin and only 180-200 lbs.


It is a FACT that Vitali tested positive for banned substance. Stop denying reality.

[edgarg]

That isn't proof, it's speculation and a double standard. I personally think he has, but he's refuted these allegations just like Vitaly did. You've applied a double standard my man.

Pray do tell my good fellow, Did he "refute" as Evander Holyfield-or as Evan fields. Are we to infer that he is schitzophrenic, and assumes 2 personalities, neither of which knows the other or what the other is doing, although both are in the same body???Eh??

Do you realise how silly you sound. You're "flogging a dead hoorse"....indeed you are.

[TheGreatA]

The knee injury wasn't major, since he could perform with it, although not at the highest level. As he was World Kick-boxing Champion, witha record of 25-1, and was still very young, we can be more than reasonably sure that he was NOT plagued by injuries during that time, which would prevent him from compiling such a great record by his very young age. Compare that to the muscle bound MMA guys who are champions with records of 5-3 or some such drek. And even allowing it to me "major" just to please you, (because i liked long forgotten Petey Sansol) 3 major injuries in a career lasting well over 20 years is hardly anything. And there are boxers just about every week who suffer rotator cuff tears. It's very common.

He could have returned to the ring after about 18 months but was wrapped up in deep political activities at a very high level. He still is but it took 4 years to get everything in working order. So i still think you are over exaggerating, if not completely wrong.

For Vitali his injuries seem to have happened at the worst times. In comparison to his brother who has gone through his career relatively harmlessly, this lowers his standing. Unlike Vitali, Wladimir went through the Olympics, wasn't injured for Byrd, never had to pull out of a major fight and retire for several years. If not for this, Vitali would likely be rated over Wladimir without questions.

After beating Danny Williams, Vitali suffered a hand injury which led to him post-poning another title defense, then a thigh and eventually a spine injury which required surgery, as well as the near career-ending knee injury. He also post-poned his comeback due to a back injury.

I'm not saying he's broken down physically or anything, but compared to most boxers he has been rather injury-prone to the point where it affected his career.

Anyway, this doesn't seem to be an important enough issue to argue about since we only seem to disagree slightly on the subject.

[JAB5239]

Pray do tell my good fellow, Did he "refute" as Evander Holyfield-or as Evan fields. Are we to infer that he is schitzophrenic, and assumes 2 personalities, neither of which knows the other or what the other is doing, although both are in the same body???Eh??

Do you realise how silly you sound. You're "flogging a dead hoorse"....indeed you are.

We'll be waiting a long time for you to provide any substantial proof or admit there is in fact a reasonable possibility your boy COULD have been cheating, won't we? I won't bother touching on your double standards again since you choose to keep ignoring it.