Has there been another fighter in history...

[JK1700]

So your mind is made up then? There is clearly nothing anyone can tell you in your topic on the matter...

You should have just stated that to begin with. I wouldn't have wasted my time.

Bro, You said that Roach developed his right hand more. But I always though Pacquiao had the right hand, You don't beat guys like Barrera with one hand. I think the "one handed" thing was just an excuse by Roach to explain why Pacquiao didnt beat Marquez the first time, because he expected Pac to do alot better the 2nd time. But it didnt happen...

[Tyson.]

Im sorry but I don't buy that, And if you still believe it then I can link you to a video before the JMM rematch where Roach says "Manny was just a one handed fighter back then, He is more well rounded now with a new right hook called the "Manila Ice". These arent made up, It was the quote right from Roach's mouth. He said Pacquiao would do better in the rematch but it didnt happen. Marquez beat up Pacquiao even worse than the first fight and got robbed.


The "one handed" excuse doesnt fly. I'm sorry.

Whats so bad about losing a close fight to Marquez a 3 weight champion and P4P fighter. Probably the second best countepuncher in the sport after floyd.

JMM was not robbed it was a close fight that could of gone either way. Most people had JMM just sneaking it, so he hardly got robbed.

[Heru]

How can a fighter that won the lineal title in less than 20-25 fights and still in his teens be considered ordinary?

[Tyson.]

How can a fighter that won the lineal title in less than 20-25 fights and still in his teens be considered ordinary?

Floyd fans trying to discredit Pacquiaos achievements.

[HandSpeed303]

How can a fighter that won the lineal title in less than 20-25 fights and still in his teens be considered ordinary?

What the hell do you mean!!!!!!!!

He has loses!!!!

He was KOed before!!!!!!!!!!

He had a draw with JMM!!!!!!!!!

He lost to Erik!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He is the most ordinary fighter there ever was!!!!!!!!!!! Get your boxing knowledge game up son!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now he is ****ing superman!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

























*Sarcasm*

[oaklandstephen]

Ricardo Mayorga
lost 3 out of his first 11 fights.
captured the wba belt from andrew lewis by tko.
unified it with undefeated top p4p rated vernon forest by 3rd round tko (rip).
beat him in the rematch.
won the vacant wbc light middleweight belt by beating michele piccirillo by ud.
he beat fernando vargas as well

[ummeed]

So your mind is made up then? There is clearly nothing anyone can tell you in your topic on the matter...

You should have just stated that to begin with. I wouldn't have wasted my time.

lmao, it's like seeing one of those ads of "housewife discovers a new method of whitening teeth" only to get bombarded with surveys, *******s once you click it...

or one of those fat kids that keeps saying "that doesn't count!" whenever someone beats him.

[Ryn0]

I already explained about B-Hop and Hagler, Bernard lost a 4 round MD and Hagler lost 2 close fights in his opponent's hometown. There's a huge difference between losing a close 4 round fight and being KO'd twice by bums.

I mentioned about another Mexican fighter Cristian Mijares on the 1st page, Like Soto he lost early fights when he was very young and inexperienced. Margarito as we all know cheated, He was never good until he started loading his gloves so let's not even talk about him.

Pacquiao was not poor when he lost to Morales and Marquez (in my opinion he lost) and then shortly after became extroadanary. There's no doubt Pacquiao is a good fighter but I don't buy the idea that you can go from being rocked and unable to KO Oscar Larios to walking through guys like Miguel Cotto. It's just not natural at all, No other fighter has done it.

How can you call him ordinary when he lost to Morales? Morales was still a damn fine fighter even though he wasn't in his prime.

If you can't see the difference in his style from then to now then I don't know what the hell you want people to say? Look at his use of the right hand in the first fight, almost non existant it's like a tap.

Your knowledge obviously doesn't go far back enough if you can't think of any fighter with an ordinary beginning and and extra ordinary end. Sandy Saddler is an ATG featherweight, lost his 2nd fight by KO then a decision loss not long after, he then went on a long run of wins over no notable opposition before losing a three 10 rounders to different fighters. Then he went on an extrodinary run beating top 10 P4P great Willie Pep 3 times only fighter to stop him (i think), stopped Flash Elorde, beat Teddy Davis, moved up in weight and won the Super FW title from Orlando Zulueta those Elorde and Pep are ATG's and those are just the cream of his accomplishments.

Similar stories in Fritzie Zivic and Joey Maxims careers but Fritzie Zivic had ALOT of losses before he became a champion beating Henry Armstrong for the title (who also had a bad start before becoming a legend)

[JK1700]

The losses Pac suffered early in his career were growing pains. It speaks well for a fighter to win under tough circumstances against an elite opponent just as much as it does for him to dominate the guy. And he paid the price for struggling on the scales in his Singsurat loss.

The first Marquez and Morales fights were crucial to his development. As long as you learn from it and improve afterwards, it's good for a fighter to literally be taught a boxing lesson. He learned in those fights left hand bombs will only go so far against world class comp. Pac worked on his boxing more and got better after those fights. And though it was decisive, the first Morales fight was still very close.

And I always say Pac's power is severely overrated. He iced Hatton with the kind of punch that would ice anyone. Those KO's just happen sometimes. It took 9 rounds of battering for Diaz to fall. 8 rounds for Oscar. 12 rounds for Cotto. Pac ain't the murderous power puncher he gets hyped up to be on this forum. Speed kills. He beats these guys because he's quicker. He had a speed advantage as a featherweight. Of course he has one at WW.

I know he was drained for the Singsurat loss but lots of fighters drain theirselves and come down in weight and still manage to do well. Pacquiao might have been drained but if he was then WTF was he doing at the weight? If he knew he couldnt make it then he shouldnt have took the fight. But he did so he took the fight and lost by a brutal KO. Being drained isnt an excuse for being KO'd, He took the fight. Nobody made him get in there.

Of course the Morales and Marquez fights would have made him more determined and hungry but I fail to see how you can go from being bashed around by these guys to stunning guys like Cotto with one punch. And please im tired of the "one handed" excuse, Before the Marquez rematch Roach claimed Pacquiao was "new and improved" and had developed a "Manila Ice" right hook. But nothing happened, He still couldnt beat Marquez decisively. Like I said before, I dont think you can KO guys like Barrera by punching with just one hand. Pacquiao has never exactly been "well rounded" but the one hand thing is just an excuse.

I know he has the speed, But it seems odd that he was rocking Cotto with just one or two shots as he came in. Pacquiao landed everything on Larrios and couldnt knock him out but with Cotto he was hurting him almost everytime he hit him. And this isnt even the most concerning thing, The most suspiscious thing is that he can TAKE punches from these guys. How can you go from being beaten around the ring by Marquez and Morales to walking through Cotto? I know Cotto was damaged goods but he still hit Pacquiao with alot of hard shots and couldnt stop him from coming in.

I find it very hard to believe that Pacquiao managed this naturally.

[Bhopreign]

I'm really surprised it took till the third page for this to come up....

The truth is sometimes patient.