Interesting video on drug test issue

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Davis828 is slapping that muppet all over this thread , its entertaining reading the dumbness of the *******s .

[deejd]

First you have to established that Floyd had real intention to fight at 154. If not, then what concession did he give.

Negotiations ******* also needs to be a two way street. You need to have dialogue between both parties if the negotiations to be a two way street and to know if it succeded or failed.

Arum is promoter of both fighters which means that he cannot set a dialogue with himself.. How can there be "open talks" when team Pac had no intention of fighting at 154 in the first place..

You moron, now you want to discuss "why he fought Cotto and not Mosley".
He fought Cotto because Cotto was a top rank fighter. Both fights are viable and would give him credit except that Cotto is a more lucrative opponent compared to Mosley for obvious reason. What does that have to do with what we are arguing??

In any case, you wouldnt give Pac any credit of taking the fight anyway had he agreed to fight Mosley at 140 so your point there is totally moot and lame at the same time.

Roach had stated at numerous sources that Mayweather wanted the fight at '54 with 10 oz. gloves and that they wanted it at '47 with 8 oz. Or is Roach a scumbag like your guy, Arum?

"Arum is promoter of both fighters which means that he cannot set a dialogue with himself.. "

You've got to be kidding. Yes Arum promotes both, he doesn't manage both. Arum is just a middle man. Michael Koncz is Pacquiao's manager. The late Murray Wilson (RIP) was Foreman's manager. Arum conducting "open talks" means both parties were discussing the possibility of a bout.

"You moron, now you want to discuss "why he fought Cotto and not Mosley".

Why am I discussing this with a middle schooler???? Let me break this down in the smallest terms. The reason I made a point of Manny Pacquiao and those two particular fighters, is because that scenario specifically highlights how Pacquiao's team operates in negotiations, especially when it comes to weight. That is how they talk themselves into and out of fights. They tried to do it with Mayweather, it didn't work. Then they tried to tack on the $10 million penalty, extreme failure. How does that relate to my statement about Mosley and Cotto you ask?

They wanted Mosley or Cotto at '43. Mosley said "no way, '47, just like Oscar." Roach said "no, you're better than Oscar." See how he's bullying with weight talks. Cotto says he can't go any lower than '46. Roach then ask '44. Mosley say's he'll go to '43 to fight (not to mention, shows up at Wild Card). Roach brushes him off. Roach is reeling in Cotto in the meantime. They settle on '45. Mosley throws out his last heev to go to '40, a weight class he's never fought at and Roach turns a deaf ear to Mosley, and lands the exact bout he wanted at the ideal weight he wanted.

Mayweather wants the fight at '54, Roach wants '47, Mayweather gave in. "OST is random!?" Says Pacquiao's camp... "UHHH, $10 million penalty even though this has never been done before!" Mayweather accepted right away. Pacquiao bails with all sorts of excuses, then sparred with Clottey.

[deejd]

Davis828 is slapping that muppet all over this thread , its entertaining reading the dumbness of the *******s .

I'm telling you, dude. I have this hopeless feeling that at some point, bricks will comprehend, but then I remember, that bricks... they're.... they're just.... bricks.

[mikemurni]

This has been the main point, from the jump. You bringing in Mosley is a whole different topic. Also, it's not a bail out fight. If that's the case, Clottey was Pacquiao's bail out fight. Let's be honest here, Mayweather agreed to everything Pacquiao wanted. It was Pacquiao who wouldn't agree to random testing, he fleed, he ran, he bailed out.

Since we're talking about Mosley now, because you brought him up, his resume is a lot better at '47 than it is at '54. It also makes no sense seeing that the reason for his return to '47 was to fight Mayweather. That was his whole point for coming back because that particular division was hot. So I'll pull out the violin for your garbage baseless and naive question, 'why didn't he fight Mosley at '54."

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You moron I didnt bring out Mosley to trash him as Floyd's choice in having that as a bail out fight (yes both Clottey and Mosley were bail out fights for the failed negotiations). It was a good choice and you can backtrack all my post if I said it wasn't. That was not my argument at all...

If you were really payin' attention then you would know that the point I was tryin' to make was not whether he chose Mosley as the opponent but why he chose to fight him at WW when you said all along he wanted Pac to fight him at 154. What makes Pac so different with Mosley when both were the top WW's at that point of their careers. Why does he wanna fight Pac at 154, and Mosley at 147?

How can he make a concession for fighting at 147 when he didnt have plans to fight at 154 in the first place.

What did Mayweather do wrong? He requested from the start in December '09, random drug testing. From the jump! Pacquiao said no, then tried to dictate the timing of the test at 30 days, and Mayweather comprised and pitched meeting in the middle. That's fair right? Pacquiao said no, again. Just think to yourself, brick. Why would somebody want to know when a drug test is going to happen?
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If he requested to have the testing be done at 14 days and felt safe about that cutoff, then why backtrack and go back to zero if his purpose for making Pac take the test is to "clean up the sport?" Plus the demand was originated from a malicous accusation that they started. So you see Floyd's intentions were suspect at best.

Its called negotiations, Pac is within his rights to say no considering that a medical program was never instituted as a contract point before. Yes there were cases for Holyfield, etc but even then the procedure on when and how to take the test was never really laid out...

And before you go back about the weight penalty, Pac had earned that right to ask for that insurance for reasons that I already laid out which of course you failed to dispute..

Just think. If somebody who smokes marijuana on a consistent basis is notified by their employer, there will be a drug test administered at some point within the next week, you better believe they're not smoking weed in that time prior to the test. Now if that person is smoking marijuana on a consistent basis and their employer says, over the course of eight weeks, there will be random drug testing, well.... they play it straight and they pass, they want to live life on the edge and test the system, good luck.
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Do I even need to dispute this. Your analogy is as lame as your argument. The problem with that analogy was Pac has never been tested positive before so he was never a steroid user.

If Floyd has made the 147 lb. weight limit every contest he has fought (where Pacquiao wanted the fight), then how can you threaten somebody with a $10 million penalty who has never signed a contractual agreement to fight at '47 and then not made that weight limit?

You're crying, "he didn't make '44 for Marquez so that penalty needed to be in the contract." Well, when he weighed in for the Marquez bout, he was 146, that's a lb. under '47, guy. Pacquiao wanted to fight Mayweather at '47, when has he ever came in over '47? Mayweather just fought Mosley at '47, and he made '47, as usual. But Mayweather didn't cry or complain, he accepted that stipulation. Concession: granted.
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WTF, the penalty clause purpose is not whether he ever came above at 147 or not. The penalty clause is there because Pac's team did not want to be on the receiving end of Floyd's ability to bail out from a provision of an agreement of a signed contract. And they have the right to feel this way for good reasons because it did happen. The high penalty amount was to make sure that Floyd will honor the agreement that he signed. What so freaking hard to understand about that?

You say I backtrack... If you're fast, then you'd understand that I'm going in chronological order. Mayweather wanted '54 first. Pac counters with '47 because he also wants 8 oz. gloves. Mayweather says "OK." Mayweather still hasn't budged on random testing, since he hasn't, let's throw the ultimatum say Pacquiao, "we want a $10 million penalty for every pound over the '47 limit." Mayweather says "OK." Then the scramble for excuses is on. That is how everything unfolded.

The penalty didn't come before the weight discussion, that's where you're getting your argument stumped. You're saying I'm backtracking, when in reality, you're working all over the map, but more importantly, in reverse.You need to know your history before you can move forward, youngster.

Hehehe, how can you be correct with that chronological order when Pac said it himself that he cannot fight above 147 a few hours after the Cotto fight which is November. The negotiations happened in December so your starting point is already flawed right there..

And how the hell did you came up with that type of chronology when all of this terms (purse split, weight, penealty, ring size, glove size) where all discussed initially in close door session away from the media.
So you see, we already caught you on a lie right there..

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The muppet is still losing , come on you can do better than that muppet , let Davis 828 have the double barrells and tell him how Pacroid lied about agreeing so he can duck the testing and fight in house El Cheato , go on muppet let him have it .

[mikemurni]

Roach had stated at numerous sources that Mayweather wanted the fight at '54 with 10 oz. gloves and that they wanted it at '47 with 8 oz. Or is Roach a scumbag like your guy, Arum?

"Arum is promoter of both fighters which means that he cannot set a dialogue with himself.. "

You've got to be kidding. Yes Arum promotes both, he doesn't manage both. Arum is just a middle man. Michael Koncz is Pacquiao's manager. The late Murray Wilson (RIP) was Foreman's manager. Arum conducting "open talks" means both parties were discussing the possibility of a bout.

"You moron, now you want to discuss "why he fought Cotto and not Mosley".

Why am I discussing this with a middle schooler???? Let me break this down in the smallest terms. The reason I made a point of Manny Pacquiao and those two particular fighters, is because that scenario specifically highlights how Pacquiao's team operates in negotiations, especially when it comes to weight. That is how they talk themselves into and out of fights. They tried to do it with Mayweather, it didn't work. Then they tried to tack on the $10 million penalty, extreme failure. How does that relate to my statement about Mosley and Cotto you ask?

They wanted Mosley or Cotto at '43. Mosley said "no way, '47, just like Oscar." Roach said "no, you're better than Oscar." See how he's bullying with weight talks. Cotto says he can't go any lower than '46. Roach then ask '44. Mosley say's he'll go to '43 to fight (not to mention, shows up at Wild Card). Roach brushes him off. Roach is reeling in Cotto in the meantime. They settle on '45. Mosley throws out his last heev to go to '40, a weight class he's never fought at and Roach turns a deaf ear to Mosley, and lands the exact bout he wanted at the ideal weight he wanted.

Mayweather wants the fight at '54, Roach wants '47, Mayweather gave in. "OST is random!?" Says Pacquiao's camp... "UHHH, $10 million penalty even though this has never been done before!" Mayweather accepted right away. Pacquiao bails with all sorts of excuses, then sparred with Clottey.

How many times do I have to tell you that Roach statements differ from interview to interview. He would say one thing now, and then another thing later. The same way as Floyd Sr. and Roger.. The fact that the fight didnt happen should have already given you an hint..And here is news for you, Roach influence as far as choice of Pac's next fights has long been dwindled since his win against Dela Hoya..That final say is now being decided by Arum and Pac's managers, and Pac himself.

How can there be an "open talks" when Arum was only talking to one party.. Arum as a middleman needed to talk to both camps in order to even begin the process of negotiation. If Pac's camp says no from the beginning then what the hell do they need to talk about..

You are an idiot. Pac is taking catchweight fights in 2009 because he had only one fight at 147 at that time. At that was against Dela Hoya who I am sure you agree was dehydrated and shot. He was still unproven at 147 which is the reason why the catchweights are there.

When he fought Hatton, there was no catchweight because they were comfortable that Pac can fight against the elites at Jr. WWs.

In late 2008 and mid-2009 no one would even have thought that he stands a chance against Cotto, Margarito, Mosley and any of the elite WW's even after beating Dela Hoya. In fact, they were already looking at going down to 140.

So how does he manipulate out of fights with Mosley and Cotto when Pac was not even a legit WW fighter at that time..He became a legit WW to the eyes of many and of his handlers after he KO'd Cotto...

If Pac starts demanding catchweights for a WW fight now then you can criticize him all you want.. Simply because he is now a legit WW fighter.

So try again *****...

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You getting better muppet but your spin is getting a bit far fetched , give the story about Manny lying so he can duck the test and fight El Cheato , go on !!

[puga]

You getting better muppet but your spin is getting a bit far fetched , give the story about Manny lying so he can duck the test and fight El Cheato , go on !!

[Reloaded]

Good one Putsa he needs a backup video thats shows how Pacroid is a liar , good move there kid , the muppet will owe you .

[puga]

Good one Putsa he needs a backup video thats shows how Pacroid is a liar , good move there kid , the muppet will owe you .