Vitali Klitschko vs Joe Louis - Who wins?

[JAB5239]

Again, there is no need for upper body movement.

And as I said in the post above, the argument that his opposition sucks is only gonna get you so far, HE IS DOMINATING THEM REGARDLESS, not edging out close decisions.

Hence why you have to nitpick on the few mistakes he did make to base your points on. In which case I come back and destroy any ATG you have in mind, by pointing out all of their mistakes against smaller, weaker, suckier opposition. And round and round the circle we go.

Of course the is a need for upper body movement. We're talking about one of the hardest and most accurate punchers in history. The caliber of fighter Vitaly has never been in with.

[JAB5239]

How many fights does a guy have to dominate, not just win but DOMINATE to be forgiven for a past fight where he got stopped based on cuts to his face?

Why is Louis vs Schmeling a career defining fight? Because of the historical nature of it (A guy representing **** Germany Vs a Black American)?

Either way, he got knocked out and was lucky that the ****'s allowed Schmelling to go back and fight him again, to get his revenge. Klitschko never got that chance with Lewis, and he has been making up for it ever sense.

Would you agree the Lewis fight was Vitaly's best in spite of losing? Than why not use Louis at his very best when evaluating a fantasy fight?

[JAB5239]

I am ok with people calling me ****** or crazy, I think Joe Louis could win this one.

Good speed really good pop a better boxer, Vitali has power but I don't see him hitting Joe with a lot, and I think Vitali would fight different if Louis nailed him. Joe Louis could box and was athletic.


I don't see how Vit could dictate the fight all 12. Joe was a good boxer and quick as hell and he could crack on a high level.

I can see Joe winning a decision especially if it was an old school championship fight of 15 rounds.

I won't dismiss Vitali as I think he's done basically what he could against who he fought, but I can see Joe giving him a real hard time.


If it went 15, I vote Joe, goes 12, I can see Vit eeking it out or Joe winning a close one.


Both great fighters.

Kind of bitter at Vitali for skipping three years while being an emeritus champ and basically holding the division hostage.

I can agree with this.

[JAB5239]

Context, context, context. And less Legendary Tales please.

Back in those days,the safety rules weren't what they are today. There was no going to the neutral corner during a knockdown. The opponent would just stand over you, two feet away, while the ref was counting. You get up, and you get beat up some more.

This is incorrect. The neutral corner rule was created during for the second Dempsey-Tunney fight. I can't think of a single Louis fight where he was allowed to hover over a fallen opponent and pounce on him as soon as he got off the canvas. Maybe Im wrong, but you would have to show me.

[nomadman]

Wow, I was actually debating...

Is that what you call it?

[Mr. Invincible]

I am ok with people calling me ****** or crazy, I think Joe Louis could win this one.

Good speed really good pop a better boxer, Vitali has power but I don't see him hitting Joe with a lot, and I think Vitali would fight different if Louis nailed him. Joe Louis could box and was athletic.


I don't see how Vit could dictate the fight all 12. Joe was a good boxer and quick as hell and he could crack on a high level.

I can see Joe winning a decision especially if it was an old school championship fight of 15 rounds.

I won't dismiss Vitali as I think he's done basically what he could against who he fought, but I can see Joe giving him a real hard time.


If it went 15, I vote Joe, goes 12, I can see Vit eeking it out or Joe winning a close one.


Both great fighters.

Kind of bitter at Vitali for skipping three years while being an emeritus champ and basically holding the division hostage.

Now that was a good post. Even though I don't think Louis could beat Vitali, at least you gave a reasonable explanation of why you think the way you do. This is perfectly acceptable. A+!!!

[Mr. Invincible]

conn is a bum now? you suck at life...kill yourself. the myth of vitali klitschko being anything more than a perennial contender at best is a result of the weakest heavyweight era of all time.

This is why you are red and will never be green, it's obvious that you have absolutely no boxing knowledge whatsoever. You should go kill yourself........not, what a terrible thing to say, what a complete idiot.

[Mr. Invincible]

Being fair, if you're going to criticize historical analogies, your rebuttal ought to have the right frame of reference. Louis was champion after the neutral corner rules came to being, their graphic illustration first a dramatic factor in Tunney-Dempsey II. Watch Louis-Schmeling II and you'll see Louis head to the neutral when told.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANY5f...eature=related

There is a fair point to be made about how loose referee's were about when the action is halted, but the rules haven't changed much since the 1930s. Glove size and fight length are key differences. The era the fight took place in could be a factor.

Louis beat quality heavyweights of roughly the same size as the Klitschko's. Buddy Baer isn't highly regarded historically but he'd be a revelation in this era and had real skill for a big man (good jab, nice shoulder rolls in defense). Abe Simon is easily a top five contender in 2011 and would be a fiercer challenge for the Klitschko's than anyone either has fought in the last couple years. Vitali is too tough for me to think Louis just warps him but the opposite is just as silly. Louis beat fighters closer to Vitali then the opposite. Vitali has never seen anything remotely on the level of as prime Louis.

I am glad you understand the glove size point I made way back in this thread and that's great. However, to say that Vitali hasn't seen anything like Louis is unfair. Lennox Lewis was one of the best of all time and was way bigger than Joe and had a massive reach and power advantage over Louis.

[ßringer]

Head to head, I think Klitschko knocks Louis out late in the fight. This bias towards older fighters really needs to cease. Just because the older fighter may be more culturally important, publicly acclaimed, and higher ranked historically doesn't instantly equate into a victory over his new school opponet. You can't ignore the overwhelming physical advantages Klitschko has over Louis.

[Mr. Invincible]

People as a whole know so little about boxing and what skills fighters beyond 3 years ago had. They see someone now and think they are the best. Louis would bust up Klitschko in 7 rounds and Vitali would retire, sitting in his corner wondering why he was unable to hit the Brown Bomber squarely.

Wait, are you refering to the Louis who got dropped by bum Jim Braddock or the one who was knocked out by small Max Schmeling. Remember this and it always aplies. A GREAT BIG MAN ALWAYS BEATS A GREAT SMALLER MAN.