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Yeah, I'm clearly making excuses for Froch : A guy I've publicly stated my disliking for in the past on multiple occasions.
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Nah, it's not that. Just friendly debate. But I do wish that a couple people here would address the same issues with other fighters like Berto, Donaire, etc - who are in similar situations - and have publicly said that they are for OST, etc.
I'm also fully aware that @jrosales13 is a Cobra fan, and if the shoe was on the other foot, I doubt he would be posting here. Just because you believe Ward is gonna win, doesn't make you a fan.
Also Ward by UD.Comment
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Bringing up Donaire is a perfect example, infact, Clegg and I were discussing him privately a short while ago. As Clegg pointed out....
"Another thing is that Conte is working with Nonito Donaire, who seems to have a size, speed and power advantage over everyone he has fought. I watched his fight with Sydorenko the other day and it was like watching a kid get beaten up by his dad, only the kid was an Olympic medalist and former world champion."
Clearly, we're not "hating on" Andre Ward : We're just calling it as we see it.Comment
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Ok, cool; and your right Donaire may certainly be on something too. We wouldn't know until both got tested.
I have one question to ask you. If Ward was supposedly juicing, what areas of his game would you say are being improved? Because from my perspective I see none.
But having said that I'm gonna do my own little research to see what Ward was like before and after recruiting Conte.Comment
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I think Donaire is just as likely to be using as Ward, but it's Ward who has said he will be having better testing and not followed through with it.
I will be impressed with Berto if he has OST against Ortiz. Him accusing Ortiz after their first fight and then trying to weasel out of the accusation was pretty sad, but he can make up for that by insisting on the tests, passing them and winning the fight. Even if he loses I'd still give him credit for believing in better testing rather than just saying one thing and doing another.Comment
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I don't think any areas of his game have improved dramatically under Conte, but the fact that I can't see progress doesn't instantly rubberstamp the possibility that he's using. (And I'm not saying you implied that, just clarifying before someone misinterprets me.)
Contrary to popular belief, steroids aren't a "miracle drug", in that, once taken, you become a freakish physical specimen capable of superhuman feats of strength and agility. It still takes a ton of hard work and dedication to your craft to achieve results, but there's no doubt that they aide you in attaining those results quicker.
I mean, there were quite a few baseball players who took 'roids and the results weren't instantaneous.Comment
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I think a big, big factor in Ward's favour is that he has already proven himself the best at the Olympics, where testing is very strong. Obviously amateur and professional boxing is different, but he was clean when he was a better amateur than Froch, Kessler, AA etc. so that suggests that he's good enough to be clean and be a better professional than them as well.
I read an interview with James DeGale where he said that when he was an amateur the testers would just randomly visit him for a sample on a regular basis, but since turning pro that hasn't happened at all.
Pretty ridiculous that amateurs who fight for free get tested more than professionals who make millions per fight.Comment
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he's got the acne anywayComment
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Way too early to discredit SOG's W!Comment
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People were saying this about Donaire before he started working with Conte though. He wrecked Darchinyan long before he had Conte in his corner.
As for the criticism with Ward in this thread, I agree. There should have been testing for this fight. It's a shame there isn't. I wonder in the future if all of Conte's fighters will use VADA testing.
VADA's a little different than USADA. In fact, they're probably going to use it for Berto-Ortiz II than USADA. Here's a good article about it:
http://www.maxboxing.com/news/max-bo...d-vada-testingFor this fight, Berto is doing something familiar with a twist. He has asked that he and Ortiz do random drug testing within training camps. Ortiz just went through USADA’s testing program as asked for by Floyd Mayweather in his last fight. Berto has decided to go another route, hoping to opt for Dr. Margaret Goodman’s Voluntary Anti-Doping Agency, should everything fall into place for that organization in time. Berto, polite in his answer, seems to favor VADA because their tests (particularly for testing EPO, a blood-doping agent which boosts your red blood cell count, and synthetic testosterone) will be more extensive and accurate than what USADA is offering. Added to which, from what I understand, VADA is looking to use sponsorship to pay for the testing, which they estimate will cost a fraction of the estimated $90,000 to $100,000 (according to one fighter was recently quoted when inquiring about USADA testing for an upcoming fight). Hopefully with the sponsorship, the cost to the fighter will ultimately be nothing to prove he is clean.
“Yeah, I really want to try and get the new testing done through VADA, Dr. Margaret Goodman’s group,” said Berto. “Just because just knowing…you know USADA is a tremendous organization as well…but just being around Victor and really getting a lot more understanding about the testing and performance drugs that a lot of these people are taking and how there are still ways that even through the USADA system that they can kind of get away with things, especially if you are dealing with a more intelligent drug guy. You know just going with the VADA program, I believe they are going the extra mile. They are being very, very particular in that it’s almost impossible to get away with anything performance-enhancing in your body with the VADA program. So I believe that is the program I want to try to go with.”
From what I understand, there are at least two different approaches VADA will take in its testing. One will be the use of Carbon Isotope Ratio testing which helps detect to a high degree of accuracy whether an athlete is using synthetic testosterone or even adding a boost of it into his system. The other difference is that, for the first time, boxing will save a group implementing the 50% hematocrit rule, effective in detecting EPO use. Only Nordic skiing and cycling use this rule, which states that if an athlete’s hematocrit, (read: red blood cell count) is 50% or higher, he is suspended for two weeks on the spot with an investigation and stiffer penalties possibly to follow. Because of these differences in the protocols, Berto is choosing VADA.
“Exactly,” Berto said when I asked him about the specific tests as reason to use VADA. “That is one of the things that USADA isn’t really doing, with just the fact that VADA is taking an approach that is moving them to the next level. There are drugs that within 24 hours, they are out of your system. But then again, you are still getting the full effect of them, so we are just trying to get sure that we get everything cleared across the board. If it’s the hematocrit, we will be able to detect anything.”
I asked Berto if he chose to test because he is worried about drug use in the sport, because he wanted to prove his work with Conte was clean or because of the education he has received working with the man and his team.
“Everything. Everything,” said Berto joyously. “I believe the work with me and Victor is as clean as possible but just the fact that my knowledge, just being with him this last camp and learning so much about it and learning about how rampant it is in the sport and just knowing for a fact that, ‘Man, damn. I was probably in the ring with guys that were on all types of stuff and I didn’t know it.’ I was just a superior athlete. Just knowing that it was so rampant in the sport, it’s just ridiculous, especially with fights like this where there is so much money and everything else on the line. You want everything to be on the same playing field. So whoever wins is just the better fighter that night.”
Beyond anything, this is about Berto’s safety. It’s not about getting the other guy being at a disadvantage but more about getting all the cards on the table.
“You think of any sport, baseball, basketball, golf tennis, cycling, these guys want to be the best in the world,” said Berto. “They are willing to do whatever it takes to have their body perform at the best of its ability and they feel, ‘Oh. Everybody is doing it so I might as well do it to keep up with everything.’ It’s rampant everywhere but when it comes to this sport, it’s not cycling. It’s not basketball. You’re not just shooting a ball. It’s not tennis or golf. We’re boxing. We’re punishing each other’s bodies. We are trying to knock each other’s heads off. This is dangerous. Like these are life-and-death-type of situations, so we have to try and take precautions to make sure everything is on the same playing field or somebody can be seriously injured or even die.”
Apparently, we are signed contracts away from the fight being on. VADA is still working out administrative things. Who can say if it all comes together? No matter how it goes, Berto knows he has what it takes to get his revenge on Ortiz. At the same time, he understands how fragile and dangerous every moment in boxing is. What will be will be.
tldr; Berto, who is under Conte, wants to use new drug testing company partially owned by Conte (but also by Dr. Marget Goodman) to test which tests for things that USADA doesnt. It's also cheaper too.
Main point: Itd be nice if all Conte fighters did this testing and hopefully it gets involved in the commissions.
The whole problem with these OST talk is this wouldn't be a problem if the commissions had adequate testing, but they don't.Comment
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